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In-utero sales and fees

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  • In-utero sales and fees

    How does everyone handle in-utero sales and fees, mare care, emergencies, etc. If a deposit is done prior to the birth of the foal, who is responsible if the foal should become ill within the first 10 days? Who pays the bills at foaling....the mare owner or the buyer?

    Everyone's contracts are different so I am curious as to how everyone handles this.

  • #2
    I try to keep my in-utero sales simple. I require a deposit before the foal is born. Once the foal is born and has passed a "well-foal" exam (including an IgG test, all at my expense) then the balance is due and the foal officially belongs to the buyer. Included in my in-utero costs are the costs of mare care, foaling out the mare, the well foal exam and inspection/registration fees. Once the foal is 24 hours old and has been deemed healthy, all illnesses or injuries become the financial responsiblity of the buyer. If the foal were born with a problem, like a low IgG or was septic that would be my responsibility and the buyer gets their deposit refunded. If the buyer still wanted the foal pending treatment then I would certainly work with the buyer in that situation. My in-utero prices also cover the board of the foal until weaning.
    Already excited about our 2016 foals! Expecting babies by Indoctro, Diamant de Semilly, Zirocco Blue and Calido!
    https://www.facebook.com/pages/Hills...h/112931293227

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    • #3
      Mine is very similar to Hillsides. I also suggest the buyer take out insurance on the foal.
      www.glenhillfarm.com
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      • #4
        in utero

        We've done the same but insist on insurance once the baby is healthy and insurable.

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        • #5
          Our contracts are for a live, healthy foal. The price is all inclusive. While the foal is with us, any care, medical or otherwise, is our responsibility. We treat the foal as if it was our own and we keep it here until until it's weaned. When the foal goes to it's new home, it leads, bathes, clips, loads, and stands for the farrier. When the new owner takes delivery, all responsibility for the foal transfers to them.
          http://ShowjumpersUSA.com
          CAMPESINO (1990 - 2008)
          Capitol I - Sacramento Song xx
          http://www.caringbridge.org/visit/annalisasmith

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          • #6
            I charge very good prices on my en-uteros. Most are paid for in advance or they make payments during the pregnancy and while the baby is still nursing. I do have them pay the vet bills and inspection fees. But they are entitled to a healthy baby. I think insuring the baby is an excellent idea. Especially for major medical.
            Chris Misita
            www.hiddenvalleyfarms.net Home of Bravo and Warrick!
            To dare; progress comes at this price. All sublime conquests are, more or less, the rewards of daring.
            Victor Hugo

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            • #7
              Mine is also very similar to Hillside's.
              Last edited by spacely; Jan. 30, 2008, 11:14 PM.

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              • #8
                Elizabeth, I may have to revise my contract... yours sounds better!
                http://ShowjumpersUSA.com
                CAMPESINO (1990 - 2008)
                Capitol I - Sacramento Song xx
                http://www.caringbridge.org/visit/annalisasmith

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by ShowjumpersUSA View Post
                  Elizabeth, I may have to revise my contract... yours sounds better!
                  I made my contract with a lot of help from people on this board, and some other breeders. It is a combination of all of those that works best for my situation. I'm happy to share it, if you want a copy I can e-mail it to you.
                  Already excited about our 2016 foals! Expecting babies by Indoctro, Diamant de Semilly, Zirocco Blue and Calido!
                  https://www.facebook.com/pages/Hills...h/112931293227

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                  • Original Poster

                    #10
                    Thanks for all the opinions. This can be difficult for a number of reasons, most importantly because we all want a happy customer, yet we don't want to loose money in the deal. I was thinking of having a certain percentage down at the time of the contract, another percentage due at the time of the well baby exam with that critical 'first week' window were I take responsibility for any life threatening illnesses. After that first week, they are in full ownership with the final 50% due no later than weaning. We are revising our in-utero contract this year and I want to be sure that both buyer and seller are happy. We have always allowed for the buyer to get out of the contract if they just don't like the foal, but it must be done within the first 7 days and they automatically loose 10% of the purchase price (having a part of it as nonrefundable really seperates the so-so buyer from the serious one).

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by charger View Post
                      Thanks for all the opinions. This can be difficult for a number of reasons, most importantly because we all want a happy customer, yet we don't want to loose money in the deal. I was thinking of having a certain percentage down at the time of the contract, another percentage due at the time of the well baby exam with that critical 'first week' window were I take responsibility for any life threatening illnesses. After that first week, they are in full ownership with the final 50% due no later than weaning. We are revising our in-utero contract this year and I want to be sure that both buyer and seller are happy. We have always allowed for the buyer to get out of the contract if they just don't like the foal, but it must be done within the first 7 days and they automatically loose 10% of the purchase price (having a part of it as nonrefundable really seperates the so-so buyer from the serious one).
                      I think that the conditions you have now are quite generous. I ask for 1/3 down at signing of contract, with the remainder due within 7 days of foaling (providing there is a live, healthy foal). I don't not refund the deposit for "buyer's remorse".
                      Already excited about our 2016 foals! Expecting babies by Indoctro, Diamant de Semilly, Zirocco Blue and Calido!
                      https://www.facebook.com/pages/Hills...h/112931293227

