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Doing business with JILL BURNELL? BEWARE.

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  • I certainly bought my HB foal, Drum Roll Please, back in 2008 with the hunter ring in mind. We are just taking him slowly but surely and he's doing quite well. Showing him in the HB clases was just a step in the process. And, I know ALOT about him ! Oh, yeah he's a bay!

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    • I apologise, I was not pointing fingers at anyone. I am an ammie as well. Just making a comment of what I have observed in some situations. And quite humerous ones too.

      Comment


      • amylmac - I hear you. We breeders who go on to develop our youngsters for performance, well, to me it's the ultimate horsemanship and the ultimate satisfaction. Also, I'm very happy to change a career direction on any youngster when that's indicated. I'm even willing to try cow work, if I think it'll get the youngsters engaged in a job and concentrating. We tend to narrow our horses' career tracks when they probably are happier, become more mature, and more relaxed with a lot of versatility. As teens in Texas, we did everything on our horses, from swimming in lakes and the beach to competing successfully at the "A" AHSA shows (dark ages). Honestly, on my hunter that I bought as a yearling and trained myself, I won as much in western bareback equitation in a bosal as I did in recognized hunt seat classes at big shows. I don't understand today's narrow track for both horse and rider - seems silly and a waste and not so much fun.

        Now.........back on track...........

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        • Originally posted by runwayz View Post
          I apologise, I was not pointing fingers at anyone. I am an ammie as well. Just making a comment of what I have observed in some situations. And quite humerous ones too.
          No offense taken here! (and believe me, I've observed the very same thing.)

          Comment


          • Originally posted by lauriep View Post
            Between us, Diane Halpin, Emily Belin, Bill Rube and NBFarm (those are just the ones I know personally), just these people on this BB, you have already begun to see a concerted effort to bring these kids through the HB division and into performance.
            That's awesome! It will be great to see horses that are successful in the HB classes go on to become great performance horses! And it will be nice to see the stallions who are at the top of the USEF hunter breeding ranks also show up high in the standings for hunter performance sires. I think at the moment, only Popeye K is in the top 10 on both lists (#2 for Hunter Performance, and #8 for Hunter Breeding) - so big congrats to his people!

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            • Originally posted by runwayz View Post
              I apologise, I was not pointing fingers at anyone. I am an ammie as well. Just making a comment of what I have observed in some situations. And quite humerous ones too.
              I think the difference is between the ammy who buys/breeds a baby with the intention of someday having a good horse for themselves, vs the ammy who travels to Europe (or not) with a BNT and buys a horse that is ready to go. THOSE are the ones who tend not to know a lot of detail about their horse. The baby buyers most certainly do!
              Laurie

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              • FWIW, Ragtime is currently #18 on the USEF Hunter sire list with many of the same foals listed that made him the #1 Hunter Breeding sire in 2010 and 2011.
                Sheila Armstrong, Stone Creek Sport Horses, Dallas, TX
                Proud half owner of the KWPN Stallion TORONTO
                https://www.facebook.com/TorontoStallion/
                http://www.avalon-equine.com/toronto.html

                Comment


                • Is this the longest thread yet?
                  I can explain it TO you,but I can't understand it FOR you

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Sheila A View Post
                    FWIW, Ragtime is currently #18 on the USEF Hunter sire list with many of the same foals listed that made him the #1 Hunter Breeding sire in 2010 and 2011.
                    Cool! There will be more...
                    Laurie

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by jumpytoo View Post
                      Is this the longest thread yet?
                      Not yet.

                      Thread: Alisija Granger
                      Pages: 162
                      Comments: 3236
                      Views: 365631
                      The virtual "woodshed" seems the only remedy for willful fools .

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Joanne View Post
                        Not yet.

                        Thread: Alisija Granger
                        Pages: 162
                        Comments: 3236
                        Views: 365631
                        Ah, Geeze. Why did you have to remind me of that mess?
                        Visit Sonesta Farms website at www.sonestafarms.com or our FaceBook page at www.facebook.com/sonestafarms. Also showing & breeding Cavalier King Charles Spaniels.

                        Comment


                        • Sorry, Sonesta. I can delete my post if you want and then you can delet your reference to it.
                          The virtual "woodshed" seems the only remedy for willful fools .

                          Comment


                          • For what it's worth - I was at an ISR/Oldenburg inspection yesterday and there was a lovely Redwine filly presented who was Reserve Champion Filly with a first-of-the-year 9 for type. The judge loved her and made interesting comments about how Redwine has produced better here in the US than in Germany because he seems to nick really well with American mares. I found it interesting, thought someone here might as well.

                            Comment


                            • To get this thread back on track again, was doing some PM housecleaning and came across this PM from Jill, dated March 2010:

                              Your not confused, she's saying something different. Kathy bred to Redwine with a baby at her mares side. I think it's a little stallion owner to stallion owner jealousy. I've been getting emails that she told them one thing before and is now saying something different now that a lot of people are breeding to Redwine. Especially for Redwine when no horse has ever had a symptom it's fine to breed with a baby at the mares side, we do it all the time.
                              Unreal ...
                              www.TrueColoursFarm.com
                              www.truecoloursproducts.com

                              True Colours Farm on Facebook

                              Comment


                              • Good Lord! Was she talking about breeding an unvaccinated mare with foal at side?

