• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Is there a shortage of TB Stallions approved by Warmblood Registries in North America

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #21
    I'm hardly an expert, but it seems to me that not many competitors in the U.S. care much about the stallion being "approved". Eventers seem to care about performance and the prepotency of the stallion.
    Perhaps it would matter if you are breeding eventers to sell in the U.K. or Europe, but is that really what U.S. breeders are trying to do?

    I think we can make our own very well, if we put our minds to it, without the approval process. Of course some folks will pay more for the approved.
    Last edited by skydy; Nov. 16, 2012, 12:54 AM.

    Comment


    • #22
      I know of the following:

      A Fine Romance
      Best Minister
      Goldmaker
      Innkeeper
      Rodeo
      Sea Accounts
      Sea Lion

      I think all the above except Best Minister and Rodeo are approved by ISR/ONA, although A Fine Romance and Sea Accounts are not on their current stallion roster (maybe were not activated for 2012?).

      Rodeo and Sea Accounts are approved by OHBS/GOV, but Rodeo was apparently not activated for 2012. I believe he may also be approved for Danish WB breeding.

      Best Minister and Goldmaker are listed in studbook I with RPSI. I thought someone had posted on the other thread that RPSI required 90 pts at the SPT for breeding approval, and Baatesh had 85 points, but I believe Goldmaker earned less than 90 pts last year (88.70), so perhaps they would also accept Baatesh into Book I.

      Comment


      • #23
        Originally posted by skydy View Post
        I'm hardly an expert, but it seems to me that not many competitors in the U.S. care much about the stallion being "approved". Eventers seem to care about performance and the prepotency of the stallion.
        Perhaps it would matter if you are breeding eventers to sell in the U.K. or Europe, but is that really what U.S. breeders are trying to do?

        I think we can make our own very well, if we put our minds to it, without the approval process. Of course some folks will pay more for the approved.
        But if the offspring are not being being DNA'd for parentage verification, and the confirmed bloodlines are not recorded into a database, how do breeders know what works and doesn't work? (And yes, I know JC requires live cover, but breeders can always register with PHR.)

        Also, as has been pointed out many times on this forum and others, sometimes registration papers can help a horse land softly later in life. It's often easier to market and place a "registered" horse whose identity can be confirmed, than an unregistered one with no known history - esp. if it is a mare.

        Comment


        • #24
          Originally posted by DownYonder View Post
          I know of the following:

          A Fine Romance
          Best Minister
          Goldmaker
          Innkeeper
          Rodeo
          Sea Accounts
          Sea Lion

          I think all the above except Best Minister and Rodeo are approved by ISR/ONA, although A Fine Romance and Sea Accounts are not on their current stallion roster (maybe were not activated for 2012?).

          Rodeo and Sea Accounts are approved by OHBS/GOV, but Rodeo was apparently not activated for 2012. I believe he may also be approved for Danish WB breeding.

          Best Minister and Goldmaker are listed in studbook I with RPSI. I thought someone had posted on the other thread that RPSI required 90 pts at the SPT for breeding approval, and Baatesh had 85 points, but I believe Goldmaker earned less than 90 pts last year (88.70), so perhaps they would also accept Baatesh into Book I.
          I don't believe Sea Accounts has ever been on the Old na/Isr roster.
          He is approved GOV. and ATA.

          I also noticed that RPSI has been approving stallions with less than 90 points.
          Last year there was one approved RPSI with less than 90 points and this year if Baatesh was approved then there were two RPSI approvals with less than 90 points.

          I could not find anything on the RPSI website that stated they require 90 points, although that was the value they did require in the past.
          All the website currently says is 'successfully completed' but I can't find any definition of what 'successfully completed' means. Anybody know?
          Fan of Sea Accounts

          Comment

          • Original Poster

            #25
            I am learning. ha ha

            Based on information gathered here, I think if I were stallion shopping, I would be most curious about the tb stallion "Rather Well" paticularly if I were looking specifically at eventing. He has an impressive competition record through Advanced, and remaining sound through the rigors of eventing is an approval process in itself. How are his offspring doing?

            Age also becomes a factor. Stallions up and around 20 years of age are possibly in danger of less motility in semen... not a fact for sure, but a consideration. Individual cases may vary of course.

            Both Innkeeper and A Fine Romance hold very high regard as well.

            In the ranks of CSH approvals, even stallions who stand at Ravine Ranch are certainly very good free moving strong individuals... who's main job is in the breeding shed... and this is looking at the PMU farms. Hey a good horse is a good horse and who doesn't mind a bargain now and then?

