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Stunning Buckskin approved ZANGERSHEIDE stallion in the NL

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  • #41
    Well, the question is:
    Was that comment about California Chablis who is performing in Grand Prix and Intermediaire dressage in USA very successfully and who is not a jumper bred horse, or was that comment about that buckskin stallion approved Zangersheide.
    Gwendolyn
    http://www.gestuet-falkenhorst.com
    Exceptional colored German WBs, TBs and Arabians

    Comment


    • #42
      My comment was on Cream on Top.

      Comment


      • #43
        My comment was on Chablis:

        SATURDAY, MARCH 29, 2008
        Prix St. Georges - Open

        (C) Koch,

        1 Nicholia Zamora Ramsgate D 68.500%

        2 Willy Arts Preston 66.250%

        3 Mary Burke Prince 65.250%

        4 Jan Ebeling Westcoast 64.000%

        5 Nick Wagman Rock 62.750%

        Tom Murray Pepper 19 61.000%

        Nick Wagman California Chablis

        Comment


        • #44
          Here is another one....and he is really nice. He was here on my farm for a while.... http://goldhopefarm.com/good_as_gold.htm

          Comment


          • #45
            Buckskin Warmblood stallions

            L & L and Peskee, thank you both for mentioning Good as Gold, our 2006 Buckskin Oldenburg stallion. He received his Certified Breeding License in 2009 with the Oldenburg/ NA and will do his performance test this fall. http://www.isroldenburg.org/?pid=sta...led%list&p=3#g
            Good as Gold has all European bloodlines, being by Goodtimes and out of the graded Dansk Varmblod (and approved Oldenburg NA) Michellino mare Alino Queen, who was imported as a yearling from the Netherlands and comes from a long line of performance bred horses (her half brother was on the Swiss B team for Dressage). Good as Gold's pedigree qualifies him for most main studbook registries, and we had the choice when we registered him of KWPN, Oldenburg NA, or Dansk Varmblod. We are very excited about Good as Gold, as he has the gaits, the scope, and the athletic ability to succeed in any discipline. He has an enormous amount of jump, and three great gaits as well. His first foal is due this year out of an imported Coriano mare, and he will have a good sized foal crop next year. I have spoken with the KWPN, and I believe that when he passes his stallion performance test, he will be able to have register A KWPN foals, and be considered "erkund" to the best of my understanding. His foals are also eligible for Oldenburg NA papers. He has had 2 full siblings which have main foalbook KWPN papers, and this year will be the third. His Oldenburg full sibling was a premium foal as well. The rules seem to change annually about the reciprocity of the studbook registries, and they can be very hard to understand Creme on Top seems lovely, he reminds me in a way of Good as Gold's Oldenburg NA half sister Aida by Advocate who has the same elegant look and buttermilk buckskin color. We bred her to Corlando yesterday and fingers are crossed for a fantastic jumping very beautiful buckskin show hunter...
            Attached Files
            Goldhope Farm
            Breeder of International Quality Palomino & Buckskin KWPN, Oldenburg and Dansk Varmblod Sporthorses

            www.GoldhopeFarm.com
            484-228-8162 EST
            GoldhopeFarm@aol.com

            Comment


            • #46
              Originally posted by Lauren Efford View Post
              I have spoken with the KWPN, and I believe that when he passes his stallion performance test, he will be able to have register A KWPN foals, and be considered "erkund" to the best of my understanding.
              You may want to double check with KWPN on that - in general, the Euro registries (or registries with a Euro parent) do not recognize the ISR 10 day test for full approval. In fact, I believe that only ISR/ONA and maybe AHHA (?) recognize that test.

              Originally posted by Lauren Efford View Post
              The rules seem to change annually about the reciprocity of the studbook registries, and they can be very hard to understand
              If you mean reciprocity with Europe, I think only AHS and Oldenburg (GOV) have full reciprocity with their German counterpart registries when it comes to breeding licenses. I am not sure about KWPN - maybe one of the Dutch breeders can speak to this.

              But if you mean reciprocity between one registry and the next, Oldenburg (GOV) generally requires that stallions licensed with another registry finish Oldenburg-recognized performance requirements - i.e., a recognized 30 day test for young stallions, or a recognized 70 day test for stallions age 7 or older (or the specified competition requirements). So a stallion that has done only the ISR 10-day test would not be allowed to sire Oldenburg registered foals (unless he is a young stallion that has been officially inspected and approved by Oldenburg stallion inspectors - and then his license will expire at the end of his 6 y/o year unless he has successfully completed an Oldenburg-recognized 70 day test or met the sport requirements).

