• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

What can you tell me about this pedigree? UPDATE: bone chip

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • What can you tell me about this pedigree? UPDATE: bone chip

    Here is the pedigree of a fellow that is under consideration for becoming a hunter/dressage retraining project. Not for resale.

    http://www.pedigreequery.com/a+maximum+buzz

    What can you tell me about his lineage? Do they tend to have good minds? And has anyone here actually seen this guy in person - PM me if you have and want to share!

    "A Maximum Buzz"
    2002 16.2ish Bay Gelding
    currently racing in the PNW

  • #2
    AP Indy and Ack Ack tend to be fairly to very athletic and Green Dancer horses, in my experience, are DOLLS to work around.
    "Gallop as if you were to die tomorrow, jump as if you were to live forever."

    Comment


    • #3
      Green Dancer appears in quite a few Selle Francais pedigrees. The French clearly think he produces sport horses.
      Janet

      chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle and Tiara. Someone else is now feeding and mucking for Chief and Brain (both foxhunting now).

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #4
        Thanks very much, I have no clue about bloodlines, which means all your input will help us decide if we should go down and take a look at this fellow. He is owned by a friend and would be a giveaway of sorts.

        Comment


        • #5
          Oooh - agree with the other posters! LOVE the Green Dancer and Ack Ack connections here for hunter or eventing in some cases. Had a GORGEOUS Green Dancer that can jump the moon and is very people orientated. Here is his pedigree, http://www.pedigreequery.com/fabulous+impulse and here are his pictures http://s74.photobucket.com/albums/i2...ous%20Impulse/ - one of him jumping, but it doesn't do him justice. I have sold him so I'm hoping to see him show this winter under his new owner.

          My best broodmare has My Babu a little closer up in her pedigree (Sire of Missy Baba who is dam of Raja Baba) - love that connection and she is such a sweet, substantial mare...

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by costco_muffins View Post
            Thanks very much, I have no clue about bloodlines, which means all your input will help us decide if we should go down and take a look at this fellow. He is owned by a friend and would be a giveaway of sorts.
            I agree that it looks like he's got some nice sporthorse influences. I'd suggest taking a look at him. As much as I love TB's and follow breeding, I agree with such trainers as Wayne Lukas and Bob Baffert who say "look for an athlete first." Make the decision based on what you see. Is he straight and balanced? Does he has a nice attitude? Does he have the kind of personality that you want to work with? Answer those questions and if the answer is yes, don't let pedigree issues block you. The fact is that all TB's are bred to be athletes. If you go back a few generations they all have blue blood. You're not going to be riding/training or showing the papers!

            have fun, keep us posted on your decision.
            F O.B
            Resident racing historian ~~~ Re-riders Clique
            Founder of the Mighty Thoroughbred Clique

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #7
              witherbee - Your fellow is gorgeous! Hopefully Max will be as good looking and athletic.

              He is owned by an old friend of mine who gives away his racehorses when they are ready to come off the track. Gives them to the best home, not the highest bidder. I told him what I wanted a horse for - local hunters up to 3' and dressage - and he said "Max would LOVE that!" Apparently he is coming 6, bay, 16.2ish and a gelding. We know nothing else about him except that he won a few races in 2006 and has been slowly moving down in ranks at the local track, a sure sign that he wants to become a hunter!

              His owner is going to take a look at him in the next week and decide if he is ready to pass Max on to a new home. If he does want to give him away, we are getting in the car and heading to Portland to take a look at him... maybe with a trailer in tow!

              I only hope that he is decently correct and has a good mind. Fingers crossed!

              Comment

              • Original Poster

                #8
                Got the news today that Max has a chip in one knee. Owners just had him x-rayed and wanted to share all the details with us before we made a decision...

                Now comes the hard part... do we go see him or back out?? Definitely don't want to fall in love with a horse that isn't able to do his job, but also don't want to rule out a horse that could be nice in the future. $1800, 6 months layup. Oy.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Heck, if he's free, and the surgery will be $1800 and six months off, and he's got a good mind and nice conformation (i.e would you take him without the chip), I'd do it.

                  He's still going to be cheap enough, and you'll be giving him a chance for a good new home.
                  "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
                  Thread killer Extraordinaire

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    My "free horse" with a chip turned out nicely after surgery -- but the handwalking phase is a big commitment of time - every day for six weeks - and will test you and the horse in every way. Also, even arthroscopic surgery is not without risk (as in the case of the Tin Man, coming out of anaesthesia can be the most dangerous time). If he has been racing with the chip a while it could have done some damage inside the joint (you said he had been slipping down the ranks, I think) and while he should be serviceably sound, he might not be a top competition prospect. So you have to accept the risks as well as the cost.

                    I already had a commitment to my horse, so I didn't have to make this kind of choice, fortunately.