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                      • #12
                        Your terms are very generous. I do 20% down with the balance due within 10 days of birth. The deposit is refundable if the mare does not catch, aborts or does not produce a healthy foal. It is not refundable if they change their mind.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Hillside H Ranch View Post
                          I try to keep my in-utero sales simple. I require a deposit before the foal is born. Once the foal is born and has passed a "well-foal" exam (including an IgG test, all at my expense) then the balance is due and the foal officially belongs to the buyer. Included in my in-utero costs are the costs of mare care, foaling out the mare, the well foal exam and inspection/registration fees. Once the foal is 24 hours old and has been deemed healthy, all illnesses or injuries become the financial responsiblity of the buyer. If the foal were born with a problem, like a low IgG or was septic that would be my responsibility and the buyer gets their deposit refunded. If the buyer still wanted the foal pending treatment then I would certainly work with the buyer in that situation. My in-utero prices also cover the board of the foal until weaning.
                          Ditto.
                          We did a deposit down (did it twice....different amonts of deposit negotiated w/ the 2 buyers). One was less down (like 10%) but balance due upon the foal being vetted as healthy (roughly 24 hours after birth); the other was 50% down on contract, balance due at weaning delivery (I was delivering the foal out of state and buyer was also paying me x per mile to deliver the foal as we have a big stock trailer and she had one not ideal for hauling babies...2 horse with a bar.)
                          Providence Farm
                          http://providencefarmpintos.blogspot.com/

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Hillside H Ranch View Post
                            I made my contract with a lot of help from people on this board, and some other breeders. It is a combination of all of those that works best for my situation. I'm happy to share it, if you want a copy I can e-mail it to you.
                            Yes, that would be great! Thank you.
                            http://ShowjumpersUSA.com
                            CAMPESINO (1990 - 2008)
                            Capitol I - Sacramento Song xx
                            http://www.caringbridge.org/visit/annalisasmith

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                            • #15
                              We require a deposit and then they can either pay in full after foal is checked via vet or do payment plan while at mom's side. We also insist on insurance. After 72 hours the foal is their and so are the expenses.

                              We also spell out very specifically about the mare care, while pregnant and after foaling and if they want to do any other tests on mare or on foal it is at their expense and for our mare, our approval.

                              If they back out at any time all or part is non-refundable, assuming the foal is fine and they just go cold feet-had this happen once and lost a boat load of $$ bending over backwards. The foal then becomes our "property" and we can market said foal. Also, if they change their minds again, and want the foal again after saying "no", it's not at the in-utero price anymore but the LF price.

                              We've never had a problem with in-utero or custom foals since we revamped our contract to be very, very specific.

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                              • #16
                                My contract is now VERY similar to Hillsides. Before then, I required that the person who signs the contract to pay in full after the 24 hour vet check (done at my expense). NOW, I require a non refundable deposit (refundable ONLY if the foal does NOT pass the vet check). I also encourage buyers to insure the foal.

                                We are (unfortunately) in litigation over an in utero who passed the 24 hour vet check, had a perfect Igg, and at 48 hours the mare stepped on the foal. Buyer ok'ed 6k in vet bills and then wanted out of the contract. Of course I got stuck with the bills and nursing care of this injury. Then buyer had the nerve to come back later and offer the in utero price - uummmm ..........NO. I REQUIRED the buyer to insure foal at 24 hours. Turns out she never did any such thing.
                                Last edited by Iron Horse Farm; Jan. 31, 2008, 05:22 PM. Reason: typo
                                Holly
                                www.ironhorsefrm.com
                                Oldenburg foals and young prospects
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                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by Hillside H Ranch View Post
                                  I made my contract with a lot of help from people on this board, and some other breeders. It is a combination of all of those that works best for my situation. I'm happy to share it, if you want a copy I can e-mail it to you.
                                  If you would be willing to share I would also love a copy. I have been struggling to develop a useable contract.

                                  Also, to hijack the thread a little - how do you handle a buyer who only wants the foal if its a specific sex?
                                  Epona Farm
                                  Irish Draughts and Irish Draught Sport horses

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                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by horsetales View Post
                                    Also, to hijack the thread a little - how do you handle a buyer who only wants the foal if its a specific sex?
                                    Depends on how anxious you are to sell the foal! If it is nearing foaling time and you have no other interested parties then why not. You don't have much to lose. Some sellers ALSO have certain sex options like a "colt only" option if the mare has a filly they want to retain for their broodmare band.
                                    Providence Farm
                                    http://providencefarmpintos.blogspot.com/

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                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by Hillside H Ranch View Post
                                      I made my contract with a lot of help from people on this board, and some other breeders. It is a combination of all of those that works best for my situation. I'm happy to share it, if you want a copy I can e-mail it to you.
                                      If you are still willing to share, I would love a copy. I am struggling to find a well versed contract to use. Thanks!
                                      There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man. ~Winston Churchill

                                      No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle. ~Winston Churchill

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