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Do I just go Western?

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  • #81
    Originally posted by VaqueroToro View Post
    This whole post of yours, MVP, needs infinite like buttons.

    But it would help if I could proofread. So I did and maybe this will now make a tad more sense to the Nike crowd.
    The armchair saddler
    Politically Pro-Cat

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    • #82
      Originally posted by mp View Post
      I'm not the other half. I do a lot of analyzing myself. But I make sure I do at least as much doing as I do talking about doing.

      Oops! Didn't realize you knew the secret handshake that gets you into the Think And Talk It To Death speakeasy. Come on in then.

      Your post read as though you assumed the OP wasn't doing while she was talking about doing. If you are part of our club, why would you assume someone else wasn't cut from our kind of cloth? Also, I think the talking about sh!t that's intensely experiential and non-verbal (riding a horse) is a way of bonding with other people who love that rather private, ineffable experience as much as you do. I wouldn't want to deprive anyone of that. After all, if you came home all orgasmic about your horse feeling balanced and uphill or similar, just how many people could you get to share that with you? It's lonely being able to ride a horse.
      The armchair saddler
      Politically Pro-Cat

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      • Original Poster

        #83
        Originally posted by Pocket Pony View Post
        Paula, is that saddle treeless? I had a Freeform and LOVED it for long trail rides. But, honestly, for any kind of arena work it really sucked for me. For me, a treeless saddle doesn't offer the right kind of support for working on equitation. I know lots of people love them, and that's great, but if you feel you easily get sloppy in your position, I would recommend finding a treed saddle (and I know you've had trouble with this) that promotes a balanced seat.

        If you're considering going western, perhaps you'll have better luck finding a proper western saddle than you did an english saddle.
        You're not wrong! I'm learning so much about this now. The saddle is built for comfort not for equitation. I might have to find a treed saddle and some bridging pads-I think Skito has some. I'll try the back riser pad tomorrow and see if it helps at least a little bit. Eli (the saddle maker) is making an English version of his EZ fit. I wonder if it rides differently?

        Hear Hear, mvp! I quit feeling bad about talking too much many years ago. It's my process.

        MP, that leg position has always been an issue. And I do ride as much as I talk...well maybe not as much as I talk, but I do ride. I aim for 3-4 days a week. I'm trying every other day at the moment.

        Paula
        He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

        Comment


        • #84
          Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
          You're not wrong! I'll try the back riser pad tomorrow and see if it helps at least a little bit. Eli (the saddle maker) is making an English version of his EZ fit. I wonder if it rides differently?
          Be careful that adding a riser pad doesn't change the balance of the saddle so that it is now putting too much pressure on his withers.

          And my guess is that the English version of the saddle will have the same issue.
          Equine Ink - My soapbox for equestrian writings & reviews.
          EquestrianHow2 - Operating instructions for your horse.

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          • #85
            Originally posted by mvp View Post
            Oops! Didn't realize you knew the secret handshake that gets you into the Think And Talk It To Death speakeasy. Come on in then.

            Your post read as though you assumed the OP wasn't doing while she was talking about doing. If you are part of our club, why would you assume someone else wasn't cut from our kind of cloth? Also, I think the talking about sh!t that's intensely experiential and non-verbal (riding a horse) is a way of bonding with other people who love that rather private, ineffable experience as much as you do. I wouldn't want to deprive anyone of that. After all, if you came home all orgasmic about your horse feeling balanced and uphill or similar, just how many people could you get to share that with you?
            I inferred Paula hadn't at one point been riding much because she implied it ...

            I do ride more than I was, even if it's a brief tool around the ring.
            As for the club, it's called "takes one to know one."

            I used to read read read about riding and talk talk talk about it, too. But I do less of that now and a lot more riding. I can testify that it's paid off much better than my previous strategy.

            It's lonely being able to ride a horse.
            Oh my. I really don't know what to say to that.
            Last edited by mp; Jul. 24, 2013, 10:23 AM. Reason: clarify for paula and mvp; please see italicized text :)
            __________________________
            "... if you think i'm MAD, today, of all days,
            the best day in ten years,
            you are SORELY MISTAKEN, MY LITTLE ANCHOVY."

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            • Original Poster

              #86
              I wasn't implying that I was not riding much, I was trying to say the opposite -that I am riding much more. In fact I said I'm trying to ride 4 days a week. It's funny how we can read the same thing and take away different meanings.

