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Crap, the paxil isnt working anymore

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  • #21
    Originally posted by shakeytails View Post
    BTW, I would suggest staying away from the benzodiazepines such as Xanax,Klonopin,Valium,Restoril, librium. "They say" the risk of addiction is low but I see otherwise in my patients, and benzo withdrawal isn't pretty.
    This!!! I have more personal experience with it than I wish I did.

    FWIW Seroquel changed my life as well. That along with a good psych who was willing to come up with a regimen that was tailored specifically for me. Took a lot of trial and error but I feel awesome now!

    Comment


    • #22
      Teddy, were you able to get in to see a psychiatrist? I know how hard that can be on OHIP, especially in a rural area. I tried!

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #23
        I wasnt able to see one but talked thouroughly withvmy gp,and will have access to councellors at school.

        Im now on cipralex, finding a huge difference!! It suppresses appitite and i have to eat little and often so i dont get scary pass out sugar drops.
        Beyond the Ring-para dressage, training, coaching
        www.facebook.com/btrparadressage

        Proud Team Four Star Minion! Renegade for Life!

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          #24
          Did not make it to a psych, but had a long talk with my gp. Now am on cipralex and wow big change!!! I have to watch my sugars and eat a little every few hours but hey not a bad trade off!

          Councellers will be availible at school
          Beyond the Ring-para dressage, training, coaching
          www.facebook.com/btrparadressage

          Proud Team Four Star Minion! Renegade for Life!

          Comment


          • #25
            Glad to hear it, Teddy! Keep at it

            Comment


            • #26
              GPs, Meds, Shrinks, Benzodiazepines, Oh My!

              Sorry guys, I'm not trying to derail this thread or anything; but I wanted to reiterate some of the specific statements from Ambitious Kate and Shakeytails earlier in the conversation that I feel are REALLY important for everyone to take serious note of and heed.

              Originally posted by Ambitious Kate View Post
              Its true you have to find your own way out of your anxiety. Meds are important, they can take the edge off enough for you to get a handle on it yourself, but you have to come to terms with your anxiety and develop strategies for coping. No med will ever do that for you. Anxiety is one psychiatric issue which actually CAN be overcome with good therapy. Many depression issues are very difficult to overcome, but much of anxiety and worries and preseverating are something you can retrain your brain and body responses over. If your therapist currently isn't moving you in that direction, find a new one. The right medication is important, but it is usually adjunctive to the right therapy, so if you aren't addressing the anxiety etc., I would think you really need to do so before toying with more medication.
              Originally posted by shakeytails View Post
              ...I'm not suggesting that you don't need meds, but working with a good therapist might alleviate the need for some medication. I work in psych (inpatient), and it's amazing what a good psychiatrist and therapist can do in just a couple of weeks. I do think part of our success is due to the fact that many of our patients have been relying on the family doctor for mental health issues, and the family doc ain't getting it right.
              (emphasis mine) What Ambitious Kate and Shakeytails are saying here is SO TRUE. I personally feel that GP/Family Doctor isn't the appropriate medical professional to seek help from with regards to pshychological issues; and I also very adamantly take the stance that they shouldn't be allowed to dispense psychiatric/psychotropic medications.

              GP's/Family Docs/Internists/etc. don't understand enough about the combinations of biochemistry, the human brain, the psychological effects of biochem and medications on the brain; what warning signs to be aware of WRT medications, psychology / psychiatry in general; and the list goes on... And that's not to say anything "bad" about these doctors. It's just that psychology and the like is not their area of specialty.

              Think about it- would you go to your OB/GYN if you had a sinus infection? Would you go to a neurologist to be treated for plantar fasciitis? Well, this is along the same principle... why go to a doctor without the specific credentials that qualify them as "specialists" for an issue that is not related to their specialty?

              In my experience, much more harm is [almost always] done to a patient when a non-psychiatrist MD starts writing them scripts for psychiatric medications.

