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Speak to me of Numero Uno! :D

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  • Speak to me of Numero Uno! :D

    EDIT 12/8: With the passing of Rampal, I have decided to choose another stallion (limited supply makes me nervous). I am now wondering about Numero Uno - see post 22.

    Hey all! I have lurked a long time on this forum, but never really posted. I am thinking of breeding my mare this spring and I am wondering what you all would breed her to. She is a dynamite jumper and a very lovely little girl besides, but I am going into an intense 1.5 year program to get my BSN and will not be able to ride very much. I have always considered breeding her, so as far as timing goes, it seems pretty perfect to breed her this spring.

    The mare is reg. KWPN, 9 y.o., by Wolfgang out of a Concorde mare. She's only 15.2hh but both of her parents were 16.1. I've had her since she was 4 and she is really a great horse - I showed her in the AA hunters for a year or so but then switched to the AA jumpers. She's certainly capable of doing the Low AO jumpers, but a) I am a wuss and b) since starting college I have not been able to dedicate the time to riding that would allow me to make the push from the 3'6" to the 4'. Some weeks I can ride every day, some weeks I have 5 exams and am lucky if I see the outside of a textbook, you know how it goes.

    I came to this forum to get an opinion from the breeding gurus - what do you think of that cross? Is there another stallion you would choose for my mare? Who?? I would like to be able to register the foal KWPN, so that narrows the field a lot, but I would be okay with KWPN Reg. A. I would obviously like a good temperament that would be pretty suitable to an amateur. The only thing about my mare I would improve on, really, is a little less stubbornness (there are a couple things out there that once she makes up her mind about them, game over ), and a little more height (not crucial, I am a short person).

    Thanks for reading, here are some pictures of the mare if you're interested:

    http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pi...45&id=11324903 (best recent conformation shot I have, sorry)

    http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y14...nlake_8-08.jpg (forgive the watermark - I did actually purchase this picture, I just never scanned the unmarked version)


    Her pedigree:
    Last edited by 00Jumper; Dec. 8, 2009, 01:09 PM.

    "You keep one leg on one side, the other leg on the other side, and your mind in the middle." -- Henry Taylor, "Riding Lesson"

  • #2
    Your mare is adorable and that stallion is lovely. I'm not one to give any advice at all beause I am in the same boat as you, all I will say is that the stallion owners are typically very nice and helpful. I notice he's at Iron Spring Farm, I bet they would be happy to spend some time talking to you and advising you on their stallions.

    Have fun, I am sure you will have a wonderful foal. Love your mare, I too have a tiny bay mare with a big personality.
    On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog


    • #3
      I also own a Wolfgang mare - but her damsire is Voltaire. Believe it or not she is a Third level (showing) PSG (schooling) mare.

      Regardless - a friend told me the Wolfgang Flemmingh crosses are a GREAT niche - Flemmingh is also jumper bred but throws fantastic movement with AA temperment and nice long legs to boot.

      It would have to be frozen but the Europeans like that niche quite a bit.

      Gotta love the Wolfgang neck and uphill movement! (My mare also likes to jump - but I don't ).

      Post pictures of the baby when it's born!
      Now in Kentucky


      • #4
        I ride a rampal son - he is one of the best jumpers I have ever ridden but he is quirky and hot.. he did come from a TB mare.. but Ramiro line horses can have some spice.

        What about Cavalier? http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/cavalier18

        Way underused IMO... and wonderful sire of jumpers with excellent temperments..
        Hickstead 1996-2011 Godspeed
        " Hickstead is simply the best and He lives forever in our hearts"
        Akasha 1992-2012 - I will always love you sweet girl.


        • #5
          Flemmingh frozen has run out and no more since he has passed. :-(

          Do you want to use fresh or frozen. For a first time breeding fresh is easier of course. I would suggest Navarone (Jus de Pomme x Armstrong). He is producing incredible jumpers and all around horses for anyone to ride. Impeccable characters that really want to work hard for you. Really is a strong trait in his foals. Very easy to break and train, and very well balanced. Navarone goes very well with the Wolfgang and Concorde lines. Plus there is a breeding special for him for bookings this month. $200 off.

          For frozen I would suggest Corland. Super characters and fantastic jumpers. Many go to Grand Prix but good for anyone.

          Another nice one that puts on really nice characters is Tenerife. They are such nice horses to work with. I have had several and they are super amateur horses and of course lots of talent for the jumps.

          Majestic Gaits-Dutch Warmbloods,#1 USEF Dressage Sporthorse Breeder. #1 KWPN-NA Jumpers.Standing Navarone,Schroeder,Dante MG.VDL Frozen.


          • #6
            I have a Calvados mare out of a Wolfgang mare that I purchased from Team Nijhof as a 3 year old. Interesting is that I bred her to Concorde before importing her from Holland (on the advice of Jeanette from Team Nijhof). My Concorde/Calvados/Wolgang filly is very nice.

            You might try and see if Team Nijhof (www.team-nijhof.nl) has any frozen still left from Calvados. The cross with your mare would be very nice. He is approved with KWPN.

            This is my Calvados/Wolfgang/Ulft mare freejumping the other day. My girls were playing around with her and video taped her. The standard height is 5 feet. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=puH24S2K5wI Obviously, she is my 22 year old's next jumper.
            Richard, Approved Black KWPN Stallion
            and Facebook page
            Oh Kaptain Underpants SFS, Approved BRp pony stallion
            Website and Facebook page


            • #7
              I'm sure Iron Spring can give good advice. The only Rampal I knew was quirky to dangerous, although very talented and huge. I've had some other feedback from folks who had Rampals with the same comments. Bred to the right mare, I'm sure he is wonderful.


