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  1. #1
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    Default Florestan I???

    What is his frozen like? I am assuming it is not that great because I don't hear of many foals by him over here? What kind of mare does he need? I am assuming a mare with blood and a good hindleg, as I have seen some really large, heavy types that are a bit slow behind.
    Thanks!
    Kyla
    www.svhanoverians.com

    "Simple: Breeding,Training, Riding". Wolfram Wittig.



  2. #2
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    I bought semen last year and it looked really good (under the microscope). I did not get a pregnancy but that wasn't due to the semen quality but instead due to the fact that I took my chances with a wonderful but old mare. I have a couple of swimmers left and have given up the dream of having a foal out of the old mare and will try my younger confirmed broodie!
    Yes, on the blood! Florestan is known to pass on his very mellow temperament, so usually crosses better with a mare with TB blood up close!
    Hoppe, Hoppe, Reiter...
    Wenn er faellt dann schreit er...

    Quote Originally Posted by mbm View Post
    forward is like love - you can never have enough



  3. #3

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    How would he do on a Sinatra Song filly? Sinatra Song/Rotspon/Davignon/Matcho Technically 23% TB.



  4. #4
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    Just by looking at those bloodlines, without knowing your mare, I would say that has the potential for a great match!
    Hoppe, Hoppe, Reiter...
    Wenn er faellt dann schreit er...

    Quote Originally Posted by mbm View Post
    forward is like love - you can never have enough



  5. #5
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    Lucy Meyer has an awesome Florestan filly and I don't believe that the mare had much blood up close.

    I've got a colt by Neostan (Florestan x Debutant) out of a older Trakehner mare. He's lovely, an awesome mover and elegant (and he's going to be TALL, but not an elephant).

    Canaan Ranch used to stand a Florestan son, Flavigny (Florestan x Lanthan).

    I'm not sure how much blood is really necessary to produce outstanding offspring.
    Ronda
    www.risingstarfarm.net
    Standing Abrikos, Cartier R, Cielo B, Ciroc, Deja Blue, Diabolo d'Esquelmes, Esteban, Figaro B, Jus d'O, Kinnaras, Valentino Z

    Become a fan on FB - Rising Star Farm



  6. #6
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    Default

    Hmm sounds interesting. I wonder why he isnt used so much here? Kind of a Donnerhall type horse and yet I barely see any frozen foals from him. We have two Florestans at our barn. One is actually from Florestan II but both are WAY too huge and heavy for my taste, definately not really "ladies horses" though I have no idea of the damline.

    The mare I have in mind for him is just 16hh. by Longchamp( Lauries xx) and out of an very linebred Absatz mare.....very pretty, small, compact and typey.
    www.svhanoverians.com

    "Simple: Breeding,Training, Riding". Wolfram Wittig.



  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by risingstarfarm View Post
    I'm not sure how much blood is really necessary to produce outstanding offspring.
    I'm sure those babies are very nice, but I was talking about performance for the higher levels and Florestan offspring has been known to need a little infusion of blood in many cases. He's an older stallion with tons of babies out there, so it's certainly easy enough to see trends and make generalizations. That doesn't mean every foal out of a mellow mare will be a dead head!

    Donella, I think Florestan is just not as well known over here. He's Westphalian instead of one of the more common registries (Hanoverian, Oldenburg, Dutch). People are usually familiar with stallions like Donnerhall for example, but ask them who Florestan is and you get blank looks! Not so in Germany of course!
    Hoppe, Hoppe, Reiter...
    Wenn er faellt dann schreit er...

    Quote Originally Posted by mbm View Post
    forward is like love - you can never have enough



  8. #8
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    Default

    Donella, I think Florestan is just not as well known over here. He's Westphalian instead of one of the more common registries (Hanoverian, Oldenburg, Dutch). People are usually familiar with stallions like Donnerhall for example, but ask them who Florestan is and you get blank looks! Not so in Germany of course!

    Wow, I would be very concerned if any sport horse breeder in any country in the world didn't know who Florestan was. Yikes.
    www.svhanoverians.com

    "Simple: Breeding,Training, Riding". Wolfram Wittig.



  9. #9
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    I have a Florestan filly (Ok here I am just praying) coming from my GP mare in 2009. She was in foal on 1/2 dose, first try!!!! My vet said the semen was excellent.

    My mares video is here if anyone wants to see the type I bred to Florestan.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hA4r_eykLs8

    I am very excited about this match. Only time will tell.



  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reiter View Post
    Donella, I think Florestan is just not as well known over here. He's Westphalian instead of one of the more common registries (Hanoverian, Oldenburg, Dutch). People are usually familiar with stallions like Donnerhall for example, but ask them who Florestan is and you get blank looks! Not so in Germany of course!
    Seriously??????

    Bellfleur, Gorgeous mare!
    Ronda
    www.risingstarfarm.net
    Standing Abrikos, Cartier R, Cielo B, Ciroc, Deja Blue, Diabolo d'Esquelmes, Esteban, Figaro B, Jus d'O, Kinnaras, Valentino Z

    Become a fan on FB - Rising Star Farm



  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donella View Post
    Donella, I think Florestan is just not as well known over here. He's Westphalian instead of one of the more common registries (Hanoverian, Oldenburg, Dutch). People are usually familiar with stallions like Donnerhall for example, but ask them who Florestan is and you get blank looks! Not so in Germany of course!

    Wow, I would be very concerned if any sport horse breeder in any country in the world didn't know who Florestan was. Yikes.
    No, I wasn't talking specifically about breeders. Most breeders breed to sell the offspring and it is much easier to sell a foal that has name recognition. The general horse person/rider does not know who Florestan is. Ask a couple of people at the next dressage show you go to and see for yourself!
    The foal I'm trying to breed (if I'm successful) would not be for sale but my next dressage horse. Were I breeding to sell I would probably use a different stallion! JME
    Last edited by Reiter; Dec. 23, 2008 at 12:10 PM.
    Hoppe, Hoppe, Reiter...
    Wenn er faellt dann schreit er...

