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Spin of spin: SubQ fluids? Like a drive-through?

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  • Original Poster

    #21
    Good to know about various kinds of fluids. Does the stuff with the wrong pH sting? That would suck.... especially because the human being (perpetrator) probably said "Oh, kitteh it's not that bad... man up." But it *was* That Bad! People are liars. Cats are not.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat

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    • #22
      Thomas is on Lactated Ringers - I get six bags for $20 and a bag lasts a week (he gets them daily). The lines and needles I order from medvet online and a box of 100 needles is $5.95 and the lines are $1.10 apiece.

      I always order enough lines and needles for several months at one time.

      I started out using 18 gauge because thats what the vet gave me. Thomas did not approve and started trying to bite me when I stuck him with the needle so I ordered Terumo 21 gauge. Love them! He doesn't seem to mind at all, so needless to say, that's what I kept using.

      I order the 10 drip lines with a port on them so I can give him the injectable b12 at the same time he gets his fluids. Less shots, less pills, easier for both of us. I have heard that B multi vitamins sting when going in, so I don't let the vet pre-add them to the bag.

      Warming the fluids helped alot too - he likes them warmed regardless of the season so I put the bag in a sink of hot water for about 10 mins.

      I got one of those over the door hangers so I could give him his fluids where he was most comfortable. He likes my bed so that's where he gets them.

      I don't know if your cat likes treats but I started giving him a treat right afterwards and now he associates fluids with treats and comes running when he sees the fluid bag come out.

      Since he has to have I'm glad it's something he doesn't mind. lol

      Plus the all natural (hah!) Temptations are bigger than the regular ones and I can break them in half and put his pepcid in it. He never knows he's getting his meds and just thinks he gets lots of treats.

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      • #23
        Thomas sounds like he is getting absolutely primo care! What a lucky kitty!

        And I did know all that about the fluids! Thanks! I sort of figured fluid is fluid so very good to know. Mine don't mind the LR but just curious about the others.

        And yes, my little girl, who I had 17 years, had been feral and was always kind of wench like during the time I had her (but absolutely adored one of my male cats, who also died of CRF). I was dreading the whole subq thing with her as even cutting her toe nails could be exciting (actually she'd just yowl if you touched her paw and of course her boyfriend would come running and I 'd have to keep him out of the way. I thought it was sweet that he was coming to rescue her from danger, but one night when I couldn't keep him back i discovered that actually he was NOT coming to rescue her but to mount her...ah, true love. But i digress...).

        When doing the subq with her she was wonderful, sweet. Would sit on my lap and let me stick her and run the water. Did not complain. Would still sit when we were done. I hate CRF.

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        • #24
          Originally posted by mvp View Post
          Good to know about various kinds of fluids. Does the stuff with the wrong pH sting? That would suck.... especially because the human being (perpetrator) probably said "Oh, kitteh it's not that bad... man up." But it *was* That Bad! People are liars. Cats are not.
          There is no "wrong" pH, its either 6.6 or 7.4, its more dependent on the buffers. I dont think the "sting"has as much to do with the pH as it does the buffer used. Some react more to the gluconate and some react more to the lactate. Most suggest starting with the Lactated Ringers as they are the cheapest, and if the kitty objects or the calcium is high to move to something like PLA or Normosol (or others with the same electrolyte balance but marketed by a different company).

          Regardless which one you use, they all provide the same end result

          PS, you should always change the needle every time, change the line once every 2 weeks at minimum and the bag should be tossed after 4 weeks maximum to prevent bacterial growth. As its just going SQ its not the end of the world if these arent followed, but its considered good practice

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          • #25
            I thought it was sweet that he was coming to rescue her from danger, but one night when I couldn't keep him back i discovered that actually he was NOT coming to rescue her but to mount her...ah, true love. But i digress...).

            I'm sorry, but I had to laugh at that one.

            She sounds like she was a wonderful companion, and quite tolerant if she put up with Romeo for so long. lol 17 years is a long time! I adopted Thomas when he was 4 and he's 13 now with CRF so..... But you never know. One day at a time, and regardless of his blood work, you would never know there was anything wrong with him to look at him.

            He eats good, drinks, pees and poops so I don't think he's suffering. He likes the fluids and luckily most meds are hidden in treats so he's making out ok.

            I'm sorry you lost your girl - their lives are so much shorter than ours and we lose them way too soon.

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            • #26
              My Luna didn't mind the subQ fluids a bit. The trick is to have everything you need set up before you start. When you're ready, just sit with the kitty on your lap and stick the needle in. Luna was far worse about getting the oral meds she had to take.

              StG

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              • #27
                A crazy cat lady once told me that cats don't mind shots much because they're always getting scratched and clawed by other cats anyway. Her own theory but in my experience cats are pretty good about needles.
                “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.” Stephen R. Covey

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                • #28
                  Some cats are really good for the fluids, some object a little more. There's one that I handle frequently for a vet clinic that he is usually good for the first minute and then turns into Catzilla as he perks up a bit. Honestly, I just end up scruffing him lightly or distracting him with his delicious wet cat food until I get his 100 ml in and there we go.

