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Breeders of NA speak up!

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  • #21
    Until our national governing body comes up with a way to successfully track horses for life using one true identification number we will just be a parenthesis in the eyes of the world, and a good place to dump lesser horses.
    Anne
    -------
    "Where knowledge ends violence begins." B. Ljundquist

    Comment


    • #22
      It would be nice to have 2 day young horse shows.

      I live in Arizona. Not only do we not have hunter breeding classes, the only schooling shows we have are usually one day shows and one ring with no young horse classes. They shows are targeted for young riders, not young horses.

      I have a 4 year old that is just starting to jump. I feel like a one day schooling show with tons of young kids showing for the first time is a little worrisome to bring a young horse around.

      The schooling ring could be a disaster and the last thing I would want is my horse to have a bad experience.

      Luckily I can break my own young ones, but I still don't have an adequate jumping facility at home, so I took my baby to a local trainer that is helping me.

      So I plan to take him to 2 rated 5 day shows, only showing the first 2 days in baby greens but still having to pay all the fees for the week! The shows will easily cost 350 to 500 each.

      Will I get that back when I sell him? We will see!

      Most trainers don't want to break young horses, many can't even do it properly when they do!

      Bring on the young horse schooling shows!!!!

      Comment


      • #23
        Not to derail this topic but

        Originally posted by Sakura Hill Farm View Post
        we are happy to say that it has become a go-to event on the Ocala schedule, as we had hoped it would.
        You may be happy to say it, but I don't believe it's true. I've many breeder and trainer friends in Florida, and I'm going to respectfully disagree that the YHS is a go-to event for Ocala, unless by that you mean because there is nothing else much going on in Ocala in October.

        I've heard it straight from the horse's mouth from prominent breeder/trainer friends who will not support the YHS shows because of some of the people tied to it, perhaps in line with what DownYonder may be alluding to. The YHS concept is sound in theory. In practice however it reminds me of the warning that you may be judged by the company you keep.

        It might be of more benefit to the YHS to take into account these concerns and make changes if needed, rather than getting defensive and discounting these concerns because they're not what someone wants to hear.

        Because otherwise the YHS idea is a good one. (As are schooling shows, which also give youngsters mileage at a fraction of the cost of a recognized show. An owner doesn't have to spend a fortune or send their youngsters to Florida for the winter just to get some ring time.)
        "No snowflake in an avalanche ever feels responsible." George Burns

        Comment


        • #24
          I had actually been fetching the web address for the proofs from the September Ocala YHS before the previous post went up!

          Sometimes pictures are worth a thousand words!

          http://www.theequinemediaproject.com/proofs.html

          As I had said, I am not getting into a debate ---much less a train wreck. All are entitled to voice their own opinions of course!
          Sakura Hill Farm
          Now on Facebook

          Young and developing horses for A-circuit jumper and hunter rings.

          Comment


          • #25
            Originally posted by Samotis View Post
            The schooling ring could be a disaster and the last thing I would want is my horse to have a bad experience.
            Not singling you out, but I understand where you coming from and one thing that could be done is with fellow local breeders organize just a one-day, informal thing at one's farm where young horses experience that sort of thing. It doesn't need to be a "real" show environment!

            I know Hunts also offer a divison, I *think* it is hilltopping, to introduce young horses to the concept.

            Be creative! It might not be perfect, but I think there are ways to garner experience without spending a fortune, even in NA.
            www.EquusMagnificus.ca
            Breeding & Sales
            Facebook | YouTube

            Comment


            • #26
              Originally posted by Sakura Hill Farm View Post
              As I had said, I am not getting into a debate ---much less a train wreck. All are entitled to voice their own opinions of course!
              That's all well and good, but the head in the sand approach isn't going to fix, improve, or grow these shows All the more the shame, because the YHS idea has potential.
              "No snowflake in an avalanche ever feels responsible." George Burns

              Comment


              • #27
                Not trying to create a “train wreck” regarding YHS, but the fact remains that at one time, the entry form specified that a certain amount of money ($5?) of each entry fee would be allocated for the North American Studbook. I do not know if this provision is still in effect or not, but a fair number of folks were not happy about one specific registry being singled out to benefit financially from the shows – esp. since YSH and NAS are privately held organizations (not non-profits), and the same handful of individuals own/run both organizations (Saret and Jean-Yves Tola of Jump Start Farm, and Lisa Lourie of Spy Coast Farm). As mentioned before on this forum, various breeders with deep-seated ties to OTHER registries were not terribly inclined to help fund another studbook.

                It’s all well and good for supporters to “talk up” the YHS series, but it is also important that the full story regarding the financial aspect should not be swept under the carpet.