            You can see short vido clips on their pages here. Mind you a clip doesn't say a lot but I think the ingredients are there.

            http://www.ravineranchsporthorses.co...ge=voodoo-kiss
            http://www.ravineranchsporthorses.co...tespiritrunner


            I took a chance and bought a filly from their program this year. As an older person and not necessarily looking for "star" quality, I made temperament and amateur friendly as my highest priorities in stating my "wants"... well I am very pleasantly surprised at the result. She carries 5/8 Hanoverian blood plus equal portions of (tb, APHA and Percheron) in the mix. She comes papered as CSH. For me... right now... in my life... She is just right.
            Sorry to run off on a tangent but it is all connected... one way or another. ha ha
            http://regcorkumlive.blogspot.com/

            Comment


            • #26
              Originally posted by Sheila A View Post
              Ivory Coast is recorded with RPSI (Studbook II). I bought a filly by him this year and I believe she has a full brand.

              Very likely she doesn't. If he is recorded in Studbook II she would only have the half brand.

              RPSI's brand is a bridge with a crown over it, symbolizing the bridge over the Rhine River and the crown of the duke who founded the German breeding program. Foals born to a mare and stallion with four generations of registered bloodline excellence receive a full brand with a crown. Those pedigrees with fewer generations or an unregistered ancestor receive a half brand. All foals are branded with the last two digits of their life number under the RPSI brand, which serves as a lifelong identifying mark and appears in their passport registration papers.

              http://www.rhpsi.com/

              Shows the full brand on upper left corner. Half brand has the crown above the arches removed
              Draumr Hesta Farm
              "Wenn Du denkst es geht nicht mehr, kommt von irgendwo ein kleines Licht daher"
              Member of the COTH Ignorant Disrepectful F-bombs!*- 2Dogs Farm

              Comment


              • #27
                Hunters Peak TB stallion Minister General (Deputy Minister x Rosa's Cantina) is an ISR/OLD N/A approved stallion.
                www.hunterspeaksporthorses.com

                Comment


                • #28
                  Originally posted by Hocus Focus View Post
                  I took a chance and bought a filly from their program this year. As an older person and not necessarily looking for "star" quality, I made temperament and amateur friendly as my highest priorities in stating my "wants"... well I am very pleasantly surprised at the result. She carries 5/8 Hanoverian blood plus equal portions of (tb, APHA and Percheron) in the mix. She comes papered as CSH. For me... right now... in my life... She is just right.
                  Sorry to run off on a tangent but it is all connected... one way or another. ha ha
                  How can you say this and not post a picture? Especially since you take beautiful pictures?!?!
                  Draumr Hesta Farm
                  "Wenn Du denkst es geht nicht mehr, kommt von irgendwo ein kleines Licht daher"
                  Member of the COTH Ignorant Disrepectful F-bombs!*- 2Dogs Farm

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    HF - LOVE LOVE LOVE Rather Well! He's the "real deal" for sure and one of those little known / little used stallions

                    I owned his dam way back when (should NEVER have sold that one!) and Rather Well was the result when Garry Roque leased her to breed to his stallion - Raj Kapoor

                    He jumps a "10" consistently, is brave and forward and quick. His offspring all appear to be the same

                    Check out his FB page - there are some really incredible pictures of him on there as well as his offspring

                    And I believe he is only approved CSHA but due to his Advanced Level eventing status his foals should get the nod to be registered in various WB registries due to his performance record
                    www.TrueColoursFarm.com
                    www.truecoloursproducts.com

                    True Colours Farm on Facebook

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      My thoughts mostly apply to breeding eventers with the biggest issue being that people in the US don't really buy young event prospects. They want a horse that is already going. There are exceptions of course. The really superbly bred foals from VERY proven or exciting lines may sell as foals, but if you are breeding anything less, you need to be prepared to 1) keep it till it is competing or 2)produce something that will also be appealing to a dressage or H/J and in that case, if they don't know and love the parents, a brand really helps. Of course there is option 3- sell for peanuts but I don't know anyone who wants to breed and sell at a loss.

                      If I was in a position to know that I could keep any foal I produced forever and never have to worry about it being marketable I would probably use a lot of the TB stallions that appeal to me, but in the current financial climate, I can't imagine producing an unregisterable foal (unless I am breeding something like Headley Brittania to Flertwater Opposition, in which case the bloodlines sell themselves- and I believe even HB's foals are being registered)
                      The rebel in the grey shirt

                      Comment

                      • Original Poster

                        #31
                        Originally posted by Nootka View Post
                        How can you say this and not post a picture? Especially since you take beautiful pictures?!?!
                        ha ha... Ok. I will give you a preview. She is just a baby remember and has much maturing to do..but for me, she is a Fun horse, and a good one. Remember these are taken in the frozen north and she has her winter woolies. So here's a peek for the open mind...ha

                        http://regcorkum13.blogspot.ca/
                        http://regcorkumlive.blogspot.com/

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          OMG she looks super sweet!!