              And besides that, medications are just a *TOOL* in treating psychological issues. They are meant to be used by the patient in conjunction with regular therapy sessions with a licensed psychologist (i.e.; Cognitive Behavioral Therapy [CBT]- arguably the most effective form of therapy for problems with anxiety, depression, etc.); and regular check-ins with the prescribing psychiatrist.

              Additionally, the psychologist and psychiatrist are to work together, and with the patient, as a team to best manage the treatment plan and monitor patient progress.

              Without that interaction / communication between the qualified professionals and patient; it's a losing battle.




              Originally posted by shakeytails View Post
              BTW, I would suggest staying away from the benzodiazepines such as Xanax,Klonopin,Valium,Restoril, librium. "They say" the risk of addiction is low but I see otherwise in my patients, and benzo withdrawal isn't pretty.

              Originally posted by Ambitious Kate View Post
              And the mental and physical permanent damage is heartbreaking to see in those who take benzos chronicly.


              (emphasis mine) Again, I am in such agreement with Shakeytails and Ambitious Kate, I'm about to jump up out of my chair and start shouting this information through a megaphone to every single person I pass on the street. What they're saying about the Benzodiazepines- It's true. All of it.

              I know it is, because I'm going through it now, and I honestly don't think I'll ever be "me" again. Hell, I've been on them for so long now, that I don't even know who "me" is anymore... it's like I forgot everything about my life before being prescribed benzodiazepenes.

              And there's no guarantee that things will get any better once I am finally able to get off of them. And like Shakeytails said- the withdrawl is not pretty. It's downright terrifying, unbelievably painful, and having experienced it one time; I honestly worry that I'll never be able to get off of them. Really, that's how serious the withdrawls are... I thought I was dying. Or that if it didn't stop, that I wanted to.

              I understand that they (benzos) have their place in psychiatry and treating psychological conditions- especially those of the acute or 'crisis' type situations. From what I understand, benzos are most commonly prescribed for a very short term to treat acute anxiety, or on an as-needed basis (to treat anxiety attacks, for example).

              In my case, I was prescribed the benzodiazepene "Ativan" for anxiety and severe insomnia. Insomnia is particularly 'dangerous,' for me with my particular situation; as I have bipolar disorder and lack of sleep can easily trigger a manic episode- or can be indicative of actually being in the throes of one.

              On a related note, the weird thing I've found with the medications I'm on to treat the disorder, is that while they keep me mostly psychologically stable; I still experience the physiological symptoms of mood episodes- insomnia, high energy, the feeling of 'crawling out of my skin' (which for me, is indicative of mania); or conversely- hypersomnia, lack of appetite, no energy, neglect of daily responsibilities, etc. (which for me, are all indicative of depression).

              But I digress.

              At first, I was so grateful for the relief I received from the prescription of Ativan- my anxiety levels decreased significantly, I was able to get good, sound sleep; and I was starting to feel better.

              But over time, I had to start taking more and more of it to control my anxiety (even during the day, even while I was at work), which was inexplicably creeping back in- worse than before - and just to sleep at night.

              Over the course of about 1.5 years, I went from taking 1 mg/night to taking 6-8 mg just to get to sleep. And more often than not; I would just wake up after a few hours and find myself back at square one: anxious and sleep-deprived.

              And as a sidenote; I honestly believe that over time, the Ativan itself started to cause anxiety, instead of treating it. I went through the same thing with Paxil (wouldn't touch that stuff again with a 20 mile pole for a million dollars).

              When I see my Psychiatrist next month, we're going to create a plan to slowly taper me off of the benzos. As a substitute for the Ativan, he put me on Klonopin; which seems to be working much better... but I imagine it's only a matter of time before I start having the same/similar problems with Klonopin that I did with Ativan (I'm already experiencing the whole waking up after just a few hours of sleep thing; despite being on 1mg of Trazodone too).

