• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Independence--Bold Ruler's full brother

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Independence--Bold Ruler's full brother

    Learn something new every day.

    Independence was an extremely successful steeplechaser. Might help explain why Bold Ruler was so good for sport horses.

    Might be better to have Independence than BR himself.

    I am drooling at this pedigree.
    http://www.pedigreequery.com/royal+declaration
    "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
    Thread killer Extraordinaire

  • #2
    Love that pedigree - too bad no progeny are recorded.
    Hickstead 1996-2011 Godspeed
    " Hickstead is simply the best and He lives forever in our hearts"
    Akasha 1992-2012 - I will always love you sweet girl.

    Comment


    • #3
      I owned a mare about 20 years ago that was by Independence. Her name was Gladden Pell. I used her as a jumper and then as a dressage horse after I had children. She preferred the jumping! At her (and my) first dressage show, she happily jumped out of the ring. She was approved by the AHHA and she had one filly that I sold to an event rider that ended up long listed for the Pan Am games. She also produced a gelding that was the Intermediare dressage horse of the year for the AHHA. I eventually sold her when I bought Gold Luck and concentrated on breeding Hanoverians. She was one of my favorite mares of all time.
      http://www.rollingstonefarm.com
      Large Oldenburg and Hanoverian breeding farm
      Standing Shakespeare RSF, Fhitzgerald, Sir James and the homebred stallion Dheputy.

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #4
        MoSwanson, do you happen to know anything about the damside?

        I was at allbreedpedigree, and they have Francille as second dam. They also had an Independence by a KWPN stallion who was younger than Gladden Pell as the sire, so I corrected that by making the Bold Ruler brother the sire. The TB Pedigreequery lists a 1927 French mare named Francille who is by Battersea, one of the sons of SeaSick. If that's the mare, it's no wonder that her granddaughter by Independence loved to jump!

        The Jockey Club doesn't have The Ardvark on file, and they show 4 Francilles, including a 1955 model by Junior Kay. I can't see the jump genes in the 1955 mare, who was bred in Maryland.
        "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
        Thread killer Extraordinaire

        Comment


        • #5
          Wow, I had no idea he had a full brother. Are there any pictures out there? I wonder if it's possible to do a search for him as a progenitor.
          Sportponies Unlimited
          Athletic Thoroughbred crosses for the highly motivated, smaller rider.

          Comment

          • Original Poster

            #6
            I found out about Independence in one of Dr. Birdsall's articles on the Sport Horse Breeder site. Then I did a progeny search on pedigree query to come up with Royal Declaration and did a pedigree search at the JC to come up with 157 registered foals by Independence.

            Denny knew him personally, I think.

            Independence set new track records for chasing (?) at Belmont and Saratoga for 20 furlongs (2 1/2 miles).
            "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
            Thread killer Extraordinaire

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by vineyridge View Post
              I found out about Independence in one of Dr. Birdsall's articles on the Sport Horse Breeder site. Then I did a progeny search on pedigree query to come up with Royal Declaration and did a pedigree search at the JC to come up with 157 registered foals by Independence.

              Denny knew him personally, I think.

              Independence set new track records for chasing (?) at Belmont and Saratoga for 20 furlongs (2 1/2 miles).
              ... which makes him yet another interesting example of supposedly sprint bred horses who proved their speed could go a distance.
              http://www.tunnelsendfarm.com

              Comment


              • #8
                there were adds for him in the old Practical Horseman. Probably COTH as well.

                Comment


                • #9
                  When I was at Virginia Intermont in the late 70s there was an Independence colt training with Jimmy Cantwell. He was a big talented bay. I have wondered whatever happened to him every now and then-he was the kind that stuck with you.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Independence

                    The first time I saw him, maybe mid 70s, I was riding up that alley between the Huntington indoor ring, on the left, and the paddocks, on the right.
                    (the same way we hacked back to our trailers at the event last weekend, for those who ran there)
                    Anyway, above the indoor, there was a long grass paddock, and I saw this big brown horse standing at the upper end. When he saw my horse, he galloped down that lane beside me, and I swear it was like watching a storm driven cloud fly across the sky, smooth, and powerful, and effortless.

                    Later that day I learned that Independence had arrived from Md, where June Mc Knight had just bought him.

                    His foals were talented, but, like so many Nasrullah grandsons and daughters, not always for the faint of heart.
                    http://www.tamarackhill.com/

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      He was a top steeplechaser that's for sure. I bred to him when he was in New Jersey in 1968.
                      Anne
                      -------
                      "Where knowledge ends violence begins." B. Ljundquist

                      Comment

                      • Original Poster

                        #12
                        Well, Anne, don't just leave us hanging!

                        Tell us about your foal. Please.
                        "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
                        Thread killer Extraordinaire

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          No foal But I find find and buy a wonderful filly by the Welsh stallion Ardmore Footlight out of an Independence mare. She could jump anything at any height at any horse distance. Very brave.
                          Anne
                          -------
                          "Where knowledge ends violence begins." B. Ljundquist

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Did he have any sons that are still around today?
                            Hickstead 1996-2011 Godspeed
                            " Hickstead is simply the best and He lives forever in our hearts"
                            Akasha 1992-2012 - I will always love you sweet girl.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Independence

                              If I'm not mistaken, I remember Independence as being the sire of Idle Dice.
                              Also, we were at a TB sale many years ago somewhere in Ohio and saw a perfectly gorgeous broodmare by Independence. I have never forgotten her.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by snaffles View Post
                                If I'm not mistaken, I remember Independence as being the sire of Idle Dice.
                                I think that would be Hay Hook.
                                Fan of Sea Accounts

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  I stand corrected, Hay Hook is right!

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    This is quite a story. I am look ing at takign a Rare Brick son...TB and racing him as a four year old...lost my mind...but I do love the Therbies

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by denny View Post

                                      His foals were talented, but, like so many Nasrullah grandsons and daughters, not always for the faint of heart.
                                      No kidding, Denny
                                      I had an Independence son that I bought as a yearling. He was such a tough horse that many, many people advised me to get rid of him and feared for my life. One of the people that helped me at the time said,"Well, if you can survive until he is six, you might have a pretty good horse". Ah, youth.

                                      He was so dangerous to hack that he actually changed my career ( I had bought him as an event horse prospect) and wound up training him to Grand Prix. He had a decent piaffe and passage and could do one tempis forever.

                                      We taught him to jump and one year, George Morris flew up to look at some Dutch horses that I had for sale. He wanted to see everything on the farm and finally asked to see the Independence gelding. I jumped him over a bunch of big fences (in my dressage saddle, no less) and GM thought he "had the most class of any of the horses".

                                      Gozzi, who was a very successful hunter in the 70's was by Independence
                                      www.imajica.net

                                      Comment

                                      Working...
                                      X