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Stallions and Non-Payment of the Stallion Test

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  • #61
    Originally posted by cherham View Post
    Spike that was an excellent explanation except that the CSHA is not a sport horse "registry' but a "breed" organization. There is a big difference. The "Canadian Sport Horse" is evolving to become a distinct breed under the rules of the Canada Pedigree Act (federal legislation). Warmbloods and other "suitable" sport horse type bloodlines are included in the CSHA Stud Book..pending satisfactory testing of course. This does include full TB's, Trak and some other breeds IF they meet the standards of acceptance set by the CSHA. .
    The interesting thing to me is that the Canadian Gov. has made CW do a ton of work to prove that WB is a breed, that means a detailed pedigree of 11,000 horses and each are traced back to the founding members.
    How long has CSH been evolving and when are they going to go through the same process? I would like to know the time limitations on "evolving".

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    • #62
      Originally posted by DownYonder View Post
      Reece, there are times when your bluntness is annoying. This is not one of them.
      At least I am consistent DY !

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      • #63
        I agree with Seigi on this. The registries have no legal participation in the contract between the stallion owners and the testing corporation. Given that some stallions have not paid - the testing host should require 100% pre-payment prior to a stallion even putting one hoof on their farm.
        If registries are denying the stallions the active license they are facing the possiblity of litigation unless they have some stipulation in their licensing requirements that they have to provide proof of payment to the testing site.
        Summit Sporthorses Ltd. Inc.
        "Breeding Competition Partners & Lifelong Friends"

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        • #64
          Wouldn’t it cost more for a SO to sue a registry, than what the SO owes for the testing?

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          • #65
            But cheapest overall to threaten to sue and hope to scare/bully people into doing what you want.

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            • #66
              Originally posted by Galileo1998 View Post
              But cheapest overall to threaten to sue and hope to scare/bully people into doing what you want.
              Oh yeah, that does seem to be SOP for some folks...

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              • #67
                Originally posted by cherham View Post
                Spike that was an excellent explanation except that the CSHA is not a sport horse "registry' but a "breed" organization. There is a big difference. The "Canadian Sport Horse" is evolving to become a distinct breed under the rules of the Canada Pedigree Act (federal legislation). Warmbloods and other "suitable" sport horse type bloodlines are included in the CSHA Stud Book..pending satisfactory testing of course. This does include full TB's, Trak and some other breeds IF they meet the standards of acceptance set by the CSHA. But basically what you have said is true.....if a stallion has been approved and therefore met the selection criteria of most of the other warmblood registries (not all however) then pending the satisfactory fees and paperwork being submitted those stallions would be eligive to be approved and licenced for breeding by the CSHA under the sight unseen category. Both the CWHBA and the CSHA I believe have given breeding approval to the stallions in question because they were indeed approved and already licenced by an "approved" warmblood registry already...one of the stallions in question was indeed listed as licenced and approved on one the of these warmblood organization sites not even a week ago (I have the screen capture to prove it) and a quick internet search on the archive site still shows it but mysteriously that stallion's name has now been omitted. Still since he WAS approved at the time that the registration process was iniated in this case the CSHA would have accepted him based on that information. And direct confirmation from that Registry head office of course which I have no doubt was done.

                I find this to be a specious argument. I own a registered Canadian bred horse who is by Popeye K (imported in utero), and out of an anglo/trak mare. He is NOT a Canadian Breed" but was foaled in Canada by and out of 2 Canadian horses of vastly different origins. So, does that make him the same "breed" as a Holsteiner or a TB? Of course not. He is merely eligible for resitration in the same registry as ANY sport horse breed, by virtue of his country of birth.

                The Canadian registires can define anything any way they want to, but that does not change the genetics of the horse. Perhaps in 30 years, when a horse has a pedigree shoing 3 generations of Canadian licensed stallions, it might be valid to say that those horses have similar backgrounds so they might be considered a "breed" but certainly not the first generation of horses.
                "He lives in a cocoon of solipsism"

                Charles Krauthammer speaking about Trump

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                • #68
                  Originally posted by FalseImpression View Post
                  I am curious to find out what happened at the auction this past weekend... Cherham, I know you were quite anxious to bid on Aloha... and now you are upset with all this "stuff" on the internet... Did you have second thoughts? What happened with RW? I am not even sure where the results of that auction have been posted, if they were posted.
                  I am really curious though.
                  What auction are you referencing. Valuable horses being auctioned with no advertisement nor mention on this thread full of misinformation. This just gets more bizarre and ridiculous. Jill Burnell had made this a 3 ring circus for years conning people. Those poor mares and babymill foals. Just geld those okay stallions and move on. I hope that loser JB rots in her slob.

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                  • #69
                    Horses were not being auctioned. It was for his semen.
                    Draumr Hesta Farm
                    "Wenn Du denkst es geht nicht mehr, kommt von irgendwo ein kleines Licht daher"
                    Member of the COTH Ignorant Disrepectful F-bombs!*- 2Dogs Farm

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                    • #70
                      Originally posted by Lord Helpus View Post
                      The Canadian registires can define anything any way they want to, but that does not change the genetics of the horse. Perhaps in 30 years, when a horse has a pedigree shoing 3 generations of Canadian licensed stallions, it might be valid to say that those horses have similar backgrounds so they might be considered a "breed" but certainly not the first generation of horses.
                      First of all it is not the Canadian registries; it is our federal government's definition. And that definition of a breed is more stringent than most countries. It is the same definition that applies to any animal bred and registered under the Pedigree Act.
                      Secondly, it is not about where the horse was born, it is a claim that WB's from the major registries have a limited genetic pool that they can trace to a limited number of horses that have been identified. Then there is a percentage calculated for each horse as to the amount of foundation blood is in each animal. Most breeds have accepted improvement blood and especially so with horses. So that is how they are able to accept most horses that are from the major registries, as a Canadian Warmblood is simply a European horse (with the above definition) that is recorded with the Canadian registry. Check out the Dutch Warmblood, they are very successful by using the best from all the registries.....and call them Dutch.

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