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Totally naive question: do any WB books take Morgans?

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  • #21
    And to add: it is not that the WB are ragging on Morgnas, but most of the big WB registries are of european (german) Background and we just do not have morgans here. So no-one is taking them into consideration, but that is not the question as also no islandic ponies or Friesian horses, Knabstrubbers etc. are to be entered into most WB registries. And it is not a question of their single quality or not.
    I am not responsible for spelling misstacks - just my PC
    www.hannoveranerzuechter.de
    2017: Lissaro - SPS Don Frederico - Prince Thatch and Finnigan - Sandro Hit - Rouletto

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    • #22
      Originally posted by MysticOakRanch View Post
      RPSI and Old NA/ISR will approve Morgan mares for breeding (or almost any mare for breeding - their mare requirements are similar to AWS and AWR, including using different books), thus their offspring would be registerable if bred to an approved stallion of those registries. Old NA puts them in the ISR books, but they still compete for Oldenburg USDF awards, etc. Neither will approve a stallion of those lines. I'm a bit puzzled as to why it is OK for the mare to be of "non-Warmblood" lines, but not the stallion.
      Originally posted by everafterfarm View Post
      RPSI will approve her for the pre-mare book which means her offspring would only be able to get a COP regardless of who the sire is.
      I agree with the above two posts. I own a Morgan/Trakehner mare (dam is Morgan, sire is Pregelstrand). I bred her to Sempatico his first year in the US and took her and resulting foal to the RPSI inspection - she was put in the Pre-Mare book, though her score would have been high enough for Main Mare book had she been of 100% approvable pedigree. Her foal who was given a gold premium was given a half-brand and COP. I would think the same would be the case for a full morgan mare with a foal by an approved stallion.
      Erin
      Dodon Farm Training Center - on Facebook

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      • #23
        As long as people fret about the registry more than the quality of the cross we will be held hostage as a country by foreign registries marketing their horses to us.
        Anne
        -------
        "Where knowledge ends violence begins." B. Ljundquist

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        • #24
          Originally posted by Molly Malone View Post
          I'm almost certain the answer is no. Well, no reputable one, anyway.
          The Irish Draught Horse Society (NA) would register and inspect the ofspring o an approved RID stallion and a Morgan
          I wasn't always a Smurf
          Penmerryl's Sophie RIDSH
          "I ain't as good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was"
          The ignore list is my friend. It takes 2 to argue.

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          • #25
            Originally posted by quietann View Post
            Well, my friend's already decided not to take her filly to the WB inspection, because it just doesn't get her that much.

            I do think that those of us in the sport Morgan world get tired of our horses being ragged on by the big WB people. Sometimes I think it's a strong misperception that Morgans are only for saddleseat or driving, that they cannot canter, that they are too crazy/hot, etc. The AMHA tries to promote "other" Morgans, but is somewhat limited because the saddleseat/breed show people are the ones with the money, and with Morgan registrations having dropped precipitously (less than 1000 registrations last year, down from 3000+ ten years ago!), money talks louder than anything else.

            A good sport-bred or working western Morgan might bring something to the WB table: soundness, great hooves, trainability/willingness, and *smaller* size as many AAs realize that they do not need or want a 17-hand plus horse. But there are plenty of good WBs out there, so it's not something they "need."
            FWIW I saw the Spanish Riding School in NYC in the 60's. There were two non Lips in the program....both Morgans
            I wasn't always a Smurf
            Penmerryl's Sophie RIDSH
            "I ain't as good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was"
            The ignore list is my friend. It takes 2 to argue.

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            • #26
              Originally posted by quietann View Post

              I do think that those of us in the sport Morgan world get tired of our horses being ragged on by the big WB people. Sometimes I think it's a strong misperception that Morgans are only for saddleseat or driving, that they cannot canter, that they are too crazy/hot, etc. The AMHA tries to promote "other" Morgans, but is somewhat limited because the saddleseat/breed show people are the ones with the money, and with Morgan registrations having dropped precipitously (less than 1000 registrations last year, down from 3000+ ten years ago!), money talks louder than anything else.

