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  1. #161
    Join Date
    Dec. 12, 2005
    Location
    Myrtle Beach, SC
    Posts
    3,119

    Default re:NH

    ok I've refrained from getting into these battles because sometimes I'm afraid that I doing communicate effectively enough.

    When I got my TB 6 years ago you couldn't touch her behind her heartgirth without her flinching and movin away from you. she was OTT, underweight, scared and dumb.

    SO called Traditional training did not a damn thing... I could lunge her and she would still be distracted and crazy (rear try and run me over adn a chain only made it worse) when I tried to groom her or tack her up or ride.

    It wasn't till I started learning to "round pen" or free lounge her that she started to focas on me. Now.. Mir is 17hhs so a 60ft round pen is way to small for comfort for me so we always played in a full size arena. It is amazing the difference that playing makes... she goes and gets out what ever yaya's she needs to and focasa onme we change directions turn towards adn way from come. We play and when she is ready she asks (by body langauge) if she can come to me and I either say yes or no and we go from there. When we are done she lets me do anything and everything and we really enjoy each other company. She is now amazing undersaddle. I would not have been able to do anything with my horse with out the stuff I learned from NHers.

    I think the thing with Parelli that is misunderstood, is that they want you to really learn to ride before you try to compete. They want you to develop quiet hands before you ask your horse to accept contact with a bit. They want you to be able to ask your horse from the ground and from the saddle to move any of their feet anywhere at anytime, and I think it is really sad that we judge these programs based on those who fail to acomplish those goals. And yea... some people who shouldn't pass the levels probably do, but there are a lot of talented horse people out there who utilize these or similar techniques with good results. My horse is a better horse for it and she had a LOT of issues to deal with.



  2. #162
    Join Date
    May. 28, 2003
    Location
    COLORADO!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Posts
    6,084

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Catersun
    I think the thing with Parelli that is misunderstood, is that they want you to really learn to ride before you try to compete. They want you to develop quiet hands before you ask your horse to accept contact with a bit. They want you to be able to ask your horse from the ground and from the saddle to move any of their feet anywhere at anytime, and I think it is really sad that we judge these programs based on those who fail to acomplish those goals. And yea... some people who shouldn't pass the levels probably do, but there are a lot of talented horse people out there who utilize these or similar techniques with good results. My horse is a better horse for it and she had a LOT of issues to deal with.
    Cantersun...I hear ya, but on the same token, how is keeping your butt tense at all times (so tight in fact that you can hold a quarter there and drop it at will...PP words)...supposed to help you develop a horse undersaddle? This just goes against EVERYTHING that makes sense in riding. Granted I am just pulling ONE thing out of a vast list of things that he teaches, but he REALLY lost me on this one.

    ...and what about Linda's "Peddling" in the stirrups??? What possible purpose could that serve outside of wanting to participate in "Parelli" stuff??

    I do get some of the thing PP says, but a lot of what he endorses, particularly for the undersaddle stuff makes NO sense at all if you ever have any hope of doing anything OTHER than Parelli.

    All bias aside
    =*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*
    ~Jilltx~



  3. #163
    Join Date
    Sep. 18, 2005
    Posts
    2,405

    Default

    Catersun....

    You need to become an INCREDIBLE INVISIBLE so I can protect you with my super powers.
    Copyright ©2007-2012, Percheron X
    My creative work may be used on the COTH forum only.



  4. #164
    Join Date
    Jul. 6, 2004
    Location
    East Central Mississippi
    Posts
    1,404

    Default

    I have stayed out of this one. *grin* I clicked on the last page and just wanted to ask....

    "Cantersun...I hear ya, but on the same token, how is keeping your butt tense at all times (so tight in fact that you can hold a quarter there and drop it at will...PP words)..."

    Does he say to keep the butt tense or was that more of an illustration to show the difference between tense and relaxed so people could understand?

    I know I've heard him say to 'smile w/all four cheeks' to get your horse to move (helps the squeeze come from lower on the leg instead of just the knees) and I've heard him say to relax and 'drop the quarter' when you want to stop.

    Works for me.

