• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Redwine and Aloha in Ontario, Canada

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Ugh, that really stinks. It's great they are out of there, but some folks were so excited to finally be able to use him because he was out of her hands, and now that's not the case I'm so bummed because he deserves to be *owned* by someone who actually cares about him
    ______________________________
    The CoTH CYA - please consult w/your veterinarian under any and all circumstances. - ET

    Comment


    • Originally posted by DownYonder View Post
      I hate to say it, but the fact that Ashland wouldn't confirm they owned him sure pointed to his continued ownership by JillB. And I am not surprised - he is her big moneymaker, and she isn't going to let him go easily. (I had heard ,through the grapevine she told someone who inquired about purchasing him last year that she wanted 500K for him. Yeah, right...)
      Yes... and the fact it did say "Standing for the 2013 Season"... If they had bought him, they would have bragged about it. So, are they considered Jill's minions???

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        If nobody breeds their mares to Redwine then he's not a moneymaker for her. She had such a terrible reputation that very few, if any mare owners were going to go to Jill direct. Now with a change of geography, rather than a change of ownership money still goes into her pot. The only way to stop any Jill connection to these stallions is an outright sale. A sale still gives her money, but it prevents this fiasco from affecting mare owners ever again.

        Comment


        • Redwine is an EVA Positive stallion, isn't he? Or was that Federalist or Romantic Star? I know one of them was. Doesn't Canada have any import rules on that? Is there no quarantine between Canada and the US? What about the CHSA? Anything on EVA Positive status? Does it have to be disclosed in stallion information on the website?

          The way to keep Jill Burnell from making money on her stallions is for people not to use them. And one way to do that is to make sure that people know she still owns Redwine.

          Jos, where are you? Did the Ashland guy lie to you when he said he had "purchased" Redwine?
          "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
          Thread killer Extraordinaire

          Comment


          • RW is EVA positive and it is disclosed by Ashland as they state on their FB page:: All requests for breeding contracts will be sent an EVA information sheet as well. All we want to do is service our mare owners to the best of our ability."

            Comment


            • Perhaps he did not lie so much as show all his cards. It is possible that they have purchased into the stallion half owners /partners /shares who knows. I'm sure they are also aware of the negativity surrounding Jill and perhaps choose to omit the continued connection in an attempt to keep it from affecting bookings for the stallion. Not entirely ethical or honest but I guess the burden as always is on the purchaser.

              I am sure there are plenty of mare owners who either have never heard of Jill and her issues or simply assume new location= new owner.

              At the very least now it is confirmed and people can make an educated choice about putting money in Jills pocket.
              "I would not beleive her if her tongue came notorized"

              Comment


              • Originally posted by vineyridge View Post
                Jos, where are you? Did the Ashland guy lie to you when he said he had "purchased" Redwine?
                During the course of the conversation with Paul Morgan (Ashland Farm), he referenced the following points:
                • That he had initially been approached to act as agent for the sale of the horses;
                • He twice said that he now "owned the horses";
                • He referenced possession of a Bill of Sale;
                • He told me that it would be acceptable to him if I posted that information on the Internet.
                If any of those points are subsequently found to be untrue, then it would be correct to say that he lied to me in making them.

                I hope this clarifies the veracity of the conversation, as I see it.

                Regards to all,
                Jos Mottershead
                Equine-Reproduction.com LLC
                EquineRepro Informational Group

                Comment


                • Interestingly enough Ashland farms is for sale and has had a little trouble over the past two years keeping things running....

                  http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetail...ey=-2067531347

                  I would be very suspect that they own any of these new stallions and are only looking for a cash grab with these "big" names

                  Red wine looked IR in most of the pictures I have seen, along with a meh show record and EVA positive-I'd never consider him even with his pretty white legs.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by JB View Post
                    Ugh, that really stinks. It's great they are out of there, but some folks were so excited to finally be able to use him because he was out of her hands, and now that's not the case I'm so bummed because he deserves to be *owned* by someone who actually cares about him
                    Well he may be in a better place now, but since Jill still owns him, she can take him back to her own place later on.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by melhorse View Post
                      Interestingly enough Ashland farms is for sale and has had a little trouble over the past two years keeping things running....

                      http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetail...ey=-2067531347

                      I would be very suspect that they own any of these new stallions and are only looking for a cash grab with these "big" names

                      Red wine looked IR in most of the pictures I have seen, along with a meh show record and EVA positive-I'd never consider him even with his pretty white legs.
                      Sorry but Ick. I hate the stallion being picked on rather than the people. I love Redwine and when I compare his brief record to a slew of stallions I see out there that don't do a thing, haven't showed and look awful I would choose him in a heartbeat if under a new owner.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Jos View Post
                        During the course of the conversation with Paul Morgan (Ashland Farm), he referenced the following points:
                        • That he had initially been approached to act as agent for the sale of the horses;
                        • He twice said that he now "owned the horses";
                        • He referenced possession of a Bill of Sale;
                        • He told me that it would be acceptable to him if I posted that information on the Internet.

                        If any of those points are subsequently found to be untrue, then it would be correct to say that he lied to me in making them.

                        I hope this clarifies the veracity of the conversation, as I see it.

                        Regards to all,
                        Wait...Ashland AND Pikturesque (or however it's spelled...not looking back right now) both own Aloha? I thought Pikturesque bought him outright and Ashland was only standing him.

                        More mud...
                        "IT'S NOT THE MOUNTAIN WE CONQUER, BUT OURSELVES." SIR EDMUND HILLARYMember of the "Someone Special To Me Serves In The Military" Clique

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by melhorse View Post
                          Interestingly enough Ashland farms is for sale and has had a little trouble over the past two years keeping things running....

