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Jill Burnell Gray Fox Farms - FACTS THREAD

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  • Jill Burnell Gray Fox Farms - FACTS THREAD


    This thread was started as an offshoot of the
    "Doing Business w/ Jill Burnell? BEWARE" thread due to concerns that the thread contained too much venting / troll feeding / humor -- non critical info that might make it hard for a reader to get the critical info -

    Hopefully others will work to get facts & statements posted here, and make it a "No Troll Feeding" thread.

    In the meantime, here is a good thread to review as a start -
    "Setting the Record Straight on EVA"
    Last edited by ldaziens; Aug. 24, 2012, 01:24 AM. Reason: Add link, revision
    Disclaimer: Just a beginner who knows nothing about nothing

  • #2
    The fact is....this thread isn't going to go any better than the other one.
    Good luck.


    • #3
      Originally posted by ldaziens View Post
      In the meantime, here is a good thread to review as a start -
      "Setting the Record Straight on EVA"
      I had to look it up, because I had no idea what it was...
      (and it does seem to account for multiple foal deaths on a single farm...)
      Originally posted by BigMama1
      Facts don't have versions. If they do, they are opinions
      GNU Terry Prachett


      • #4
        Originally posted by stoicfish View Post
        The fact is....this thread isn't going to go any better than the other one.
        Good luck.
        The intent of the orignal thread was to warn breeders and to get the word out that the lab is/was horrendous. With over 146,000 views, it's serving its purpose.


        • #5
          If you don't read anything else, read this...

          as it sums it up very well.

          From the original thread, page 31, post #601 by Equine Reproduction
          (Kathy St.Martin, Equine-Reproduction.com):

          "YES! That "is" her "lab" and YES! We have witnessed her processing semen there. Not hearsay. Not speculation. .....
          EVA is spread from a shedding stallion through secondary sex glands secretions. If she doesn't wipe down the processing area between collections, doesn't change out the AV liner properly, doesn't wipe down the AV between stallions, doesn't wash her hands between stallions, etc, then yes...there is definitely the potential of cross contamination. Honestly, while I definitely feel for everyone that has lost money and/or horses to this woman, it scares the living tar out of me her cavalier attitude with regards to the disease and her PUBLIC claims using Dr. Timoney's name to bolster her claims....that's fact. Many here have followed the threads on another bulletin board where she made the claim that Redwine had a mild case of EVA and that Dr. Timoney was "told her" he would eventually clear the disease. ....and as we spent several months working with Dr. Timoney on an article on EVA, I contacted the man for verification. His EXACT quote is:

          'On the matter of the quotes attributed to me by a particular breeder who has an "EVA shedding stallion" in her care, I can categorically refute ever stating to her that "there is a really good chance my stallion will clear the virus and be negative at some point." It is very possible that in conversation with this individual, I would have advised regular re-checking semen of the stallion for evidence of continued persistence of the virus and that there is the chance that the animal may spontaneously clear the virus from its reproductive tract at some point. Furthermore, the quote "Dr. Timoney thinks he has an extremely mild form of the virus" is not what I would have stated under any circumstances. Clearly, this person would appear to be intent on downplaying the significance of the carrier state in her stallion. Every effort should be made to correct any misinformation such as the foregoing in situations where particular breeders are mindless of the potential consequences of what they say or post. On the matter of vaccinating seronegative mares prior to breeding with infective semen, there should be no question over the value of this precautionary measure. That point needs to be emphasized and re-emphasized for those less well informed about the possible consequences of infection with EAV.'

          It scares the SNOT out of me some of the misinformation with regards to EVA that she attempts to perpetuate. I don't think mare owners appreciate just how bad things can go and the ramifications it has not only on our own breeding animals, but with regards to our export status of semen AND horses to Canada! We have repeatedly been contacted by mare owners who have concerns about her recommendation of NOT vaccinating their mares prior to breeding them. The potential for disaster is incredible. For example, if your mare suddenly colics, are you going to disclose the vet clinic that you plan on taking her to for colic surgery that she has recently been bred to an EVA positive stallion? What about the neighbor's gelding that came over to visit during the night and the owner has a big show planned for him in a week? You going to explain to him that he'll just have to forfeit all his show fees and prep costs? EVA is actually a respiratory disease that can be transmitted through aerosol transmissions. It can also be transmitted through sexual transmission from stallions that are carriers of the disease - Redwine is a carrier. Think back to the 2006 outbreak of EVA in the Quarter Horse industry: http://www.aphis.usda.gov/vs/nahss/e...tate_USAHA.pdf"


          • #6
            Originally posted by Mardi View Post
            The intent of the orignal thread was to warn breeders and to get the word out that the lab is/was horrendous. With over 146,000 views, it's serving its purpose.
            No doubt. But it is hard to keep the trolls out and the facts seperate from speculation. The other thread is 3rd on the google search for her name. The rest of the list is other forums refering to that thread. It would probably be better to keep the views going to that one thread as it keeps is higher on the list.


            • #7


              • Original Poster

                UPDATE -
                Michelle Rogers is the Marin Humane Society Investigator who has been posting on here and is the best person to get in touch with. Her number is (415) 506-6236 and her email is mrogers@marinhumanesociety.org

                I've been off COTH for a long while, but I wanted to update this thread w/ correct contact info.
                Disclaimer: Just a beginner who knows nothing about nothing


                • #9

                  anyone seen this????