                Comment


                • #28
                  Not to belabor a point which surely we have made elsewhere; however, we have NO horses registered with NAS and have no reason to do so as staunch supporters of and a breeder within the KWPN-NA registry. We have one or two odd mares registered with OLD GOV and BWP, as well as one retired GP jumper who is a SF.
                  Sakura Hill Farm
                  Now on Facebook

                  Young and developing horses for A-circuit jumper and hunter rings.

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    As both a breeder and shopper, I am constantly blown away at how difficult it is to find those fabulous "niche" breeders out there who have 3-4 really wonderful foals per year and live in the middle of nowhere.

                    There are always a few big farms where you can go to buy a $20,000 weanling, but it's much more difficult to find those quality hobby breeders who are using the best bloodlines and quietly selling their offspring as fast as they can get them on the ground.

                    I think a website geared towards ONLY young warmbloods, where you could search by breeder, by pedigree, by age, by registry and by price would be fabulous. I know you can find some of those same horses on equine.com or whatever, but who wants to have to constantly filter out a zillion breeds on your results?

                    Also, require anyone on the site to list a price. I get sick of reading ads for horses with no prices in them. Most of the time I don't bother to give the ad a second look, even if the horse looks fabulous. In my experience, no price listing typically means, "If you need to ask, it's too expensive."

                    I think many people would be willing to travel to shop for young horses if they can just narrow down the search to the prospects they really want. What it really comes down to is the cost of looking at one horse at a time versus being able to set up a trip to see many at a time.

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      Many have brought up good points here.

                      I sold one yearling this year in Germany for what it will cost me to support two pregnant mares over there for nearly a year. Here in the states, even when I get what is considered pretty close to top dollar for my weanlings, the return on my investment is nothing like that (not even close).

                      My young horses sell well, but the question that comes up more and more frequently in my mind is why do I breed? The real answer is love of the breed, desire to produce better and better horses and to see the results of carefully chosen crosses. But rationality is more and more edging out starry eyed idealism.
                      Mary Lou
                      http://www.homeagainfarm.com

                      https://www.facebook.com/HomeAgainFarmHanoverians

                      Member OMGiH I loff my mares clique

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        Originally posted by Spectrum View Post
                        As both a breeder and shopper, I am constantly blown away at how difficult it is to find those fabulous "niche" breeders out there who have 3-4 really wonderful foals per year and live in the middle of nowhere.

                        ...

                        I think a website geared towards ONLY young warmbloods, where you could search by breeder, by pedigree, by age, by registry and by price would be fabulous. I know you can find some of those same horses on equine.com or whatever, but who wants to have to constantly filter out a zillion breeds on your results?

                        Also, require anyone on the site to list a price....
                        An excellent idea! Perhaps it could usefully begin in the Facebook format where pages for broodmares, breedings and Dutch horses have successfully been started!
                        Sakura Hill Farm
                        Now on Facebook

                        Young and developing horses for A-circuit jumper and hunter rings.

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          Originally posted by Sakura Hill Farm View Post
                          An excellent idea! Perhaps it could usefully begin in the Facebook format where pages for broodmares, breedings and Dutch horses have successfully been started!
                          Facebook can be rather polarizing and for folks who don't have it, it wouldn't be valuable to them.

                          I'm stepping out of de-lurk to say I'll volunteer server space/bandwidh and/or codework if nobody else is up for it/willing to finance hiring anyone.


                          I'm useless for art.
                          "The nice thing about memories is the good ones are stronger and linger longer than the bad and we sure have some incredibly good memories." - EverythingButWings

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            Originally posted by Sakura Hill Farm View Post
                            Not to belabor a point which surely we have made elsewhere; however, we have NO horses registered with NAS and have no reason to do so as staunch supporters of and a breeder within the KWPN-NA registry. We have one or two odd mares registered with OLD GOV and BWP, as well as one retired GP jumper who is a SF.
                            It isn't really the point as to whether you or any other YSH supporter registers horses with NAS. The point is that everyone entering those shows is supporting NAS via the $5 surcharge on entry fees - and a lot of folks DO NOT LIKE THAT ASPECT, because it is a competing organization to their registry of choice. Add to it the fact that - as I mentioned - both YSH and NAS are private entities owned/controlled by the same individuals, and it makes even more folks say, "ummmm...." .

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              Originally posted by DownYonder View Post
                              It isn't really the point as to whether you or any other YSH supporter registers horses with NAS. The point is that everyone entering those shows is supporting NAS via the $5 surcharge on entry fees - and a lot of folks DO NOT LIKE THAT ASPECT, because it is a competing organization to their registry of choice. Add to it the fact that - as I mentioned - both YSH and NAS are private entities owned/controlled by the same individuals, and it makes even more folks say, "ummmm...." .
                              So let me understand this, If the YSH is providing breeders with , by all accounts, a much needed service, then tell my why do owners,trainers etc, care who and what organization make a profit? Do you think these show organizers should set up a non-profit so no one makes any money?