              As for KWPN, a friend of mine was told last year that the Dutch will recognize a stallion as Erkend only if he has been fully licensed/approved by a Erkend studbook (and apparently ISR/ONA is not considered Erkend).
              Last edited by DownYonder; Apr. 7, 2010, 05:51 AM. Reason: added the part in bold for clarification

              Comment


              • #47
                Buckskin Warmblood stallions

                Hi Down Yonder! To clarify, our intent is to do the 10 day test Fall 2009 (October) first, then on to the longer test that will make him Erkund with some of the other registries. At that point, from what I have been told, he will be "Erkund". The rules are changing so fast that it can make your head spin, but what I understood from my coversation with the KWPN within the last few months is that as of the rule changes in 2009, once Good as Gold is approved by the OLD NA (after the 10 day test) he will be able to have Register A foals with the KWPN. His pedigree definately meets their specifications. I specifically questioned the KWPN about this, but I will make another phone call, as I certainly need to be sure of what is required as of the exact date and time of his licensing with the OLD NA after the 10 day test for "erkund" status. This has been an interesting process (raising a young warmblood stallion in this country) and a real learning experience. I am always open to new information
                Goldhope Farm
                Breeder of International Quality Palomino & Buckskin KWPN, Oldenburg and Dansk Varmblod Sporthorses

                www.GoldhopeFarm.com
                484-228-8162 EST
                GoldhopeFarm@aol.com

                Comment


                • #48
                  I have been told that a foal can only get KWPN section A papers if the sire is approved with one of the WBFSH ranked Associations on place 1-10. No matter what stallion performance test, all other foals if by approved or non approved stallions (which I find ridiculous as a non approved stallion does not have the same value as an approved and performance tested stallion!) are to go into their section with B papers. Since Old NA is not in the first 10 ranks of WBFSH, so I guess it will be book B papers the foals will get. If it would be the real Oldenburg Verband it would be A papers as they are in the first 10 rankings.

                  But I have seen that people do not care very much if you get A or B papers. So I would not worry over this.
                  Gwendolyn
                  http://www.gestuet-falkenhorst.com
                  Exceptional colored German WBs, TBs and Arabians

                  Comment


                  • #49
                    The KWPN-NA does recognize the Oldenburg-NA studbook for what I know. The Dutch KWPN does not. They do recognize the German Oldenburg studbook but only if the stallions have a full approval by Oldenburg. Not if stallions are just able to registrate foals in the Oldenburg studbook.

                    Comment


                    • #50
                      Originally posted by Lauren Efford View Post
                      Hi Down Yonder! To clarify, our intent is to do the 10 day test Fall 2009 (October) first, then on to the longer test that will make him Erkund with some of the other registries. At that point, from what I have been told, he will be "Erkund". The rules are changing so fast that it can make your head spin, but what I understood from my coversation with the KWPN within the last few months is that as of the rule changes in 2009, once Good as Gold is approved by the OLD NA (after the 10 day test) he will be able to have Register A foals with the KWPN. His pedigree definately meets their specifications. I specifically questioned the KWPN about this, but I will make another phone call, as I certainly need to be sure of what is required as of the exact date and time of his licensing with the OLD NA after the 10 day test for "erkund" status. This has been an interesting process (raising a young warmblood stallion in this country) and a real learning experience. I am always open to new information
                      Well, if you planned to do the Fall 2009 test, you have missed it.

                      And if KWPN considers a stallion Erkend after completing only the ISR/ONA 10-day test, then that seems to be a big switch in their philosophy.

                      Comment


                      • #51
                        Originally posted by janderegelaar View Post
                        The KWPN-NA does recognize the Oldenburg-NA studbook for what I know. The Dutch KWPN does not. They do recognize the German Oldenburg studbook but only if the stallions have a full approval by Oldenburg. Not if stallions are just able to registrate foals in the Oldenburg studbook.
                        Really? I thought KWPN had moved to make the NA registry pretty much the same as the Dutch one regarding breeding rules.

                        Comment


                        • #52
                          Originally posted by DownYonder View Post
                          Really? I thought KWPN had moved to make the NA registry pretty much the same as the Dutch one regarding breeding rules.
                          No, KWPN-NA stallions now have the same status as the Dutch KWPN stallions and that was different before.

                          Comment


                          • #53
                            Ah – so stallions approved by KWPN-NA for breeding in N.A. are also considered approved by KWPN for breeding in Holland. IOW, they can sire Foalbook foals in either N.A. or Holland.

                            OTOH, the Erkend rules for stallions from outside registries are different in N.A. versus Holland. IOW – the NA branch recognizes some studbooks as Erkend that the mother registry in Holland does not recognize, so a stallion that is Erkend in N.A. can sire Register A foals in N.A., but not in Holland. Is that correct?

                            But I still find it odd that the Dutch give the same status to a stallion that has only done the ISR 10-day test as one that has done a Euro-type 70-day test! All this time, I thought the Dutch were pretty much the toughest registry around as far as recognizing “outside” stallions! Very interesting to know this!

                            Comment


                            • #54
                              I doubt that the KWPN-NA gives any recognition to the ISR 10-day test.