              Paula
              He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

              Comment


              • #87
                I would imagine that you, like most of us, are not a threat to those currently vying for a spot on their national teams. Accordingly, we should do what strikes our fancy and if that means an equestrian detour here and there, so be it.

                If there is something about western, in whatever form, that is currently appealing to you, why not give it a go? You have no owner or sponsor to answer to. You only have to answer to yourself. If you horse is happy in his work and is well cared for, do whatever you like with him.

                It is not written in stone that "Fella shall henceforth do western dressage for the rest of his life". If you try it and think.."hmmm that was neat but I still like good old fashioned dressage"....you can always have at it again.

                Comment


                • #88
                  Hi, I'm the other EZ-Fit owner.

                  The EZ-Fit seat is more like a western saddle than an English saddle, with the low spot right in front of the cantle.
                  Following the instructions from the EZ-Fit people I put some padding between the leather seat and the underlying layer of the saddle just in front of the cantle. I had a lesson today using the EZ-Fit and my teacher said I looked like I was a lot more forward in the saddle than I was the last time she saw me in this saddle and she said that my lower legs were nice and steady. This padding moved my seat maybe an inch? forward, just enough so I do not have to make big movements to rise to the trot or get up into two-point. A big change from when my seat bones were sliding back to the cantle, forcing me into a chair seat with my lower legs flapping in the breeze.

                  The problem of putting a riser under the saddle is that unless the riser is covered by non-slip material the saddle may move more on the horse's back and not be as stable from side to side. The non-slip material on Eli's saddles and pads WORKS as I found out one day during a particularly ungraceful dismount when my foot got hung up in the stirrup. Even though I was hanging onto the saddle with all my weight on the left side the saddle did not move at all. This non-slip material is also very well ventilated for the comfort of the horse!

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                  • Original Poster

                    #89
                    I love Eli's non-slip stuff. I was thinking of putting the riser on top of the pad not below it. Do you think that might help? The riser is grippy -not as grippy as his stuff- and was meant to go under the saddle.

                    Jackie it's heartening to hear that shimming up the cantle helped so much. I'll be trying this today and I'll let you know.

                    Paula
                    He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                    Comment


                    • #90
                      Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                      I might have to find a treed saddle and some bridging pads-I think Skito has some.
                      FYI, I have tried to buy/use the right Skito pad for the particular bridge I had between horse and saddle. It didn't work, but I could have spent a fortune trying. Getting that area filled in with exactly the right shaped pad is very, very hard. Save your money. Or start experimenting with felt or memory foam or towels on your own.
                      The armchair saddler
                      Politically Pro-Cat

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                      • Original Poster

                        #91
                        I feel like I've seen this stretch of road before The Barnsby saddle I tried on him last bridged only a little so maybe it's a matter degree whether the bridging pad would work. Were you trying to fill in a big bridge or a little bridge?

                        Paula
                        He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                        Comment


                        • #92
                          A saddle that bridges when the horse is standing may not bridge when the horse engages his abs and lifts his back during work. Of course the only way to know if your horse is comfortable in it is to ride in it and work in it, but depending on how the other parts of the tree fit (tree angle, gullet, flocking, cantle), just a bit of bridging may not be a problem (or it may be - just like all other things, it depends!).
                          My Mustang Adventures - Mac, my mustang | Annwylid D'Lite - my Cob filly

                          "A horse's face always conveys clearly whether it is loved by its owner or simply used." - Anja Beran

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                          • #93
                            Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                            Maybe it's my karma -maybe deep down inside I was an elitist dressage snob and it's come to bite me in the backside

                            Paula
                            Aren't both Western and Traditional Dressage both now USEF events?? Thus elevating Western Dressage also to elitist snob territory?
                            Comprehensive Equestrian Site Planning and Facility Design
                            www.lynnlongplanninganddesign.com

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                            • #94
                              Paula, if you and Fella are more comfortable with a Western approach to dressage, I say go for it! It may be more like the training he had before you got him...

                              With a palomino, I've often wondered how we'd do Western... but she's a bit energetic ... has a lovely jog, but getting her canter down to a lope could be nigh well impossible.
                              You have to have experiences to gain experience.

                              1998 Morgan mare Mythic Feronia "More Valley Girl Than Girl Scout!"

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                              • Original Poster

                                #95
                                Originally posted by Plumcreek View Post
                                Aren't both Western and Traditional Dressage both now USEF events?? Thus elevating Western Dressage also to elitist snob territory?
                                Oh darn it!

