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Just venting...frustrating evening.

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  • Just venting...frustrating evening.

    Working third shift currently at a surgical hospital/ER and a dog comes in with a trivial injury that will require surgery; hit by car. Otherwise young, cute, healthy.

    Owners can't afford the surgery and opt to euthanize. Hey--thats life, and I'm not judging. Vet suggests signing dog over to the hospital...we will do the surgery and attempt to rehome. Only downside is owners cannot know personally where the dog ends up. I offered to take said dog home with me tonight and foster until a home comes along. Sweet little guy and this surgery would not be a long-term medical hindrance type deal.

    Owners decline. If they can't have their baby, they don't want anyone to. So now an unmentionable outcome for an otherwise easily fixable, healthy dog.

    I am NOT mad at the owner; I am NOT mad at the vet--I am not pointing fingers. I cannot say what I would do in their situation nor do I plan to speculate or judge them. It is just a frustrating, sad situation and 'one of those days' in the animal profession.

  • #2
    Dude, i would be totally mad at the owner! How unbelievably selfish! Yeah. I'll be mad for you!

    I may have shared the story before, but I'll throw it out here again.
    For a few months, we kept seeing this fat ol chocolate lab wandering our country road. We tried to lure it to us multiple times but she wasn't having anything to do with that! A few times both MrB and myself nearly struck the dog as we were driving home and she was wandering down the middle of the road, at dusk. Finally, we manage to find her in our front yard as we're coming home and close off the gate before she can bolt out.
    As per the dept of ag requirements, we drop the dog off at animal control (we can't take in a stray off the streets directly). After a few days passed I stopped by AC to ask about the dog. Her owners were found but they didn't want to reclaim their 6+ year old lab because they had sold the bait shop and moved into town, leaving the dog to roam free. But they assured the ac officer that they were coming by every few days to feed her. How considerate.
    Anyway, I had AC contact them again and say a rescue organization was willing to take in the dog if they would sign her over. The officer had to convince them over the course of a whole day that my rescue group was not going to just euthanize the dog once we took it in.
    Umm? What in the WORLD did you think was going to happen otherwise to an elderly looking creaky old dog at a rural animal control with a 25% success rate?!!
    And can we even TALK about how 'rescuing and putting to sleep' a dog would compare to 'abandoning the dog to fend for herself, potentially get hit by a car and receive WHAT kind of care, if any??' How would THAT be a better choice???

    I was SO glad I wasn't the one talking to them. It makes my blood boil just thinking about it even now.


    I'm terribly sorry for your horrible day, OP. I would be a mess... But that's why I know I'm not strong enough for that job!! Godspeed, poor pup.

    Comment


    • #3
      that just sucks...I just drove 740 miles round trip to send my dog back to SC where I know he will be happier.
      And you are right, you can't be mad....but it still sucks
      "You can't really debate with someone who has a prescient invisible friend"
      carolprudm

      Comment


      • #4
        OP - I'm not trying to start anything by the following, it is just something that popped into my head as I was reading your post. (and I have heard this type of story before)

        SO owner of cute dog can't afford surgery. Vet says "sign dog over" we will fix and adopt out"
        Does it make sense that the vet will eat the cost of surgery vs presumably getting paid to euthanize, BUT will not cut the owner a break on the surgery?

        How can you look a funds challenged owner in the eye and say "I wont cut you a break, but sign the dog over and I'll pass that break to the next person...

        I don't get it...am I missing something???
        We don't get less brave; we get a bigger sense of self-preservation........

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          #5
          It sounds strange...and I won't stick on either side of it because there's a different opinion for every person you ask. It is, however, the way of the world from a veterinary medicine perspective.

          The "sign the dog owner" rule doesn't apply to every dog or even most dogs; it tends to just be 'the one' outstanding, unusual, heartstrings cases. I am not speaking as a vet but as an observer here; vets do it when in good conscience when they feel there is future potential for the dog. When euthanasia seems outrageously unnecessary. If said owner cannot afford the care of the dog...who says they will be able to afford such a thing again? A vet or surgeon can't operate every time someone says "sorry, I have no money" and eat the costs personally. If they did it would open the door for EVERY person to say "I have no money--and if YOU dont help me with it, you're immoral and its your fault the dog will die." It gives the owners an out to blame and puts the vets in a worse position.