                              Historically the KWPN-NA did not recognize Oldenburg NA, RPSI and ATA stallions who have not done a 100-day test.

                              This organization goes years without licensing any NA-born stallions.

                              I think Thatcher was the last one and perhaps Idocus before that and Idocus is an older stallion, retired from Grand Prix international competition.

                              The licensing and approval process is daunting, not to mention meeting the qualifications to keep the approval. I don't know of any other registry that culls like the Dutch for not meeting performance requirements and for not having enough offspring that meet the standards.
                              www.oakhollowstable.blogspot.com

                              Comment


                              • #55
                                Buckskin Warmblood stallions

                                Originally posted by DownYonder View Post
                                Well, if you planned to do the Fall 2009 test, you have missed it.

                                And if KWPN considers a stallion Erkend after completing only the ISR/ONA 10-day test, then that seems to be a big switch in their philosophy.
                                OOPS!! Is it really 2010 already <G>! The spring rush of breeding and foaling and craziness at work at the vet clinic has gotten to me already <VBG>

                                I will call the KWPN NA this week to verify, as I thought I understood all of the new rule changes as far as the OLD NA and the stallion reciprocity from our last conversation
                                Goldhope Farm
                                Breeder of International Quality Palomino & Buckskin KWPN, Oldenburg and Dansk Varmblod Sporthorses

                                www.GoldhopeFarm.com
                                484-228-8162 EST
                                GoldhopeFarm@aol.com

                                Comment


                                • #56
                                  Good luck, Lauren.

                                  The rules have evolved so it is always best to get the latest info from the office.
                                  www.oakhollowstable.blogspot.com

                                  Comment


                                  • #57
                                    Buckskin Warmblood stallions

                                    Originally posted by Oakstable View Post
                                    Good luck, Lauren.

                                    The rules have evolved so it is always best to get the latest info from the office.
                                    Thank you, Oakstable...I thought I had the latest info (about 2 months ago), and I too was surprised that the KWPN would accept stallions as "Erkund" that were approved with the OLD NA through the 10 day test (I know that did not use to be the case)...but that is what I was told, for better or for worse . I will confirm with them this week and let you all knowwhat I am told (I am thinking to get it in writing this time). I think I will go to Silvia, as that is not who I spoke with at the KWNP NA...it was someone else in the K's office. It makes is so hard with all the rules changing every time we look around... Lauren
                                    Goldhope Farm
                                    Breeder of International Quality Palomino & Buckskin KWPN, Oldenburg and Dansk Varmblod Sporthorses

                                    www.GoldhopeFarm.com
                                    484-228-8162 EST
                                    GoldhopeFarm@aol.com

                                    Comment


                                    • #58
                                      Originally posted by Oakstable View Post
                                      This organization goes years without licensing any NA-born stallions.

                                      I think Thatcher was the last one and perhaps Idocus before that and Idocus is an older stallion, retired from Grand Prix international competition.

                                      I think the last one was Olivier - Elizabeth Austin's "Fizzy" - early this year.
                                      www.juniperridgeranch.us
                                      Visit us on Facebook!

                                      Comment


                                      • #59
                                        Originally posted by DownYonder View Post
                                        Ah – so stallions approved by KWPN-NA for breeding in N.A. are also considered approved by KWPN for breeding in Holland. IOW, they can sire Foalbook foals in either N.A. or Holland.
                                        Yes

                                        Originally posted by DownYonder View Post
                                        OTOH, the Erkend rules for stallions from outside registries are different in N.A. versus Holland. IOW – the NA branch recognizes some studbooks as Erkend that the mother registry in Holland does not recognize, so a stallion that is Erkend in N.A. can sire Register A foals in N.A., but not in Holland. Is that correct?
                                        If the KWPN-NA recognize them, yes

                                        Originally posted by DownYonder View Post
                                        But I still find it odd that the Dutch give the same status to a stallion that has only done the ISR 10-day test as one that has done a Euro-type 70-day test! All this time, I thought the Dutch were pretty much the toughest registry around as far as recognizing “outside” stallions! Very interesting to know this!
                                        As far as I know, the KWPN recognizes in Holland stallions from several German studbooks, even if they haven't done the performance test.
                                        Reason for that is: the KWPN does not recognize the German stalliontest and the offspring of these stallions have to do a performance (IBOP/EPTM) test before they can be registered in the main studbook. Not to speak about the veterinarian standard they have to match as long as the "outside" stallion does not match this standard or is not tested according to the KWPN veterinarian rules.

                                        Comment


                                        • #60
                                          Olivier was a proven GP stallion at the time he was "erkend." Thatcher and Idocus were licensed as young promising stallions.

                                          Now he has to have a sufficient number of first premium babies on the ground to keep his license.

                                          Very tough to do especially in a down market with so many mares on the sidelines. At least mine have been for two years and no breeding done yet for 2011.
                                          www.oakhollowstable.blogspot.com

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