                  • #10
                    That's from Jan 9th - old news.


                    • #11
                      Redwine is still owned by Jill Burnell but the farm that is standing him for 2013 is "working on buying him". While the farm that is standing him is very reputable and will care for Redwine the way he should, Keep in mind that he's still owned by Jill and your paying for a large stud fee.


                      • #12
                        It will be a shame if she gets money for him, Im sure she wants alot. She doesnt deserve a dime. The money should be siezed.


                        • #13
                          Lessons to be learned......
                          Hyperion Stud, LLC.
                          Europe's Finest, Made in America
                          Standing Elite and Approved Stallions


                          • #14

                            Judge orders Marin Humane Society to return disputed horses, calling seizure improper

                            By Gary Klien
                            Marin Independent Journal
                            Posted: 06/18/2013 06:15:28 PM PDT

                            A judge has ordered the Marin Humane Society to return four allegedly neglected horses it seized from a rural breeding farm, citing serious flaws and financial conflicts in the investigation.

                            Judge Roy Chernus issued the tentative ruling Tuesday in the case of Gray Fox Farms LLC, which sued to get the horses back. The ruling will be adopted unless the judge changes his mind during a final round of arguments Wednesday.

                            The owners of Gray Fox Farms, Jill and Alex Burnell, are "very pleased" by the ruling, said Maggie Weems, a lawyer for the couple. She said the couple's "reputation and business has been decimated" by the Marin Humane Society's actions.

                            "We hope that the Humane Society is as quick to acknowledge the Burnells' exoneration by a truly independent judicial officer as they were to damn them by broadcasting the rubber stamp of their own bought and paid for hearing officer," Weems said.

                            The Marin Humane Society, which has a county contract for animal welfare services, started investigating the ranch in December. It said about two dozen horses were being subjected to "serious neglect, injuries, unsafe and inhumane living conditions" at the ranch, which is near Chileno Valley.

                            Investigators seized three allegedly malnourished mares and an injured stallion and started monitoring the remaining horses.

                            The Burnells denied the allegations and filed administrative appeals to get the confiscated horses back. The matter was referred to an "administrative hearing officer," an adjudicator who handles animal custody disputes.

                            The adjudicator, retired lawyer Al Burnham, ruled in the Marin Humane Society's favor. The Burnells then took the animal welfare organization to court.

                            In his tentative ruling Tuesday, Judge Chernus said some horses might have needed medical attention but that there was no emergency that required their immediate seizure. He faulted the case investigator, Michelle Rogers, for relying on double hearsay or unverified information in her decisions, and for failing to give the Burnells enough of a chance to secure veterinary care.

                            Chernus also said the Burnells were denied due process because of a financial conflict of interest on the part of Burnham, the $125-an-hour adjudicator hired by the Marin Humane Society.

                            The judge said the Marin Humane Society, rather than selecting adjudicators from a random rotation, has hired Burnham to hear 20 animal seizure cases over the past five years. He upheld the seizures every time.

                            "Where, as here, the adjudicator's pay is not formally dependent on the outcome of the litigation, but his future income as an adjudicator is entirely dependent on the goodwill of a prosecuting agency that is free to select its adjudicators it must, therefore, be presumed that MHS favors its own rational self-interest by preferring an adjudicator who tends to issue favorable rulings," the judge said.

                            He ordered the Marin Humane Society to return the four horses — Romantic Star, Pookie, Blackie and Nutsie — and cover the costs of seizing and caring for the horses.

                            John Reese, chief operating officer for the Marin Humane Society, said he is "very disappointed" in the ruling.

                            "We are carefully reviewing the opinion and are considering our next steps," he said.

                            Meanwhile, the Burnells are facing criminal charges stemming from the investigation. They pleaded not guilty last week to five felony counts of animal cruelty and numerous other charges involving Romantic Star, Pookie, Blackie, Nutsie and four other horses.
                            "Let's face it -- Beezie Madden is NOT looking over her shoulder for me anytime
                            soon . . . or ever, even in her worst nightmares."

                            Member, Higher Standards Leather Care Addicts Anonymous


                            • #15
                              UPDATE: I was reading the Rate my Horse news re: the Cornell frozen semen case, and there was this: http://www.ratemyhorsepro.com/news/p...buse-case.aspx
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                              • #16
                                So were the horses returned to her ?
                                "I would not beleive her if her tongue came notorized"


                                • #17
                                  That was a preliminary hearing which I believe is still ongoing. Once it is over the judge will decide whether the case goes to trial or not. Still a long way to go.
                                  McDowell Racing Stables

                                  Home Away From Home


                                  • #18
                                    Just saw this posted on FB.


                                    Home of Sea Accounts xx
                                    AHS/HV, ATA, GOV, RPSI, JC, AQHA, APHA, APtHA
                                    "LIKE" www.facebook.com/SeaAccounts


                                    • #19
                                      Geez Louise! WHY is it always just a slap on the wrist for such horrendous neglect or cruelty? Justice?


                                      • #20
                                        Exactly what I thought, another animal abuser getting away with it. Something has to change!