My stallion is with his mares--has gained weight

[showjumpers66]

Zlotych, sorry we were posting at the same time.

I agree. Go with what works for you. Just keep in mind that there are readers viewing the forums to learn and we want that eductation to be well rounded. Happy Pasturing!

[Ridge Runner]

The problem lies in that posters were indicating that this may be a solution for all stallions. I just wanted to point out that it is not a good solution for stallions who need to have a career (which should pretty much be all stallions).

I guess I didn't read that into the replies but I certainly understand your point. I have had several stallions that for one reason or the other could not be turned out with other horses; and as I said, it depends on the situation and the horse. I do believe it is ideal when it can be done and with some stallions...even younger ones that are in active work or competition...it can work out. Certainly there is risk involved but even stallions turned out alone can get hurt or get stressed. My stallions seem more stressed alone than with company so I try to give them someone to hang out with.

[VirginiaBred]

......but I would only consider it with an older, retired stallion with a low to moderate libido.

I know some men like that............

[showjumpers66]

No doubt!!!!

[blackstallion2]

My stallion was pastured with mares and their 2 weanling colts by other stallions and a yearling gelding unrelated to him or the mares his first year (he was 4). There's a lot of misconceptions about stallion keeping... I'm glad more folks give their boys a chance to be real herd sires and not just semen donors.

[MagicRoseFarm]

It is an old wives tale about stallions savaging mares in foal to other stallions--they may be good, but not that good!! More then likely the mares were not properly introduced or the stallion was not used to mares and managed properly.

I personally know of a case where a stallion lived with mares, some were occasionally removed from the herd and bred to other stallions, via AI.. he raped them all when returned. Many of these were mares he lived with for YEARS. I give them credit to know.
My dog can tell me which mare is foaling next even days before. I have a 100' long barn aisle, and when I enter the barn at night check, and switch on the lights, she ALWAYS goes first to the stall where the next mare is due and sniffs under the door. If it is foaling , she won't leave that one.

In a documentary on wild horses, they show a stallion murdering a newborn by another stallion,

Our WB stallion is not turned out with mares, but I am pretty sure he knows which on our farm are his. He shows kind interest, even in his weanlings and yearlings, and has never particularly cared for two colts by other sires.

[Ridge Runner]

In a documentary on wild horses, they show a stallion murdering a newborn by another stallion,

That was on the Cloud Documentary. The foal was abnormal and could not rise...he was contracted in his hind legs and going to die a slow terrible death. Another family band moved in and the mother and her herd moved away. The stallion did kill the foal. I don't think it was because it was not his foal but because he sensed something was wrong with it. It was not acting normally and he probably perceived a threat from it.

I know of stallions that killed their own foals that they sired and from mares that they lived with year round.... so it really only proves that some stallions cannot be turned out with foals or should not be stallions in the first place ...not that they will only kill another stallions' foals. Both of my stallions have been turned out with foals from other stallions...recently.. last summer all summer long...and neither one harmed the foal, never showed the slightest inclination to do so.... nor did they rape any mares bred by other stallions. I have lots of proof right here on my farm.

I'm not saying it can't happen...I just saying it depends on each horse which is an individual.

[goodmorning]

Can you name any upper level Grand prix horse who is pastured most of the time?

And then turned out with other horses on top of that...not many.

[turningpointequine]

For those of you who have stallions and foals out together, how did you go about doing so? Did you put them out in seperate pastures w/ shard fencelines to get to know each other first? Did you ever worry about the stallion somehow hurting the foal and how did you go about preventing it as much as possible? I'm just really curious about this as I assumed that stallion + foals = no no.

[selah]

BTW, Silver Lining (aka Landwerder) is living with a couple of mares in a paddock. I do think that it could be a great situation for some stallions, but I would only consider it with an older, retired stallion with a low to moderate libido.

Nothing like a little mare band for the ole libido...might find the old fella has more libido left than anyone imagined (now stop me before I point out any human similarities!!!)

I think it would be lovely to give an awesome old campaigner his retirement with my mares...he might not be producing good semen for freezing, and not up to a lot of collecting, but might be up to pasture breeding a few good babies...and after they're in foal, it's just hangin' out in the shade with his harem...

[pintopiaffe]

My stallion loffs bebes period, his own or his step-children.