          I guess the way to mentally accept it is--think of someone who's home is being foreclosed on. They have put 150k into their 200k house but just can't make ends meet and loose the house completely. Bank puts the home up on the market at an auction; a family bids and lucks out getting the house for 30k. Heck of a lot less than the previous owners sunk in right? Plus, its 'their' house? How is it fair? Its unfortunately the way of the world. I'm not saying its right or wrong, I'm not brazen enough to say how it should be changed....its just the way 'it is.' Thats how I equate it in my mind when I see situations like this.

          Comment


          • #6
            If they can't have their baby, they don't want anyone to. So now an unmentionable outcome for an otherwise easily fixable, healthy dog.
            Not for you to judge.

            If I die, and my husband can't continue to care for my pets, I want them euthanized. That's my choice. I've seen far too many times "forever" homes fall apart, even after references and site checks, and even with friends and relatives. Shit happens; life circumstances change. I don't want my animals falling through the cracks.

            There are fates worse than humane euthanasia. Unmentionable is languishing in pain or neglect.

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #7
              Not for you to judge.
              I know. I stated that very clearly multiple times and 2 of my 3 dogs I have it written that I would want them euthanized if immediate family was unable to take them. Doesn't make the actual fact of holding the dog any easier. Also worked as a euthanasia tech in the past and I agree. I am lamenting about the strains of this particular job field this evening, with still 6 hours to go on my shift with a rough start; not pointing fingers at the owner.

              Comment


              • #8
                If they can't have their baby, they don't want anyone to.
                There's a tone to that bit which contradicts what you had written in the paragraph prior to it.

                I know it seems senseless, but I can't imagine the family is having an easy time of it tonight either.

                Thank you for doing what you do in spite of how difficult it is at times. It matters. We need people like you. The animals do too.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by 2tempe View Post
                  OP - I'm not trying to start anything by the following, it is just something that popped into my head as I was reading your post. (and I have heard this type of story before)

                  SO owner of cute dog can't afford surgery. Vet says "sign dog over" we will fix and adopt out"
                  Does it make sense that the vet will eat the cost of surgery vs presumably getting paid to euthanize, BUT will not cut the owner a break on the surgery?

                  How can you look a funds challenged owner in the eye and say "I wont cut you a break, but sign the dog over and I'll pass that break to the next person...

                  I don't get it...am I missing something???
                  THIS

                  13 years ago I had a young JRT get kicked in the shoulder, right at the growth plate which was not yet closed. My vet told me there were only 2 options: surgery or euthanasia. She gave me a price for the surgery and there was no way I could afford it. I asked if she'd take payments, No. She gave me a pamphlet on a special credit card for vet bills. Hello honey. If I could get a regular credit card we wouldn't be having this conversation. Finally she said there was an orthopedic specialist in Charlottesville, she said maybe HE would take payments. Long story short, my boss of only 6 months loaned me the $1000 and let me pay it back out of my paycheck. Madison had her surgery and a week later we were back at the regular vet's to have the bandage changed. The vet said she was glad I elected to have the surgery, BECAUSE IF I'D OPTED FOR EUTHANASIA SHE WOULD'VE KEPT THE DOG HERSELF, DONE THE SURGERY AND THEN ADOPTED HER OUT.

                  The witch would've let me walk out crying that I was putting a puppy to sleep while she was doing the surgery and then given it to someone else, but wouldn't take payments??? HOW FREAKING DARE SHE????? Needless to say she lost my business and I was thrilled when she left town.
                  ~Kryswyn~ Always look on the bright side of life, de doo, de doo de doo de doo
                  Check out my Kryswyn JRTs on Facebook

                  "Life is merrier with a terrier!"

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Sorry, I side with the dog owner.
                    Many reasons, none needed to discuss here and now,
                    Founding Member of "I Kept 'Off Topic Day!' Open"

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      You're very right Barnfairy, I'm sure they're much more distraught than I am about the ordeal and loosing their pup, and for that I'm sorry. Obviously you don't rush your baby to the emergency clinic in the middle of the night with a lack of love.

                      And Crooked Horse, I am vehemently not siding with anyone; its not my place in the medical world to be anything more than objective on the outside no matter how I feel about it on the inside. My post wasn't designed to elicit a 'right' or 'wrong' siding, just that its a tough, tough situation.


                      Kryswyn--that happens more often than any vet would openly admit. Not in this practice; it is too large and too well known to risk it. But MANY general practices do and will continue to....hopefully and usually with the owner's wishes of helping find the pet a new home but....it does happen.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Maybe you could educate them on medical insurance for their animals should this happen again?