    Quote Originally Posted by mbm View Post
    forward is like love - you can never have enough



  12. #12
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    Bellefleur, that’s a gorgeous mare! I’m excited as she reminds me a lot of a Warkant mare that I’m planning on breeding to Fidertanz this spring (also a GP mare). My mare is part TB, so I’m not worried about substance and she has some blood. Good luck and I can’t wait to see what you produce out of that cross.

    Reiter, I tend to agree with you on Florestan I. It seems that although most breeders certainly know who he is (having produced stallions such as Florencio, Fidermark and French Kiss among others), there are not as many riders in the US that are familiar with his name, IMO. His FN is very good and (if I remember correctly) he has produced over 20 approved sons and over 40 States Premium daughters. Not bad!!



  13. #13
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    Awesome mare Bellfleur, should be a fantastic cross!

    Well, if the rider doesn't know who Florestan is, I doubt they know much about bloodlines at all. If the person is that uninformed, oh well. It still doesn't make sense why there are not more Florestans around here, via frozen.

    He actually has 75 approved sons and almost 200 states premium daughters.

    I actually saw him a few months ago at the State stud farm in Warendorf. He was so grumpy lol, but amazingly refined. I had always thought he was so big, considering what he tends to produce.
    www.svhanoverians.com

    "Simple: Breeding,Training, Riding". Wolfram Wittig.



  14. #14
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    YIKES, thanks Donella! Now I'm even more determined. I guess I had pretty old stats.



  15. #15
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    Hehe, well its easy to get mixed up, depending on how old the source is ect ect. I was just browsing his profile from the state stud.

    Apparently he wasn't even offered via frozen up until about six years ago...maybe this has something to do with it?

    Decisions, decisions lol
    www.svhanoverians.com

    "Simple: Breeding,Training, Riding". Wolfram Wittig.



  16. #16
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    Thanks for the compliments on my mare. She so far has produced really well.

    I am really excited about this Florestan cross. She has a super active hindleg and a bit of a spicy temperament.



  17. #17
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    All this talk about Florestan! Fess up there girls... Where did you get his frozen, was it good post thaw, is he EVA negative?. Oh and Bellfleur who's your vet! ( I don't think your all that far away!) I would love to get ahold of his swimmers and put him to my fantastic TB mare...

    Lisa



  18. #18
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    Default

    I agree with Reiter, I think most breeders are very aware of him, but most riders don't really follow bloodlines. I know of ONE breeder out here who produced a Florestan offspring (and Reiter and I are both in the same geographic area, and there are quite a few breeders in the same area), and the resulting filly looks like she'll be pretty sporty, she's only coming one, so time will tell. I've seen a few of his 2nd generation out (by French Kiss), and they were also light and sporty (and nice movers), but both were also out of lighter boned mares (one out of a tbred, and she was actually TOO light in the bone).

    Another reason you don't run into as many is he is frozen - and for most breeders who are going to go through that extra cost and work - they are going to use the "hot topic of the day" because it is an easier sell. Too bad, because Florestan throws a good mind.
    www.MysticOakRanch.com Friesian/Warmblood Crosses, the Ultimate Sporthorse
    Director, WTF Registry



  19. #19
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    I can't imagine that many serious US riders who know who Donnerhall is don't know who Florestan is. I mean, Floriano, people!



  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arathita View Post
    I can't imagine that many serious US riders who know who Donnerhall is don't know who Florestan is. I mean, Floriano, people!

    I know a lot of serious riders, SERIOUS trainers, who don't pay a lot of attention to bloodlines and breeding. They may know the lines of a specific horse because they've been working with that horse quite a while, but until you play the breeding game for a while, bloodlines aren't all that relevant. A knowledgeable RIDER looks at different things than a BREEDER looks at. Gaits, mind, and to a point, conformation matter much more than bloodlines.

    I've heard FEI trainers (people with multiple horses at FEI, showing up in USDF year end results regularly, participating at the international competition levels) who make comments like "I ride the horse, not it's breeding", and "A good horse is all that matters" and "The brand, the color, the sire are irrelvant, a good horse is a good horse". As a breeder, I've asked people at shows what their horse's lines were and more often than not, all they know is sire And that is in dressage - in jumpers, they may not even know that We breeders are in a different world than are most competitors

    Have you read some of the posts about breeders losing track of their offspring because the owner changes the horse's name and doesn't even list the breeding? It is pretty common

    By the way, I do think, when you see buyers looking at young horses, they've done more research on bloodlines, since it is so much harder to assess anything in a young horse. You can't get on and push them and see how they react. But when you get into markets like California and parts of the East Coast, more buyers want horses that are ready to ride (probably has something to do with the crazy cost of boarding), and as a result, they are much more focused on the individual horse, not the bloodlines. Another thing to realize, is in-hand classes and competitions are TINY out here on the West Coast. People buy to ride, so again, bloodlines become less important.

    As someone who both breeds and competes, I use to be surprised by this, but now I've just realized it is a fact of life, and it actually makes sense. Interesting side note - Practical Horseman had an article about buy or breed, and pointed out there are some really good buys for talented horses when you step outside of the normal brand and brand name

    Having said all that, I still think Florestan is a fabulous stallion - but not sure how hard it is to get hold of his semen. Might consider a 2nd generation - I've sure liked some of those Frenchy babies!
    www.MysticOakRanch.com Friesian/Warmblood Crosses, the Ultimate Sporthorse
    Director, WTF Registry



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