                                Comment


                                • Originally posted by TrueColours View Post
                                  To get this thread back on track again, was doing some PM housecleaning and came across this PM from Jill, dated March 2010:

                                  Unreal ...
                                  And I can ASSURE you that was NOT the case. Indeed, it was one of the things that I repeatedly TOLD her I would absolutely NOT do - risk a foal by breeding to an EVA positive stallion. I'm fine with management and vaccination with a mare that can be isolated during the post breeding time frame. And, FWIW, I did a thread in 2008 chronicling the breeding of that mare to help educate people. It's all right there in writing . The mare was open and did not have a foal afoot. We had two pregnant mares at the time. Morticia who was pregnant with Edward Scissorhands and a TB mare in foal to Mannhattan. The mare we bred, was Faberge. Her last foal prior to that was Shenandoah - a 2007 Sempatico foal. Yeah...I keep records. Amazing, isn't it? .

                                  When asked "why" I wouldn't do it, I make the comparison of would you vaccinate your mare for say, Equine Herpes and then be sufficiently cavalier to go ahead and park her next to a horse that has an active case of EHV when she has a foal afoot? It's hard enough to get a foal to adulthood without taking additional risks. And my stance on that has NEVER changed. Ever. Nor will it.

                                  Jealous? I don't think so. We've been in business for over 30 years now - granted the farm used to be known by a DIFFERENT name but that's no secret. Mannhattan has been standing with us for pushing close to 20 years. We're still here. We performance test or make sure the stallion has competed sufficiently in performance to be licensed. We take care of our customers. We don't take unnecessary risks. You call for semen, we do everything feasibly possible to get it out, even with late emergency calls. Our breeding lab is immaculate and several members on this board have been here and can attest to that. Our horses are in good weight, de-wormed regularly, vaccinated annually, farrier work regularly - in other words, are well maintained. Mares with foals live out in small groups on pasture. We have 40 acres and own personally around 25 horses.

                                  Also note, the date of the PM as March 2010. By that time, we were well aware of some of the practices of Jill Burnell, especially of her practice of trivializing management of mares for EVA, as well as the claims that "Dr. Timoney said" which were absolute, utter point blank lies. I had begun doing more EVA education posts at that time, which Jill has ALWAYS disliked seeing "pop" up. Which your PM also shows...blatant lying. See a pattern here? <shrug>. But ya know what? Apparently those threads on EVA and magnifying her cavalier attitude are working! Mare owners are that much better educated and less likely to breed without vaccinating.

                                  We have repeatedly and steadfastly attempted to stick to the facts with regards to education on EVA. But, some people will obviously do anything for a buck .

                                  Edited to say we try to stick to the facts on everything...not just EVA <lol>...Just to be clear !
                                  Last edited by Equine Reproduction; Sep. 19, 2012, 04:18 PM.
                                  Equine-Reproduction.com Now offering one on one customized training!
                                  Leg-Up Equestrian Assistance Program, Inc. A 501(c)(3) non-profit charity

                                  Comment


                                  • Originally posted by DownYonder View Post
                                    Good Lord! Was she talking about breeding an unvaccinated mare with foal at side?
                                    No...we "did" vaccinate the mare. But she's claiming the mare had a foal afoot. The mare did NOT have a foal by her side. And as noted in my previous post, I absolutely will NOT risk exposing a foal to the active "hot" virus that you risk being expelled by the mare post breeding. NOT worth the risk. Am I absolutely, 100% clear on this? . I have ALWAYS made that statement. But once again, Jill is attempt to down play the concerns and trivialize it to the point of claiming I'm lying about the topic and I'm "jealous" of her. <shrug> Whatever.
                                    Equine-Reproduction.com Now offering one on one customized training!
                                    Leg-Up Equestrian Assistance Program, Inc. A 501(c)(3) non-profit charity

                                    Comment


                                    • One thing that hasn't been spoken about is that the first season Redwine stood in the US, Jill was not aware that he was EVA positive and was shipping semen to mare owners. I know this, because Jill called me in a panic after receiving his test results wanting advice on how to handle the situation. And, what Kathy/www.equine-reproduction.com has not told you all is the background of why Jill started her smear campaign against them. It is not my place to say and Kathy won't say because she is a professional who provided a service for Jill, but it is another thing that just re-enforces everything we know about her.

                                      Comment


                                      • What is someone bought a mare from JB with or without a foal by her side then bred that mare live cover to another stallion.... is there a possibility that the mare could be EVA positive then expose a stallion?
                                        "The sea was angry that day, my friends - like an old man trying to send back soup in a deli"

                                        Comment


                                        • The rise and fall

                                          You know, the more I think about this, the more I'm interested in how she rose to the levels she did. I know little of JB, I'd assume she obviously was a BN in the hunter world? Had some money, brought over some fancy stallions, and started acquiring mares? She has a fabulous website and either has sold a ton of breedings and horses (priced 10k plus) or done very good lying about it.

                                          As someone that struggles to find the connections to legitamately sell a couple horses a year, without fraud, how did she manage to con all these people? How did she develop such a huge network, market, and become such a hot commodity? If the fraudulent behaviour was always there, it makes you wonder why it took this long. Or was she on the up-and-up for awhile and then tanked? I remember not that long ago if her name came up on these boards everyone sung her praises. What flicked the switch?

                                          I'm curious because of the sheer volume of people affected. How did this go on and on and on for so long that the list of victims ended up so long? I would love to be able to market like she DID, and have the flock of people gravitate to me. What was the draw? You have to admit from that standpoint, she marketed well, and obviously knows about horses. It amazes me how far she was able to take it before word started getting around. I wonder what was the catalyst that changed opinion from "she's stellar" to "watch your back" if things had been less than honest the entire time.

                                          Anyone know more about how she ended up with the fame she had, the good reputation, and the huge client base, before it all started to sink?
                                          "Hell, when I move my things go in boxes and I always make sure and bubble wrap my dog feces so it don't get broke." runwayz

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