              A good sport-bred or working western Morgan might bring something to the WB table: soundness, great hooves, trainability/willingness, and *smaller* size as many AAs realize that they do not need or want a 17-hand plus horse. But there are plenty of good WBs out there, so it's not something they "need."
              The Warmblood registries are based on a European model - Morgan is an American breed. I always call them the "Original American Warmbloods" for exactly the reasons you point out - the sport bred ones can be awesome! And in at least one international sport (CDE), their smaller size and incredible stamina and "go" makes them top competitors. I have owned a few over the years, and all of them had great canters. A few were very talented jumpers - and I knew a Morgan who went Advanced in eventing, and quite a few who are at the mid levels.

              But don't expect a European based registry to support an American breed - we need to do that ourselves, here in the US.

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              • #27
                Originally posted by not again View Post
                As long as people fret about the registry more than the quality of the cross we will be held hostage as a country by foreign registries marketing their horses to us.
                I couldn't agree more!
                Patty
                www.rivervalefarm.com
                Follow us on facebook - https://www.facebook.com/pages/River...ref=ts&fref=ts

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                • #28
                  Originally posted by not again View Post
                  As long as people fret about the registry more than the quality of the cross we will be held hostage as a country by foreign registries marketing their horses to us.
                  And as long as American breeders insist on reinventing the wheel and ignoring the tons of experience available to them via the European Warmblood registries, buyers will continue to shop in Europe and imports will continue to be seen as "better" and concepts such as "American Warmblood" will continue to be viewed as a joke.
                  "No snowflake in an avalanche ever feels responsible." George Burns

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                  • #29
                    The Spanish Riding School did not have any Morgans, ever. You probably saw an American touring show which had a mix of breeds.
                    http://TouchstoneAcres.com
                    Touchstone Acres Lipizzans, Standing N. Samira VI (Gray), N. XXIX-18(Black), more in 2014

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                    • #30
                      Originally posted by TouchstoneAcres View Post
                      The Spanish Riding School did not have any Morgans, ever. You probably saw an American touring show which had a mix of breeds.
                      Podhajsky was so impressed with Morgan breed that when SRS came to US in 1963, he took two Morgans on tour with him: Parade & son, Broadwall Drum Major.

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                      • #31
                        America's Baroque Horse:

                        http://www.morgandressage.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/parade.jpg

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                        • Original Poster

                          #32
                          Originally posted by Hippolyta View Post
                          Podhajsky was so impressed with Morgan breed that when SRS came to US in 1963, he took two Morgans on tour with him: Parade & son, Broadwall Drum Major.
                          They are 5 and 4 generations back in my mare's sire line
                          You have to have experiences to gain experience.

                          1998 Morgan mare Mythic Feronia "More Valley Girl Than Girl Scout!"

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                          • Original Poster

                            #33
                            Part of the story of Parade and his son can be found here: http://www.morgandressage.org/wp-con...12-preview.pdf
                            You have to have experiences to gain experience.

                            1998 Morgan mare Mythic Feronia "More Valley Girl Than Girl Scout!"

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                            • #34
                              If the mare is trained and talented; and the foal is going to be raised and trained by the mare's owner, pick your best complementary stallion that is getting the sort of performance offspring (that means he is an older horse) you are aiming at.

                              You have a 50% chance of getting a gelding that IF it grows up and has good performance no one will care that their winning horse is 1/2 Morgan and winning horses sell for good prices. If you get a mare you just took a serious price cut, but if she also can perform she should bring decent money as a show horse.

                              If you can't train and want to sell the foal I wouldn't suggest crossbreeding at all since there is no market worth any $$, you are better off with a purebred Morgan of recognized size and sport bloodlines.

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