              • Original Poster

                Thanks to those of you who have replied already. Some of the comments about Rampal worry me - my mare is not hot by any stretch of any definition (most days you'll find me dragging her in from the field to ride; once in the barn, she promptly falls asleep. Then we meander out to the arena, etc. ) and a little more blood would certainly not be something I'm totally uninterested in, but it's the 'quirky' that gets me. She is not bad, but she is very quirky sometimes. Perhaps Rampal is not a good cross in that case? I had heard that about Ramiro lines, but I hadn't ever really seen it in the Rampal babies I've known (though I've certainly seen it in other Ramiros!).

                So perhaps I should open the field a little more - if YOU had my mare, who the heck would you breed her to?! I would prefer fresh but all I can seem to find is frozen - is there even any KWPN stallion that could ship to DE fresh?

                "You keep one leg on one side, the other leg on the other side, and your mind in the middle." -- Henry Taylor, "Riding Lesson"


                • #9
                  Speak to Judy Yancey about Kannan, he fits the bill for everything you're asking. There's video of him at www.frenchstallions.org

                  He's a lovely guy, I ride him a couple of times a week in the woods and his kids tend to be super nice temperaments and great for amateurs to pros.


                  • #10
                    Kathy at Majestic Gaits is probably as knowledgable as anyone in the US about the Dutch horses. Her stallion, Navarone would probably work well for you and she might have other suggestions as well. Good luck!


                    • #11

                      Olivier is KWPN, 17hh, does GP dressage and has a terrific jump (see the video). He was trained by a YR (who posts here) and his offspring have very ammy-friendly temperaments -- a number of them have been trained/started by ammies and teens.


                      • #12
                        I LOVE Olivier! http://www.imajica.net/olivier.html


                        • #13
                          you haven't said what needs improving on your mare, which is critical to know in attempting to select a stallion. often the height of small mares is one of the hardest things to counter even with the biggest stallions. while there are exceptions, when you get a stubborn small gene in there it can take generations of breeding to large stallions before you're back at the size you want.

                          she is smaller than the standard 16.2h which many breeders aim for, and certainly many smaller horses are at a disadvantage getting down the lines in the hunter ring without looking like they're stretching hard.

                          she is attractive and looks attentive to her work and also athletic.

                          if i were looking to make a slightly bigger offspring to do 4' jumpers but also 3'6 hunters i would be considering the stallion cunningham carefully.
                          Hidden Pearl Farm


                          • #14
                            I've known two Rampal mare, although quite athletic they were very unrideable.


                            • #15
                              I like Navarone too... never met him in person, but seems to have a lovely mind.
                              *Better to have loved than to have never loved at all.*
                              ALWAYS Blessings NEVER losses.


                              • #16
                                I started a Rampal over fences. I wouldn't say he is all that hot but I would say I think he would be better suited to do dressage. He jumps okay and has his knees up but he throws his lower leg out in front of him over fences. I don't know how he'd make out as a jumper but as a hunter, its not appealing. He does have the most comfortable canter I think I've ever sat. I would also consider Consul. I know several Consul's and they are fun, quiet, talented over fences for sure, and move well too. Only drawback to them is I'd say that he will tend to give the foal a sizeable head. If your mare has a smallish head, I think it's be fine. Good luck!


                                • #17
                                  Judgement. That would be really cool.


                                  • #18
                                    I have a 2 yr old Rampal gelding out of a Thb who is not hot. the dam is very quiet and not hot and is 15.2. My guy will be about 16.1 - 2. Free jumping he is quite good with his knees and back. Nothing quirky about my guy at all and is a real pocket pet.
                                    *Every horse is a self-portrait of the rider....Autograph your work with excellence.*
                                    Supporting Nokotas www.nokotahorse.org
                                    Lipizzan's rock! http://rigitta.blogspot.com/


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by FMulder View Post
                                      Speak to Judy Yancey about Kannan, he fits the bill for everything you're asking. There's video of him at www.frenchstallions.org

                                      He's a lovely guy, I ride him a couple of times a week in the woods and his kids tend to be super nice temperaments and great for amateurs to pros.
                                      I'm going to second you take a look at Kannan. He's a tall rangey stallion that is cited as specifically suited for smaller or medium mares that lack size, scope and power. His offspring express so much scope, just take a look at the recent posting about the P.S.I. auction, and now look at the Kannan offspring: http://www.psi-auktion.de/en/psi-auc...g-horses-2009/


                                      • Original Poster

                                        Thanks again guys for replying. I spoke with Meghan at ISF and while she favored Judgement I am hesitant on the closeness of the cross, as am I with Kannan. In light of Rampal's recent passing, I am reconsidering my choice. I have a maiden mare, and he's a limited supply of frozen semen now and, well . . . I don't like those odds. So the stallion hunt beings anew.

                                        As far as what I am looking to improve on my mare, I would like a little more height (not huge - 16.2 horses are plenty big for me!), a better topline (she has a little bit of a roach back but nothing absolutely terrible - I didn't really ever even notice it much until the KWPN mentioned the slight roach at her inspection), better hocks and a little more forward. She has plenty of jump and scope, but I suppose those things wouldn't go amiss in a stallion . I'd like to use fresh semen if possible (the mare is in DE) and, again, a KWPN stallion would be preferable, but I would be willing to go with a stallion that would get me a Reg. A-eligible baby.

                                        I have gotten some great suggestions on this thread, and have started seriously considering two of them, but keep 'em coming! The more the merrier, imho.

                                        "You keep one leg on one side, the other leg on the other side, and your mind in the middle." -- Henry Taylor, "Riding Lesson"