                          She looks like a sturdy little thang and red is sooo her color
                          Draumr Hesta Farm
                          "Wenn Du denkst es geht nicht mehr, kommt von irgendwo ein kleines Licht daher"
                          Member of the COTH Ignorant Disrepectful F-bombs!*- 2Dogs Farm

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            I agree completely with JWB. I do breed Eventers and would not breed either an unapproved mare or to an unapproved stallion, no matter how nice. If they are that nice, then get approvals on them. I have bred to TB stallions like Fred, but unfortunately, the TB crosses or full TBs will not bring any money until they are out winning.
                            I still like TBs and even bought a very nice mare off the track this year to compete and then breed, but unless you are breeding for yourself, it is very hard to sell a cross as a baby.
                            Not the way it should be, but that's what happens...
                            http://www.cngsporthorses.com

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              Originally posted by Hunters Peak View Post
                              Hunters Peak TB stallion Minister General (Deputy Minister x Rosa's Cantina) is an ISR/OLD N/A approved stallion.
                              He is not approved. He is not on the current stallion roster. http://www.isroldenburg.org/?pid=sta...b0c10ded534c54

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                He is approved, just not currently active. I have his 2009 daughter branded and papered in my barn. She was inspected and branded at the Summit Sporthorse inspection in 2010.
                                www.hunterspeaksporthorses.com

                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  Originally posted by Hunters Peak View Post
                                  He is approved, just not currently active. I have his 2009 daughter branded and papered in my barn. She was inspected and branded at the Summit Sporthorse inspection in 2010.
                                  He is not on the inactive list either. If he was never presented for inspection, he was never approved. He did not earn anywhere close to enough on the track to be approved without going through a performance test either, and I truly doubt he did a 70/100 day test. It's easy enough to research. It's the same thing as the Grand Sovereign stallion on your site being advertised as approved RPSI when he is not. He is simply recorded into Stud Book II as he has no performance record/test.

                                  The baby probably has an ISR brand which means one or both parents are not approved.
                                  Last edited by COTHalter44; Nov. 18, 2012, 04:05 AM. Reason: more research

                                  Comment


                                  • #37
                                    Mare has the Oldenburg brand not ISR brand. I'm sure her owner will be more than happy to provide you with a copy of her papers. Plus, pictures of her with the brand. In fact, there are pictures from 2010 Warrenton Horse show clearly showing her brand. The inspection was only two weeks prior to the show. Since your an expert, I'm sure you are well aware they won't put the Oldenburg brand on foal by an unapproved stallion. Odd that Couture Du Jour (Minister General x Grande Desire) does indeed have the brand, and registration papers.
                                    www.hunterspeaksporthorses.com

                                    Comment

                                    • Original Poster

                                      #38
                                      Enough of the quibbling. Nobody benefits from that.
                                      http://regcorkumlive.blogspot.com/

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        Originally posted by PINE TREE FARM SC View Post
                                        I don't believe Sea Accounts has ever been on the Old na/Isr roster.
                                        He is approved GOV. and ATA.

                                        I also noticed that RPSI has been approving stallions with less than 90 points.
                                        Last year there was one approved RPSI with less than 90 points and this year if Baatesh was approved then there were two RPSI approvals with less than 90 points.

                                        I could not find anything on the RPSI website that stated they require 90 points, although that was the value they did require in the past.
                                        All the website currently says is 'successfully completed' but I can't find any definition of what 'successfully completed' means. Anybody know?
                                        You are probably right about Sea Accounts - for some reason I thought he had been licensed by ISR at one point.

                                        Comment


                                        • #40
                                          Originally posted by Hunters Peak View Post
                                          ... I'm sure you are well aware they won't put the Oldenburg brand on foal by an unapproved stallion. Odd that Couture Du Jour (Minister General x Grande Desire) does indeed have the brand, and registration papers.
                                          This is a rather amusing statement because ISR/ONA routinely puts the "Oldenburg" brand on foals sired by stallions that are not considered approved or even eligible for approval by the Oldenburg Verband. A recent example is the Don de Marco situation...

                                          But it seems it would be easy enough to look up Minister General in past ISR/ONA stallion books to confirm whether he was in fact licensed. Perhaps Hunters Peak can tell us when and where he was inspected?

                                          Comment

                                          Working...
                                          X