                          http://www.realtor.ca/propertyDetail...ey=-2067531347

                          I would be very suspect that they own any of these new stallions and are only looking for a cash grab with these "big" names

                          Red wine looked IR in most of the pictures I have seen, along with a meh show record and EVA positive-I'd never consider him even with his pretty white legs.
                          Troll. Nice first post. This is not about picking on the stallions. Go back under the bridge.
                          Come to the dark side, we have cookies

                          Comment


                          • Sorry not a troll at all! I have been on this site for four years but was away for a few months and can not reactivate my account due to the crazy questions I can never get correct. Much easier to create a new account.

                            I am entitled to my opinion as much as anyone else

                            Comment


                            • Yes, there was discussion about RW being IR (in fact I think I may have started that when pics were posted about a few thousand pages ago). It was very apparent. The fatty, cresty neck and "muffins butt" are so telltale. If other horse in her care were starving, most IRs never look like it unless you look at the ribs...and one couldn't see those in the pics.

                              My elderly stallion became IR, as did most likely Secretriat and others who fell to laminitis in their senior years, despite the very best of care...I digress.

                              Personally, I would never breed a stallion that had become IR as it would most likely mean an earlier death from the hormonal stressors (despite the fun for them). At that stage frozen semen would be the best course.

                              Was RW ever frozen? If not, as popular as he was, I'm surprised that he wasn't or isn't. I digress again.

                              Just looking out for the horses' best interests, stallion or not...as that was the intention of the beginning of this thread.

                              If RW is to continue stand, I sure hope those who are standing him understand IR and what a wretched condition it can be and do what is best for the boy.
                              www.littlebullrun@aol.com See Little Bull Run's stallions at:
                              "Argosy" - YouTube and "Boleem" - YouTube
                              Boleem @ 1993 National Dressage Symposium - YouTube

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by sid View Post
                                Yes, there was discussion about RW being IR (in fact I think I may have started that when pics were posted about a few thousand pages ago). It was very apparent. The fatty, cresty neck and "muffins butt" are so telltale. If other horse in her care were starving, most IRs never look like it unless you look at the ribs...and one couldn't see those in the pics.

                                My elderly stallion became IR, as did most likely Secretriat and others who fell to laminitis in their senior years, despite the very best of care...I digress.

                                Personally, I would never breed a stallion that had become IR as it would most likely mean an earlier death from the hormonal stressors (despite the fun for them). At that stage frozen semen would be the best course.

                                Was RW ever frozen? If not, as popular as he was, I'm surprised that he wasn't or isn't. I digress again.

                                Just looking out for the horses' best interests, stallion or not...as that was the intention of the beginning of this thread.

                                If RW is to continue stand, I sure hope those who are standing him understand IR and what a wretched condition it can be and do what is best for the boy.
                                Sid - while I don't have any interest in whether RW breeds ever again- I do care that if JB still OWNS the stallion and owes money to a whole lot of people etc etc etc (which is now well known) - that then any monies collected to breed to RW (other than fullfilling poor hoodwinked mare owners who did pay and never got any semen) are NOT sent to JB - where the money goes is key and if Ashland a shill company? Shame on them
                                "Her life was okay. Sometimes she wished she were sleeping with the right man instead of with her dog, but she never felt she was sleeping with the wrong dog."



                                www.dontlookbackfarm.com

                                Comment


                                • Agree.
                                  www.littlebullrun@aol.com See Little Bull Run's stallions at:
                                  "Argosy" - YouTube and "Boleem" - YouTube
                                  Boleem @ 1993 National Dressage Symposium - YouTube

                                  Comment


                                  • Okay I know this isn't on the subject, but may someone can answer the question.. how can leading hunter breeding horse for yearling and 3 year old have unknown sire, yet the sire still gets the points for both horses according to USEF. I find this a little odd.

                                    Comment


                                    • Originally posted by Deardra75 View Post
                                      Okay I know this isn't on the subject, but may someone can answer the question.. how can leading hunter breeding horse for yearling and 3 year old have unknown sire, yet the sire still gets the points for both horses according to USEF. I find this a little odd.
                                      I am assuming one of the ones you are talking about is Red Label, who topped the USEF 3 y/o hunter breeding category in 2012 –
                                      http://www.usef.org/_IFrames/pointsA...0&section=1903

                                      If you click on Red Label's name on the above document, you get the 2012 horse report for Red Label - which shows him with an "unknown” sire.
                                      http://www.usef.org/_IFrames/Searche...ltsReport.aspx

                                      Now, if you look at the leading sire rankings for hunter breeding, you will see Redwine at the top of the leader board, with 526 points.
                                      http://www.usef.org/documents/points...erBreeding.pdf

                                      If you click on Redwine on the above PDF, you get a list of the horses that contributed to his ranking. They have Red Label listed as contributing 268 points to Redwine – yet Red Label is listed as sired by “unknown”.

                                      So if you knock off the 268 points from Red Label, Redwine’s total points drop to 258, which would actually put him 3rd place in the 2012 rankings – behind Ragtime and Aloha.

                                      And one of the horses shown as contributing to Aloha’s ranking is Arbor Day – who is also listed as being sired by “unknown”.

                                      Perhaps JillB shouldn’t have screwed around with Brandon…

                                      Comment


                                      • yup thats what I was thinking too.

                                        Comment


                                        • That is truly…odd. I'm curious as to why that was even allowed?
                                          Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people.
                                          W. C. Fields

                                          Comment

                                          Working...
                                          X