    Just wondering if you had all the information or if he's changed his mind. sylvia



  5. #165
    Join Date
    Apr. 22, 2003
    Location
    Chesterfield, MO
    Posts
    1,180

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sandy M
    However, I don't doubt that part of the reason she is so successful in "Parelli" is that the horse was 12 years old, solid 1st level/schooling 2nd/pretty much reliable trail horse, able to ground drive, etc , trained by common sense "regular" training, long before she ever started playing Parelli games with him
    Oh, I found this out for myself last month. I attended a Mounted Police Desensitizing Clinic with Atikus, my 13 y/o, classically trained Third Level Danish WB. Now, Atikus has been abused, but no one would ever know it now. Before the abuse he had good, solid training. He's light and soft and really trusts me.

    He was great at the clinic! When the officer was first longing him, he didn't like the fact that Atikus stopped straight when asked to halt. He wanted him to turn into him. I said NO WAY; if I ask a horse to halt I don't want him changing position before his feet stop. He needs to stop on the bend, and keep the same track as the previous stride. Officer scratched his head and concurred that this could be a good thing. Atikus did get upset with a few things in the obstacle course, but listened to me and finally jumped over some barrels (on the end of a leadline); walked over the queen sized mattress; went over the see-saw bridge, etc. Within 30 minutes he did all 8 obstacles with absolutely no tension or tightness.

    Then came the annoyance part of the test. Atikus didn't care at all about balls being bounced off of him; frisbees flying around him; balls being rolled at his feet; silly string being shot off; flares spitting and hissing fire on the ground; and the best, little firecrackers being set off as we walked around the arena. He didn't even get upset with ones as close as 3' away.

    Afterwards everyone asked what level he was, and silly dressage-minded me said Third Level. They were so impressed, and then I realized they thought that was a Parelli level! LOL. In a follow up email, the group organizer said that she could really tell the Parelli trained horses from the others, because they trusted their owners, and looked to them for guidance and help when necessary. So what was Atikus; chopped liver?!?!?!

    Well, I truly don't know if a horse could have been much better than Atikus was. When he got upset, he didn't blow at me, and quickly calmed down and tried again and again to do what I asked. When he finally did the task, he was happy to do it again with calmness and relaxation.

    He's never been "Parelli'd," never had any NH training as far as I know. On the trail ride later that day they were all amazed that I could get this 17hh, 1400 lb horse to stop by just tilting my pelvis back. I also showed how he halted if I dropped my stirrups and "stopped riding the horse." I was in a treeless saddle; in a Bitless Bridle; on a barefoot horse, and he did everything I asked and more for me. How much more "natural" can you get than that?

    All this aside, the group was one of the most friendly, warm and welcoming bunch of people I've met. Unfortunately I think most of them have "drunk the Koolaid," and think that Parelli is the end-all-be-all. The fact that a classically trained dressage horse held his own, and in some cases, surpassed some of the other horses, was just beyond their ken. One girl was just amazed that he could do all of this "never having been Parelli'd!"

    Oh, and I actually had a clue as to how to RIDE! Some did, like my friend Ginger, but most of them were pretty unbalanced in the saddle. It bothers me that that part of the picture isn't mentioned until later on in the Parelli Levels. What good are the Seven Games if you can't sit in the balance with the horse, not get in his way, and use your body as a tool to reshape and guide him?!?!?!

    JMO,
    Barbara www.customstockties.com
    Tulsa-QH; Atikus-Danish Warmblood; Buddy-QH; Winston-Shire; Thomas-Percheron/TB; Mac-Belgian Draft, gone but never forgotten



  6. #166
    Join Date
    Feb. 28, 2001
    Posts
    15,232

    Default

    jilltx Pat does not teach to keep your butt tense! Quite the opposite! He says that is BAD-when we get tense the horse gets tense.

    If this is what people take away from Parelli, no wonder it is so controversial

    As far as peddling at the sitting trot...question: are you familiar with Centered Riding and Sally Swift? She also teaches peddling at the sitting trot.

