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Looking for Info on Stallion Named "Special Event"

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  • #21
    I completely agree that unsoundness can come from the mares side... but when multiple horses out of DIFFERENT mares have soundness/stopping issues you do have to take a look at the sire. I am just mentioning the cases I know of, that is why I am asking if anyone else has had soundness issues with their babies -- it DOES happen, not every stallion is perfect.
    My Pictures! http://community.webshots.com/user/estieg12
    *Harbour Town* 2002 Hanoverian gelding "Otto"
    *Sahalee* 2002 mare "Flower" but who knows what breed she is!

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    • #22
      EM-- I know of some Special Events who have had lameness issues, yes. Different dams, both with issues. Related to sire? Not sure, but both were good hunters. One was very agressive and mouthy though, the other not so much. SE himself was injured and never had a career of any kind, gorgeous to look at (I saw him when he stood at North Star) and clearly passes on a good jump. But...I worry about the leg/foot issues I"ve seen and heard of. Just my two cents...
      Proud member of the "Don't rush to kill wildlife" clique!

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      • #23
        For sure the stopping issues did not come from Pool. I will defend him there. He did the GP's despite his amateur owner who gave him an unbelievable ride, if you get what I mean. That is one of the things people said when they bred to him. His offspring were up and down the coast in the hunters. I think people should be careful of saying a horse passes on soundness issues based on - how many horses and why were they lame. In Pool's case it is a bit irrelevant now, although there is still frozen available. My mare, by Pool, would go through fire and does not know what a stop is. She is bold and gorgeous.
        Proud member of People Who Hate to Kill Wildlife clique

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        • #24
          Odd. Our Pool mare was a stopper of biblical proportions...but again, it takes two to tango, so her mom may have contributed (although she produced other babies from other sires who were not stoppers...). There are lots of Pool babies in the PNW (well, teenagers, now) and some were stoppers, lookers at the least. Some were very successful, but not all were ammie rides. Pool was legendary in his willingness to take care of his rider,but I don't think all his progeny inherited that ability. Without careful study, this is all "I had and I saw" stuff anyway, but it is important that not just the wonderful stuff gets reported. .
          Proud member of the "Don't rush to kill wildlife" clique!

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          • #25
            FP is very old and I doubt any comments make much difference now. I remember him on the track where he was a major bust. He was legendary for his ability to pack his rider but not all of h is foals were that easy. He probably was by todays standards a genetic freak as he really did not have the pedigree to back up his performance. He was sort of high hocked and a bit weak behind. Some of his TB foals were down right weedy and not very correct. Club feet c/b a problem. He was best on a WB or very strong TB (both build and pedigree). Few would dispute the Final Pool x Silver lining offspring were the best.Like most stallions he wasn't perfect but he is remembered with respect on the West Coast. JMHO
            Last edited by Dinah-do; Sep. 17, 2008, 12:13 PM. Reason: spelling

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            • #26
              Originally posted by Calvincrowe View Post
              Odd. Our Pool mare was a stopper of biblical proportions...but again, it takes two to tango, so her mom may have contributed (although she produced other babies from other sires who were not stoppers...). There are lots of Pool babies in the PNW (well, teenagers, now) and some were stoppers, lookers at the least. Some were very successful, but not all were ammie rides. Pool was legendary in his willingness to take care of his rider,but I don't think all his progeny inherited that ability. Without careful study, this is all "I had and I saw" stuff anyway, but it is important that not just the wonderful stuff gets reported. .
              I completely agree --- it is something that breeders and buyers deserve to know. Just because a stallion is not a stopper and was a great ammy horse, does not automatically mean that his offspring are the same. Especially if he is throwing soundness issues that result in stopping.

              Look at All The Gold for instance. He is another stallion that does have a tendency to throw large babies with very small feet that can lead to soundness issues.

              The stallion owners may not like it, but this is the business of breeding. If I am a mare owner, I want to know the good and the bad to make an informed decision. Stallion owners can't take offense -- it is a business.

              Especially with WB geldings, their papers never really seem to follow them as they are bought and sold. Like with my horse, I wish I knew his family tree because I would love to know if quarter cracks run in the family. I love his look, his jump, bone structure etc and would breed a mare to his father but not if his father was known for throwing bad feet.

              It's very different with race horses for example because the horse is registered and had a "public" career. Like with mare owners breeding to Big Brown - they know he has shit feet and it is their own decision to take the chance and breed to him. Sport horse breeders deserve the same.

              I do have respect for Final Pool, I was just interested to see if anyone else had similar issues with some of his babies. I don't think anyone disagrees that Silver Lining was a phenomenal mare and they made some great babies that were very successful.
              My Pictures! http://community.webshots.com/user/estieg12
              *Harbour Town* 2002 Hanoverian gelding "Otto"
              *Sahalee* 2002 mare "Flower" but who knows what breed she is!

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              • #27
                Is there frozen still available from Pool?? Wow - I did have a Pool Filly that got colic and had to be put down. I don't know if she would have been a stopper or would have had any soundness issues but her temperment was wonderful.
                Another friend of mine still has a Pool mare but I don't think she ever showed her. As far as I know she didn't/doesn't have any soundness issues.
                The problem with political jokes is that they get elected.
                H. Cate

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                • #28
                  Originally posted by JGHIRETIRE View Post
                  Is there frozen still available from Pool??
                  Yes there is. I guess he's 31 now!!
                  Tracy Geller
                  www.sixpoundfarm.com
                  Find me on Facebook!