              But regardless, I just don't want to be on the benzos at all:

              Every day I feel like my brain is getting slower and slower. I have a hard time "finding words," and articulating what I'm trying to say. Every component of my cognition has been negatively impacted. The worst part is, I'm not the only one who notices it.

              It's causing problems at work; my boss doesn't understand why I am no longer the highest-performing, most creative, passionate, effective member of her team. She sees it as me no longer being reliable, and my 'Performance Evaluations' reflect that. And those reflections are effecting my career.

              I've tried explaining my situation to her, but the reality is that these are my problems- not hers, not my team's, not my agency's; and it's up to me to figure out how to maintain my performance level at work (and in the rest of my life, too). It's difficult to the point of feeling impossible, and it sucks, but this is adulthood. This is life. (well, my life anyway)

              I feel primarily 'flat,' in terms of mood; but these days I've been more on the 'down' side of flat.

              I swear, it feels like the Benzos have taken away the best parts of me. I'm not the person I used to be- happy, witty, funny, social, motivated, etc. And from what I've read on the topic of long-term use of Benzodiazapenes; I may never get it back.

              I'm sorry for the novel. Obviously, appropriate psychological / psychiatric care is something I'm extremely passionate about; and I do worry that a majority of the people suffering with these sorts of issues just don't know how serious medication/Dr./treatment issues can be...

              Please, anyone and everyone reading this- be your own advocate. Do your research (and no, Wikipedia doesn't count), make sure you understand the benefits/risks of each medication your doctor wants to put you on. If you don't understand these things, make sure you ASK QUESTIONS until you *do* understand.

              Make sure you seek out an appropriate treatment team of a psychologist and a psychiatrist... (NOT your GP, your family doctor, the doctor you saw at the walk-in clinic down the street, etc.).

              Do understand that it sometimes takes a few tries with several different psychologists/psychiatrists to find the ones who are right for you. Trust in your doctors is one of the most [if not the most] important parts of successful treatment. I know it's daunting and a pain in the ass; but it's so necessary... don't give up until you find the right team for you.

              And most importantly; don't give up on yourself. You are the greatest gift you'll ever have (I know, I know- that's hard to believe when you're in a dark place; but regardless of where you are and how you feel; it's the truth)... and as such, it is your responsibility to invest in all aspects of your health- physical, spiritual, mental and emotional.

              Because trust me- not being mentally and emotionally healthy will erode away the other parts of your life; in some of the most horrible, painful ways that you can't possibly imagine until you're going/have gone through it.

              If you've made it this far into my crazy-long post, congratulations! And thank you for reading it.

              Again, I want to reiterate- Shakeytails and Ambitious Kate know what they're talking about. Read their posts again and again, as many times as possible, until what they've said sinks in.

              Best of luck and much love to all of you who are going through hell right now; and also to those who have.

              -RTB
              Originally posted by Martha Drum
              ...But I don't want to sit helmetless on my horse while he lies on the ground kicking a ball around without a bridle while Leatherface does an interpretive dance with his chainsaw around us.

              Comment


              • #27
                Originally posted by ReeseTheBeast View Post
                I know it is, because I'm going through it now, and I honestly don't think I'll ever be "me" again. Hell, I've been on them for so long now, that I don't even know who "me" is anymore... it's like I forgot everything about my life before being prescribed benzodiazepenes.

                And there's no guarantee that things will get any better once I am finally able to get off of them. And like Shakeytails said- the withdrawl is not pretty. It's downright terrifying, unbelievably painful, and having experienced it one time; I honestly worry that I'll never be able to get off of them. Really, that's how serious the withdrawls are... I thought I was dying. Or that if it didn't stop, that I wanted to.
                I feel for you! I know it doesn't seem like it now, but it really DOES get better. And I'm living proof.

                PM if you want to talk - I'm always happy to share my experiences.