    And it works like a dream



  7. #167
    Join Date
    Jan. 3, 2006
    Location
    Somewhere cold in Canada
    Posts
    512

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Percheron X
    JOY

    Kohlrabi is the official state vegetable of New Hampshire.

    Look Speed I used C O L O R
    You know I loff you Percheron X
    "Riding: the art of keeping a horse between yourself and the ground."

    ~Horsebiters Clique Founder~Drafties~The A Team~Anti-Kohlrahbi Proliferation Group~Elite Closet Canterer...by proxy~



  8. #168
    Join Date
    Feb. 17, 2004
    Posts
    788

    Talking

    What are our thoughts? Well mine are if people had any thoughts of their own then they would not need NH. You can't learn horse-man-ship in a month...unless you attend 5 NH clinics and buy all of the "essential gear" then and only then can you master horse-man-ship in a month...$10,000,000,000.000 later. But hey if you really think it helps, its your money.



  9. #169
    Join Date
    May. 28, 2003
    Location
    COLORADO!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Posts
    6,084

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LMH
    jilltx Pat does not teach to keep your butt tense! Quite the opposite! He says that is BAD-when we get tense the horse gets tense.

    If this is what people take away from Parelli, no wonder it is so controversial

    As far as peddling at the sitting trot...question: are you familiar with Centered Riding and Sally Swift? She also teaches peddling at the sitting trot.

    And it works like a dream
    That is absolutely NOT what he said at the clinic I went to recently. He wanted everyone to hold a quarter between your cheeks THE ENTIRE TIME YOUR MOUNTED. According to him at this clinic the only time you should NOT keep them tense is if you're standing around, not wanting any movement.

    Everyone in my group heard it the same way. Perhaps he just wasn't speaking very clearly that day, but it is exactly what he said.

    As far as the other suggestions (peddling) perhaps this is why its better to take lessons on an individual basis for clarification, and not from tapes and clinic en mass where you can't ask for clarification. :wingrin:
    =*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*
    ~Jilltx~



  10. #170
    Join Date
    Feb. 28, 2001
    Posts
    15,232

    Default

    HOW ODD! I have seen him on RFD and through Savvy Club DVDs and he teaches what my version was!

    So strange!



  11. #171
    Join Date
    Sep. 14, 2005
    Posts
    1,970

    Default

    Rt66Kix I loff the name Atikus.
    "Wost Case Ontario..."



  12. #172
    Join Date
    May. 28, 2003
    Location
    COLORADO!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Posts
    6,084

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LMH
    HOW ODD! I have seen him on RFD and through Savvy Club DVDs and he teaches what my version was!

    So strange!
    I had to ask around to make sure *I* heard him correctly, but everyone in my immediate section said, "yup. That's what we heard too and it made no sense to us either". Go figure.
    =*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*
    ~Jilltx~



  13. #173
    Join Date
    Aug. 30, 2005
    Location
    Up and down the west coast!
    Posts
    3,887

    Default

    OK I HAVE to ask.

    WHAT is "peddling" at the sitting trot?

    I have this image in my head of someone jogging along on their horse with one of those boxes chained to the neck full of cigarettes and candy...

    Or are you talking about pedaling like a bike?

    *seriously confused*



  14. #174
    Join Date
    May. 28, 2003
    Location
    COLORADO!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Posts
    6,084

    Default



    Yes...PEDALING...not peddling.

    Just like pedaling on a bike. Left ankle bends, toe points down, heel comes up then repeats the cycle. Alternating between right and left legs.
    =*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*
    ~Jilltx~



  15. #175
    Join Date
    Apr. 22, 2003
    Location
    Chesterfield, MO
    Posts
    1,180

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by equusrocks
    Rt66Kix I loff the name Atikus.
    Thanks! That's his registered name; I didn't name him that. But his FULL name, according to me, is Sir Atikus the Beauteous! And that he is.

    http://community.webshots.com/photo/...41571637WebUPd
    Barbara www.customstockties.com
    Tulsa-QH; Atikus-Danish Warmblood; Buddy-QH; Winston-Shire; Thomas-Percheron/TB; Mac-Belgian Draft, gone but never forgotten



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