                  It's a good skill for feline people to have and doing it at home makes it far more affordable than some clients that bring kitty in frequently for $ recharge a few times a week.
                  Semi Feral

                  Comment

                  • Original Poster

                    #29
                    Originally posted by SquishTheBunny View Post

                    PS, you should always change the needle every time, change the line once every 2 weeks at minimum and the bag should be tossed after 4 weeks maximum to prevent bacterial growth. As its just going SQ its not the end of the world if these arent followed, but its considered good practice
                    The First World-ness of this whole conversation just struck me. There are people right now who would get worse medical care than some cats with warmed SubQ fluids.

                    And that Thomas cat. What was wrong with him that he needed fluids every day? Geez. Oh, and did he not bother to drink himself? I mean, why get your tongue tired when someone can help you out.
                    The armchair saddler
                    Politically Pro-Cat

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      Originally posted by mvp View Post
                      The First World-ness of this whole conversation just struck me. There are people right now who would get worse medical care than some cats with warmed SubQ fluids.

                      And that Thomas cat. What was wrong with him that he needed fluids every day? Geez. Oh, and did he not bother to drink himself? I mean, why get your tongue tired when someone can help you out.

                      No kidding!!

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        Yeah, First World (although right here in our own US of A there are plenty who do not have access to decent health care or living standards (visit some of our reservations sometime...). I will say,having been in Kenya, if I had anything like malaria, I would want to be treated there, where they know exactly what to do!

                        My grandfather and his family were up in the boonies of Canada fishing, and he stepped on a rusty nail. Of course, all the medical books say "GET TO AN MD, ANTIBIOTICS", all that, except they were way up there with Native guides, three days and two nights from a whistle stop where the train got them. His guides had him cram a coffee bean up the wound and walk on it. Seemed pretty awful but when they pulled the bean out, all the pus came out with it as the wound had been able to drain. He was fine. I''m not saying at all that First World medicine isn't awesome and that most of us are really really frigging lucky to have access to it, but sometimes other traditions have things to offer too!

                        I feel very lucky and blessed that I do have health care and that I can provide for my animals. Certainly cannot say that "price is no object - HARDLY!!" but can get them basic health care, vet appts, etc. And make that a priority. And it makes is so much easier to think I have done every thing I can do (not necessarily that can be done, but that I can and am willing do). My mom, caring for a 23+yo donkey, gives her (the donkey) four soaked pellet meals a day, with various additions, sometimes supplements, medications. And baths and soakings and handwalks - am sure miss Indy (donkey) gets better care than many people (and its great for my mom )

                        As far as Thomas (love that kitty name!) and daily subq - as I understand it at a certain point they just can't drink enough. The kidneys just don't work so well, and subq really helps with hydration and keeps them so much more comfortable. My girl was on daily subq for quite a while.

                        Comment

                        • Original Poster

                          #32
                          ^^^

                          The coffee bean/puss/wound story is so bada$$! Thanks for that.

                          So.... a cat can't drink enough to keep up with failing kidneys. But they can pee enough if you stuff fluids in somehow?

                          And how come injected fluids goes to the guy for the Stopped Up cat, rather than all coming out as pee?
                          The armchair saddler
                          Politically Pro-Cat

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            Sooooo jealous of all of you that have cooperative kitties!

                            My *personal* cat is IMPOSSIBLE to give SQ fluids to (and my DH is a vet too, so I have extremely qualified help - LOL). We tried, no restraint, tuna/treats while giving SQ fluids, little restraint, "purrito" (love that term BTW) and he is awful. Yowls, bites wiggles, kicks, screams - totally freaked out our other cat (ha). We were trying to give him SQ fluids once or twice a week for his CRF.

                            So, what we do instead is give him "soup" twice a day - part of a can of cat food (Friskies - of course he wouldn't eat any of the renal diets) mixed with water (way more water than food). We give it to him in the kitties bathroom and close the door so the other cat doesn't bother him. He gained weight and is doing fine....

                            I'm always teaching people how to do SQ fluids on their cat, so of course I would have the impossible cat.....LOL

                            Comment

                            • Original Poster

                              #34
                              animal doc.... why don't you give that cat some Ace or Dormosodan or the equivalent. I know you can't hog-tie a cat, but as a horser and a DVM, it seems to me that you have toolz that the rest of us don't.

                              Or have you been brought to your knees by a cat? If so, no shame. Old Lady Cat used to WIN the battle of pilling. And I had no qualms about using techniques on her that worked on 1,000#-ers. The 14# cat kicked my butt six ways to Sunday.
                              The armchair saddler
                              Politically Pro-Cat

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                Originally posted by mvp View Post
                                The First World-ness of this whole conversation just struck me. There are people right now who would get worse medical care than some cats with warmed SubQ fluids.

                                And that Thomas cat. What was wrong with him that he needed fluids every day? Geez. Oh, and did he not bother to drink himself? I mean, why get your tongue tired when someone can help you out.
                                Lol - he's a lazy butt.

                                Actually he drinks more than he ever has, but not enough to keep him hydrated.

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