The thing is though, I won't turn him out with a mare bred to an outside stallion because if she slips, he may rebreed. That's fine if it's supposed to be his breeding... not so much if I've spent a lot of $$$ for AI. Probably voids the LFG too...

I don't know many top-level-competition HORSES who get tons of turnout and companionship... :sad:

My guy goes from family group turnout to solitary to stalled to solitary at teacher's, travelling, etc. If he couldn't, he wouldn't be a stallion. I simply won't keep one intact who can't be a horse first, a gentleman second, and still do whatever jobs he needs to get done. There are enough stallions, if he can't do ALL of the above, he can be a great gelding.

[Ridge Runner]

For those of you who have stallions and foals out together, how did you go about doing so? Did you put them out in seperate pastures w/ shard fencelines to get to know each other first? Did you ever worry about the stallion somehow hurting the foal and how did you go about preventing it as much as possible? I'm just really curious about this as I assumed that stallion + foals = no no.

Stallions + mares with foals = normal in nature. Stallion + 0 companions = unnatural. In a "natural" situation, a stallion would either hang out with bachelors or he'd be in a family band after fighting for the right to have mares. His job is protector to the herd and he's hardwired by nature to want to protect mares and foals...not to kill and savage them. Granted domestication has changed a few things on how horses live and are managed but it has not changed the basic nature of stallions. They are not hardwired to live solitary lives and need socialization as much as any horse...perhaps more.

That said, there are some stallions who do not get along with other horses at all...geldings or mares. They should not be kept with others and I'd question keeping them stallions personally...but a good natured stallion is important to me and one that I can trust around foals/mares is important also. You have to keep in mind that my stallions live with other horses from the time they are foals through maturity...and they are very well socialized. I would be very cautious taking an older stallion who has been isolated his whole life and turning him out with any other horse. It's common sense really.

First off, I'd make sure the stallion knows the mares before they foal whether he bred them or not...I have not found that to matter despite wives tales that they will rape mares, I've never seen nor heard of that happening first hand from someone. I would not turn a strange mare/foal out with a stallion who does not know her unless you know him very well and know how he is likely to react. My older stallion would be fine with this but my younger stallion would have to test the mare to see how she will react to him.

Make sure you have plenty of room...don't put them together in a small tight place. If fencing them side by side makes sense for a few days or is possible, I'd do that. Keep in mind that a mare will be protective of her foal and there's a good chance the stallion is in more danger than the foal is of being hurt. Watch them closely at first to make sure all are going to get along OK. Don't just turn them out and come back in three days to see how they are doing.

I've never feared for my foals at all and in every case, the stallions are gentle and protective of the babies. I'd had mares that did not work with certain stallions and vice versa but I've never had a stallion show any agression to a foal. I've seen stallions take more play from a foal than a mare will and unlike mares, they are friendly to all foals...not just to their own. I've found my stallion with a foal attached to his mane or tail or biting his hocks many times and he tolates their antics with patience and gentleness.

The one circumstance I know of where a stallion killed his own foal was a very agressive natured stallion who should have never been kept a stallion. He lived on a ranch with very little supervision out on hundreds of acres and while no one witnessed him kill the foal, it was suspected. The same stallion also killed another stallion he was pastured with in a bachelor herd over the winter. They got rid of him after that.

[lolita1]

MagicRoseFarm why would anyone who wanted to AI their mare or mares allow them to run with their own stallion at the same time. Really I know some people have no idea but that really doesn't make alot of sense.

[camohn]

For those of you who have stallions and foals out together, how did you go about doing so? Did you put them out in seperate pastures w/ shard fencelines to get to know each other first? Did you ever worry about the stallion somehow hurting the foal and how did you go about preventing it as much as possible? I'm just really curious about this as I assumed that stallion + foals = no no.

The stallion was turned out with the bred mares prior to foaling. I started turning Mr. Studly #1 out with foals when he was removed from the mare and foal pasture at foaling time. His son kept slipping through the flex fence TO him. Several mornings I went out and found the colt in HIS pasture. He was being a good boy nuzzling the colt. Mom was a laid back mare/ standing at the fence looking puzzled. The mare was intended to be bred back to him (it was his kid) so I ended up putting him back out with the pair. After that he was left out with them and he was a weaning buddy in subsequent years. He passed away/his son has been raised the same way....he is out with preggo mares or used as a weaning buddy for foals.The 2 fillies I had last year were quite alpha and actually pushed around the poor colt!