                Comment


                • #28
                  Well, ReesetheBeast, I have to really really disagree with you. If you want to discuss further PM would probably be best.

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    Originally posted by grayarabpony View Post
                    Well, ReesetheBeast, I have to really really disagree with you. If you want to discuss further PM would probably be best.
                    Alas, sometimes it does NOT get better. Just as diabetes is a disease, so is depression and other forms of mental illness. They are diseases to be managed, but as yet that have no cure.

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      Originally posted by Kyzteke View Post
                      Alas, sometimes it does NOT get better. Just as diabetes is a disease, so is depression and other forms of mental illness. They are diseases to be managed, but as yet that have no cure.
                      Exactly.

                      And grayarabpony, just what is it that I said that you "really really have to disagree with?"
                      Originally posted by Martha Drum
                      ...But I don't want to sit helmetless on my horse while he lies on the ground kicking a ball around without a bridle while Leatherface does an interpretive dance with his chainsaw around us.

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        The nonsense that family practitioners shouldn't be allowed to prescribe anti-depressants and other mood-altering drugs. My husband is a family practitioner and he helps a lot of people who would otherwise have to wait weeks to see a psychiatrist. When they see him they need help NOW.

                        NO ONE knows the biochemistry behind how many of these drugs work. Certainly not anti-depressants.

                        Some pyschiatrists will prescribe benzos, btw. Freely. In fact since all they do is prescribe meds they love to prescribe meds to counteract the effects of other meds. There are good psychiatrists but imo overall there are many patients who are no better off from having seen one.

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          Originally posted by Kyzteke View Post
                          Alas, sometimes it does NOT get better. Just as diabetes is a disease, so is depression and other forms of mental illness. They are diseases to be managed, but as yet that have no cure.
                          That's not what I was referring to. As to your post, I would know that better than anyone.

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            I am reading this thread because I have a family member who is struggling with these issues.

                            It's difficult to live with a chronically depressed and anxious loved one, as well. Harder to be the one going through it, but tough when you want to help and are frustrated with the self-defeating behaviors, as well as the irritability and the lethargy. I am very sympathetic but family stress is also a factor in mental illness.

                            I am a big fan of CBT. If you break it down to the bare bones, basically if you can make yourself function and act like things are ok, and come back to a more reasonable reality, then eventually you do feel better, for real. Getting there, however, is the struggle, obviously. It does work, though. I use it myself. I am a catastrophic thinker. Just knowing that I am not being rational about thinking the worst and working on my triggers helps lift me out of my funk, even when I am super anxious.

                            I do want to make the point that a GP can help, but as people have said, they don't know everything because they are generalists. Recently, I had to have some serious female issues addressed. My GP came up with a solution that was just wrong, I knew it was wrong. My new gyno who is great not only had experience with my issues, but was able to suggest a new form of treatment (4 days into it now, wish me luck). My GP was trying to be helpful, but just didn't have the expertise to handle it himself. In fact, he misread a test and told me all was fine, and it was not. New gyno was annoyed about that (wasn't life threatening, but needed to be addressed). He was smart enough to refer me, though. So go to someone who knows the ins and outs of this kind of disorder, you will thank yourself later.

                            Ladies, there is hope for perimenopausal issues, PM me if you have an interest in that! It was defintely hurting my riding time.

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              Funny though, a FP is the one who finally helped me. He knew from experience that patients with depression and panic disorder may do best with subclinical doses of the newer antidepressants. The psych I was seeing (who has gotten excellent reviews from patients over the years) did not know this and his treatment was making me sick as a dog.

                              I have no problems with seeing specialists. I don't want a FP operating on my hand for instance, nor would a FP want to. But psychiatry is more of an art than a science at this point.

                              You have to look at the individual doctor. For the most part family doctors will glady refer. As I have said, DH only treats as many patients as he does because we live in a rural area and there is a need for his services.