                        I don't think I would own a dog without some sort of insurance. Surgery can be so expensive. I have it for my horse too.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by 2tempe View Post
                          OP - I'm not trying to start anything by the following, it is just something that popped into my head as I was reading your post. (and I have heard this type of story before)

                          SO owner of cute dog can't afford surgery. Vet says "sign dog over" we will fix and adopt out"
                          Does it make sense that the vet will eat the cost of surgery vs presumably getting paid to euthanize, BUT will not cut the owner a break on the surgery?

                          How can you look a funds challenged owner in the eye and say "I wont cut you a break, but sign the dog over and I'll pass that break to the next person...

                          I don't get it...am I missing something???

                          Yea, I don't either. If they can afford to man-up the money for the surgery but take the dog away.. couldn't they afford to take payments or finance the surgery for the owners?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by equidae View Post
                            Yea, I don't either. If they can afford to man-up the money for the surgery but take the dog away.. couldn't they afford to take payments or finance the surgery for the owners?
                            I don't understand this either. Maybe the OP can shed some light on this. Why would the vet do the surgery basically for free and re-home the dog instead of giving a discount to the original owners?
                            I'm not a CPA.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Frankly, I don't understand this policy either. It doesn't make any sense. The only way it would make sense would be if the vet stated that the owners sign the dog over to them so they can offer it to someone who wants to adopt it AND has the resources to pay for the surgery. Otherwise, the policy is just plain dopey.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                I would've done the same thing. Euthanasia is not the worst end an animal can have. If I had a dog who needed surgery and I couldn't afford it, I would want him euthanized. I would be there holding him until the end, so the last thing he knew was that the person who loved him was there to comfort him. I wouldn't want my dog to go through surgery and be rehomed, especially if I had no way of screening the owners. I've seen too many dogs end up in bad situations.
                                "People ask me 'will I remember them if I make it'. I ask them 'will you remember me if I don't?'"

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  The reason 90% of the time financing through the vet directly, or offering big discounts isn't an option, is because then either 1) the owner tells every tom dick and harry he knows that such and such vet will give ou 1/2 off if you say you're puttig it down because you don't have any money. Or 2) they never pay off the bill. And vet clinics don't want the time, overhead, or hassle of worrying about tracking them down to get money.

                                  However, if you sign the pup over, you can get the raw cost of materials back from the adoption fee, and hopefully place the dog in a home where they can afford it's care. The fact that this was described as a "trivial" injury makes me think that we're not talking about $2k in surgery, more like $200. SO you can get an adoption fee of $150 and recover most of the costs. I'd also be willing to bet if the owner said we can cover 50% plus of the expenses today the offer to help cut costs or do payments would have been offered.

                                  Just from my experiences that is how this sort of situation usually comes about.

                                  Katherine
                                  Vet Tech
                                  You can't fix stupid.... but you can breed it!

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by Horsegal984 View Post

                                    The fact that this was described as a "trivial" injury makes me think that we're not talking about $2k in surgery, more like $200. SO you can get an adoption fee of $150 and recover most of the costs. I'd also be willing to bet if the owner said we can cover 50% plus of the expenses today the offer to help cut costs or do payments would have been offered.


                                    Katherine
                                    Vet Tech
                                    ^ This makes sense. I thought this was an expensive surgery, like in the 1,000's of dollars. Not two hundred.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Ehh, makes sense to me. If vets didn't require signing the dog over, then a lot of people who would pay for the surgery would probably say that they couldn't. Most of us wouldn't do that, but some people are like that. I think this is a pretty standard scenario across the country - fairly young dog is injured and needs surgery, owners can't afford, vet offers to have owners sign dog over and does the surgery and then re-adopts the dog out.
                                      I am not trying to be judgmental, but I've have signed the dog over.

                                      Comment

                                      • Original Poster

                                        #20
                                        Casey09 and Katherine have it. And we're talking about an incredibly minor surgery; not even orthopedic, borderline cosmetic, but there was no way to 'let it heal' on its own. Something a vet can do with limited supplies, time, and resources and eat the cost on their own....in cases before where dogs have signed pets over to us in the past (as I usually work orthopedic surgery) and the surgery is time, equipment and labor intensive its often the case that one of us techs will adopt the dog and pay for the surgery (as our discount is significant enough for it not to be magnanimous.)

                                        My thoughts are still with the pup and its family this morning; I'm back at work now and its an entire different crew of animals and problems but for whatever reason that pup hit my heartstrings. But you are all are very right; as I have intentions to euthanize two of my dogs I cannot lay judgement on this family. But standing there with your arms wide open and being denied the opportunity can be frustrating. Thanks for letting me vent! Still love my profession but it can be sticky.

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