                                Quietann, you don't have to get the lope all WP slow in WD you know

                                Jackie! I stuck the riser under the saddle this evening and I felt more level. LOL I didn't know I wasn't! Here's a picture I had one of the kids take with her cellphone http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5544/9...c374cf1cf6.jpg

                                I think it looks different. Bogie, I think my leg is more under me...

                                Paula
                                He is total garbage! Quick! Hide him on my trailer (Petstorejunkie).

                                Comment


                                • #96
                                  Hi Paula, you look like you are a lot less tense in your seat.
                                  EZ-Fit saddles seem to have almost infinite adjustability. The up side is that the rider has a chance to get everything RIGHT, the down side is that it can take an infinite amount of time to get everything right. Right now I am thinking of cutting out layers of felt to put under the seat leather of my saddle.

                                  Comment


                                  • #97
                                    Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                                    Were you trying to fill in a big bridge or a little bridge?

                                    Paula
                                    No, Paula, I'm giving you a Dante-esque, "Abandon all hope, ye who enter here"-type message about trying to exactly fill in any bridge.

                                    Besides that previous horse with just some age-related holes behind his withers and a Full QH bars western saddles, I have since tried to pad and saddle some horses that are congenitally sway-backed. It's complete folly to think that you can create the pad that perfectly fills in that 3-D space between horse back and saddle you'd like. When you get it wrong, the pad becomes like a rock in your shoe under the saddle.

                                    I will say that IME, the spaces we are actually trying to fill in are shorter and thinner than we think. I have seen some good endurance riders get it right using felt or closed-cell foam and stuffing that under the panels in their saddle. But they worked very, very hard to get a fit that improved rather than offended.
                                    The armchair saddler
                                    Politically Pro-Cat

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                                    • #98
                                      mvp, I have always wondered if an air-filed channel pad (like an air mattress) could be designed to allow the air to go where the void is. Absent that, the easily compressed foam pad has been my solution, as has been a half-seat at times for less back pressure.
                                      Comprehensive Equestrian Site Planning and Facility Design
                                      www.lynnlongplanninganddesign.com

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                                      • #99
                                        Originally posted by paulaedwina View Post
                                        Oh darn it!

                                        Quietann, you don't have to get the lope all WP slow in WD you know

                                        Jackie! I stuck the riser under the saddle this evening and I felt more level. LOL I didn't know I wasn't! Here's a picture I had one of the kids take with her cellphone http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5544/9...c374cf1cf6.jpg

                                        I think it looks different. Bogie, I think my leg is more under me...

                                        Paula
                                        Yes your leg is further back but you still need some "stuffing". I don't know if your stirrup length is suitable for western -- to my eye you would have more support if you shortened your leathers 2 holes. Then think about what would happen to you if Fella disappeared from under you; would you land on your feet?

                                        Also start to think about lifting your rib cage so that you can better position your pelvis. Right now you're kind of scrunched up.

                                        Mary Wanless has some good visual examples of how to balance yourself better. If you're not familiar with her, check out her website: http://www.mary-wanless.com/

                                        Not everyone likes her way of teaching but I've found it helpful. IN addition to reading her books, I audited one of her clinics.
                                        Equine Ink - My soapbox for equestrian writings & reviews.
                                        EquestrianHow2 - Operating instructions for your horse.

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                                        • This post will be way OT, folks.

                                          Originally posted by Plumcreek View Post
                                          mvp, I have always wondered if an air-filed channel pad (like an air mattress) could be designed to allow the air to go where the void is. Absent that, the easily compressed foam pad has been my solution, as has been a half-seat at times for less back pressure.
                                          Seems good on paper, I think an air-filled thing is really not good in practice--- in the moving sandwich we are talking about.

                                          IME with things like CAIR panels, you either fill them too full in order to provide 3-Dness, or, if you don't want them to be too hard, they are empty enough that air gets squished out of the way of weight compression that part. And that defeats the purpose of the whole thing. Imagine, say, what happens behind the withers when the 200# guy on the 14.2 heeler asks that horse to stop. I could be wrong. I'm just sitting in an armchair considering physics.

                                          I think there are two solutions:

                                          1. Some kind of channeled foam that slowed down the movement of air through that bridgy- part of the pad.

                                          2. Someone in Saddle Pad Building World should go talk to the people who make stuff for wheelchair bound folks. They probably have the best approach to our problem going.
                                          The armchair saddler
                                          Politically Pro-Cat

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