                    I would think hard about whether you are really up to it -- because if you go see him, your heart will likely become involved and this is a decision to make with your head.

                    If you do decide to go for it, kudos to you.
                    Publisher, http://www.endurance-101.com
                    Blog: http://blog.seattlepi.com/horsebytes/

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Don't come over here much (eventer), but just wanted to say my now 7yo OTTB from portland meadows has a chip in his knee. He's been training and competing completely sound on it for two years, schooled up to 3'9", galloped at the beach, no problems. I'm conscientious about what he does and how much, but he's been great.

                      Good luck! I can't wait for my next one!

                      Comment

                      • Original Poster

                        #12
                        We are getting the x-rays tomorrow, and can see him this weekend... plus talk to the vets.

                        Apparently he was let down after Emerald due to some soreness, turned out to pasture to rest, is now completely sound and happy in the field (running, bucking, etc). When we mentioned that we might have a home for him the owner took x-rays of his legs to determine what to do - either stick him back in training (trainer's vote) or retire him to a pleasure home (owner's vote). The bone chip lets him retire! Fingers crossed for a horse who DOESN'T need surgery.

                        His last race was August 10th. And I will post some photos if we go down to see him!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I'm not sure who owns this horse now, but if you PM me I will put you in touch with his breeder if they're not still the same. There is a gal on this board that has worked with a lot of the Matricules as well.

                          I LOVE the few Matricule's that I've been around, great minds, very athletic, nice to be around. IMO he's a very underated sire in the NW.

                          I bought a mare with a chip at the age of 5, showed her at third level dressage. Her hocks gave out long before her knees. Only at 22, did she show signs of ever having a knee injury.

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            #14
                            If you know some Matricules, then you might have heard of this guy... I think that he is the leading progeny of Matricule, won four races in 2006 and over 26K. Not tons, but not bad for a Washington bred!

                            Comment

                            • Original Poster

                              #15
                              Heading to Enumclaw on Sunday to visit Max - he is sound on the knee now, so I will hop on him if he is looking and acting okay! Pictures sure to follow.

                              If we don't take him there are several other people that have asked Owner about him, so he will definitely be going to a loving home, whatever we decide.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                I'm coming to this late, but I would like to share my experiences with chips.

                                I have purchased two mare off the track and both had fetlock chips. Both were sound at the time of purchase. Ya-ya, the first mare, went lame about a year later, and the chips had worn through the cartilage. I spent several thousand trying to get her sound and never did. Considering the damage in her joints, it was amazing that she got sound enough to just be a pasture pet. I gave her away as a broodmare.

                                Blush, the second mare, was radiographed at the track before I bought her. Vet said no chips, but only did one or two views. Three years later she went off. We went to CSU where a chip was discovered. It was in a very atypical place and the vets did believe she had it since racing. When they went in to remove the chip, they discovered two depo-deposits--areas of calcified cartilage, often caused by depo-medrol injections. One had healthy cartilage underneath, one had failing bone that had to be debrided. Blush remained very sore in the joint, even after HA injections and is now sound after IRAP. I have no idea how long she will stay sound but don't have high hopes. This year my insurance has paid me over $5k, so that gives you an idea of how much I've spent...

                                Chips do not always end well, as the previous experiences here seem to indicate. Given my experiences, I would absolutely NOT screw around with a horse that is known to have chips ever again. It can be absolutely heartbreaking.

                                Good luck with whatever you decide.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Simkie...

                                  Well over a year after turning down a WONDERFUL OTTB by Dynaformer, your post has finally justified what I knew in my heart. I leased him for two months before vetting him out and he ended up having a large bone chip in his fetlock. He flexed sound, which surprised the vet since he had 42 starts. He actually beat Colonial Colony back in the day. Xrays proved otherwise.

                                  Thanks for your detailed post. I've struggled with my decision this entire time.
                                  Bit n' Bridle Equestrian Shop - Apparel and gifts for horse lovers.

                                  Lindsay Abel Equine Photography

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    I "know" this horse's breeder as well--she's on my racehorse list. Truly a small world.
                                    Life would be infinitely better if pinatas suddenly appeared throughout the day.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      re: chip in knee

                                      It sounds as though they have been very careful with this horse. One chip in the knee, depending on the size, location etc. is very easily dealt with, even in many cases, time off and the chip will dissolve as many are just calcium deposits. If the horse was continuously run and injected with steroids you are speaking of a whole different kettle of fish. Interacticular damage, at the very least. In the ankle, I have seen bone on bone, significant arthritic changes, etc. I have had several who have had chips, opted not to do surgery and gave the horse enough time off and the matters were resolved so as to allow horses to return to a reasonable competitive career. It really all depends on the management of the horse post injury.
                                      "We, too, will be remembered not for victories or defeats in battle or in politics, but for our contribution to the human spirit." JFK

                                      Comment

                                      Working...
                                      X