                              If the NAS as you say, is involved in providing these venues then paying the $5 seems fair to me.

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                Originally posted by Noms View Post
                                So let me understand this, If the YSH is providing breeders with , by all accounts, a much needed service, then tell my why do owners,trainers etc, care who and what organization make a profit? Do you think these show organizers should set up a non-profit so no one makes any money?

                                If the NAS as you say, is involved in providing these venues then paying the $5 seems fair to me.
                                I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. It just doesn't sit right with a lot of folks.

                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  I know that there are some sales sights that do market to NA sport horses.

                                  There is a new site NAsporthorseprospects.com that is doing great sale ads for NA bred sport horses 4 years and younger. They also have a sister site inuterofoals.com.

                                  It is small right now, but there are some great babies there from some great breeders!

                                  I have a very small farm and try to breed my hunter mare every year. I don't have a website and am a very small breeder so these types of websites are great!

                                  There are many great NA bred babies out there and hopefully we can eventually come up with some better ideas to market and show them!

                                  Comment


                                  • #37
                                    Originally posted by Noms View Post
                                    So let me understand this, If the YSH is providing breeders with , by all accounts, a much needed service, then tell my why do owners,trainers etc, care who and what organization make a profit? Do you think these show organizers should set up a non-profit so no one makes any money?

                                    If the NAS as you say, is involved in providing these venues then paying the $5 seems fair to me.
                                    I agree with this 100%. Anyone know any dressage, hunter/jumper, 3 day events, etc. that are not set up to make some kind of profit? Sorry, DY, but a $5 surcharge to help cover expenses seems quite reasonable. It is so easy to criticize new efforts. This objection seems pretty hollow to me. And I have absolutely nothing to do with the NAS or the YHS.
                                    Mary Lou
                                    http://www.homeagainfarm.com

                                    https://www.facebook.com/HomeAgainFarmHanoverians

                                    Member OMGiH I loff my mares clique

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      For the record:
                                      NAS started the YHS. The YHS and the NAS are now 2 different entities with the same partners and owners. The NAS staff and local volunteers produce all the YHS Shows except for the WEF shows where we only supervise the paperwork and running of the show. To date, neither NAS, YHS nor SCF have made any profits from the shows. The various fees are simply to cover costs of production, judges, handlers, travel expenses, etc…
                                      We want to take this opportunity to once again thank all of the existing hosts and volunteers, as well as the YHS and NAS staff for their countless hours of hard work to make these shows not only possible but successful, safe and fun!!!
                                      A big thank you as well to all of our sponsors, especially Spy Coast Farm and Equestrian Sport Productions for their vision and their support of a much needed program in the US.
                                      Thank you.

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        Originally posted by YHS Info View Post
                                        The YHS and the NAS are now 2 different entities
                                        But your entry form says to make entry checks payable to North American Studbook. http://www.younghorseshow.com/atlanta-ga.html

                                        Comment


                                        • #40
                                          Originally posted by Spectrum View Post
                                          As both a breeder and shopper, I am constantly blown away at how difficult it is to find those fabulous "niche" breeders out there who have 3-4 really wonderful foals per year and live in the middle of nowhere.

                                          There are always a few big farms where you can go to buy a $20,000 weanling, but it's much more difficult to find those quality hobby breeders who are using the best bloodlines and quietly selling their offspring as fast as they can get them on the ground.

                                          I think a website geared towards ONLY young warmbloods, where you could search by breeder, by pedigree, by age, by registry and by price would be fabulous. I know you can find some of those same horses on equine.com or whatever, but who wants to have to constantly filter out a zillion breeds on your results?

                                          Also, require anyone on the site to list a price. I get sick of reading ads for horses with no prices in them. Most of the time I don't bother to give the ad a second look, even if the horse looks fabulous. In my experience, no price listing typically means, "If you need to ask, it's too expensive."

                                          I think many people would be willing to travel to shop for young horses if they can just narrow down the search to the prospects they really want. What it really comes down to is the cost of looking at one horse at a time versus being able to set up a trip to see many at a time.
                                          I am one of these breeders. Breed 2-4 foals per year , have no website , do no advertising and easily sell them when I get ready due to their quality and to the history of their motherlines. I don't do in-utero sales or custom foal contracts either. I prefer to see what I've bred before I sell , because I just may need to select it for future breeding depending on my mare herd situation.

                                          We are out here.....you just need to ask the right people. LOL !

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