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                  • #29
                    That's something I might have to look into. It has been a huge desire for me to have a Final Pool foal since the temperment of the one I had was so wonderful. Thinking...............thinking.................th inking............
                    The problem with political jokes is that they get elected.
                    H. Cate

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                    • #30
                      That was one of the things the handlers of Pool emphasised - his temperament. He was a stunning mover, wonder if they still have his video of when he was being shown by Michael Boggs in his prime.
                      Proud member of People Who Hate to Kill Wildlife clique

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                      • #31
                        Pool won $800.00 on the track! Something to be proud of because he was not built to run, but to jump. He had a nice uphill build. I actually disagree that he did not have pedigree behind him, but that's ok!
                        Proud member of People Who Hate to Kill Wildlife clique

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                        • #32
                          I remember looking up what he won on the track - a whopping 800 bucks!!
                          I would imagine the video of Michael showing Pool is still around somewhere.
                          Michael and Leslie were absolutely awesome in what they did.
                          The problem with political jokes is that they get elected.
                          H. Cate

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                          • #33
                            Originally posted by Foxtrot's View Post
                            I actually disagree that he did not have pedigree behind him, but that's ok!
                            I like his pedigree. Four crosses on the damline back to The Tetrarch.
                            Fan of Sea Accounts

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                            • #34
                              I did not remember that he has Seabiscuit back there too.
                              The problem with political jokes is that they get elected.
                              H. Cate

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                              • #35
                                I had a Final Pool daughter that was fabulous. No soundness problems of any kind, and no stopping issues, either. She was very steady with great form. She could get a bit lazy. She is still in FL at age 17. Unfortunately they never bred her. She is 16H and her dam is a Polish Arabian (owned by Ursula Shaw of North Star).

                                A friend of mine liked her so much, she bred her Arabian mare to Special Event. That resulting gelding is a fabulous hunter for a Junior rider.

                                Below is a photo of Final Pool, and my mare by him, Final Choice.
                                Attached Files
                                The Inverted Y
                                Thoroughbred and Anglo Arabian Sporthorses
                                2005 and 2007 USEF Breeder of the Year.
                                www.allanglos.net

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                                • #36
                                  Originally posted by EMWalker View Post
                                  I completely agree --- it is something that breeders and buyers deserve to know. Just because a stallion is not a stopper and was a great ammy horse, does not automatically mean that his offspring are the same. Especially if he is throwing soundness issues that result in stopping.

                                  Look at All The Gold for instance. He is another stallion that does have a tendency to throw large babies with very small feet that can lead to soundness issues.

                                  The stallion owners may not like it, but this is the business of breeding. If I am a mare owner, I want to know the good and the bad to make an informed decision. Stallion owners can't take offense -- it is a business.
                                  I think this issue might well have something to do with Europe's present domination of the sport horse market: in European discussions, remarks like "Landgraf had poorly conformed hind legs he tended to pass on," and "Contender is herring-gutted," are quite commonplace, and help breeders make informed decisions without arousing ire in the stallion owners, who seem to realize that their horses are only helped through the elimination of inappropriate matches. Here, I've known people to get irate PM's from stallion owners if they so much as suggest their horse might have an imperfection.

                                  I don't know whether it's the result of different cultures/perceptions of what is and is not polite; or because (perhaps?) sport horses stallions there are as much in the public eye, and as fully documented as racehorses are here; or because (perhaps?) Sport Horse stallions in Europe do not have as hard a time getting mares as they do here so they don't feel the same pressure to be "perfect"-- for every mare; and/or because the stallion critiques originate from recognized authorities instead of a grab bag of people shooting their mouths off whether qualified or not.... I have no doubt, however, that the open discussion of the pros and cons of horses and their families has been at the heart of European successes in selective breeding.
                                  http://www.tunnelsendfarm.com

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                                  • #37
                                    I agree Fish. I thnk the biggest difference in Europe is that most of these places are "stallion stations" and have multiple stallions. It truly is the business of breeding better horses. Not just Susie Stallion Owner who thinks her boy will match every mare perfectly.
                                    In Europe, if a stallion fails to produce, throws bad babies with problems, etc then the stallion is cut and sent on his way. They don't take it pesonally, it truly is "just business".
                                    Iron Spring Farm is a good example of this State side. They had Neptune who was by Roemer and he wasn't breeding enough mares and wasn't competing at a high enough level to keep his "status" with the KWPN, so they stopped standing him. It was business and he wasn't a producer.

                                    I think Final Pool had some very nice babies. There were ones I knew with soundness issues and/or stopping problems. I posted this because I wanted to know if other people had issues as well or if these were just flukes. I thnk if people are going to be in the Breeding BUSINESS they need to leave personal feelings aside and treat it like a business. JMPO tho.
                                    My Pictures! http://community.webshots.com/user/estieg12
                                    *Harbour Town* 2002 Hanoverian gelding "Otto"
                                    *Sahalee* 2002 mare "Flower" but who knows what breed she is!

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      A friend of mine has a Special event daughter. She had a septic hock as a foal so is only used as a broodmare. She's never thrown a horse that wasn't drop dead gorgeous and athletic. I love that mare!

                                      Here is a link to her page:

                                      http://www.magicarpetshowhorses.com/lyla.html

                                      I own the second bay filly in the picture. That's my Ironman foal, nickname is Pressie.
                                      * Sunny * Ella (2006 filly) * Tank (2008 colt)*

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                                      • #39
                                        Katie16 - Did you have any luck finding Special Event???
                                        The problem with political jokes is that they get elected.
                                        H. Cate

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                                        • #40
                                          Guys, as I said before...he's not hard to find...I'm going to his barn for a lesson in a few hours. Fire me off an email if you'd like Nancy and Karen's phone number to discuss him.
                                          Andrea Clibborn-Anderson
                                          www.crestlinefarm.com
                                          Home of Pinto Dutch Warmblood Palladio

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