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                I am a big proponent of being active in your own healthcare. Look stuff up, you don't have to have a medical degree to be informed.

                                You do have to look at the individual doctor, I agree. Which is why I still trust my FP with most things, but am glad I went to a specialist. It's a wise person who can refer, and pick the right person for the referral.

                                I think getting a doctor that can actually do something intelligent with drugs is pretty rare, actually. I have had a few negative experiences with that, and I am very cautious now about just taking someone's word that this little pill will take care of it all.

                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  Originally posted by Kwill View Post
                                  I am a big proponent of being active in your own healthcare. Look stuff up, you don't have to have a medical degree to be informed.

                                  You do have to look at the individual doctor, I agree. Which is why I still trust my FP with most things, but am glad I went to a specialist. It's a wise person who can refer, and pick the right person for the referral.

                                  I think getting a doctor that can actually do something intelligent with drugs is pretty rare, actually. I have had a few negative experiences with that, and I am very cautious now about just taking someone's word that this little pill will take care of it all.
                                  It wasn't my fault that the psych couldn't help me. I was referred to him through a practice partner of my husband's. The psych had helped both his mother (over 10 years ago) and his wife (recently, with severe postpartum depression). At that time he had no reports against him (online, or with the medical board) and I doubt he does now. He treats according to the latest studies and if you're an outlier like me in terms of patient response his treatment won't work. He lacks flexibility in the way that he practices.

                                  It just sucks to be hunting for a doctor in the middle of a crisis if one doesn't work out.

                                  OP, how are you doing?

                                  Comment

                                  • Original Poster

                                    #37
                                    Im doing good thanks, the cipralex is working great at a low dose. Now i get to deal with mild hip bursitis and being tested for thyroid issues.


                                    Really im a fan of benzos and sedetives when needed, for those who dont agree well you arent living in my head!

                                    I trust my gp taking care of this, by no means will ue touch anything he thinks a specialist needs to handle.
                                    Beyond the Ring-para dressage, training, coaching
                                    www.facebook.com/btrparadressage

                                    Proud Team Four Star Minion! Renegade for Life!

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      Ah good. Sorry to hear about the hip and thyroid issues though. I'm a fan of benzos and sedatives as needed too. I don't suffer from straight up anxiety but they were a great help when I was terrified in the days leading up to a surgery (lots of other things going on too, to boot).

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        Originally posted by *Teddy* View Post

                                        Really im a fan of benzos and sedetives when needed, for those who dont agree well you arent living in my head!
                                        This. All day long.

                                        All my love and best wishes to OP. I've struggled with panic disorder for years. Please PM if you ever want/need to talk.
                                        "A horse gallops with his lungs, perseveres with his heart, and wins with his character." - Tesio

                                        Comment


                                        • #40
                                          Originally posted by grayarabpony View Post
                                          The nonsense that family practitioners shouldn't be allowed to prescribe anti-depressants and other mood-altering drugs. .....Some pyschiatrists will prescribe benzos, btw. Freely. In fact since all they do is prescribe meds they love to prescribe meds to counteract the effects of other meds. There are good psychiatrists but imo overall there are many patients who are no better off from having seen one.
                                          totally agree with this. I am a psychologist. I work with FPs all the time and most are excellent in the arena of psychotropics. I also work with psychiatrists, some are outstanding and a few are not. The important thing is to feel like you have ally with whom you feel you can discuss your situation freely and comfortably, and who works WITH you to address your concerns. Some side effects are tolerable to some and totally unacceptable to others.

                                          Depression, however, certainly does NOT have to be a lifelong condition. For some, it is. For others, it is not. Some find antidepressants extremely helpful, others do not. It depends on a number of variables but one just can't generalize.

                                          And as for benzos, like anything else, they are great tools when used appropriately. So are methadone and morphine. When NOT used appropriately, they are not so helpful, but they certainly work for many and that (that they work) is the important thing.

                                          Comment

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