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EDIT: Horse determined to be "Sintown", pedigree included. Anyone familiar?

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  • EDIT: Horse determined to be "Sintown", pedigree included. Anyone familiar?

    This is a long shot, but I'm wondering if anyone knows of a Thoroughbred stallion - possibly Canadian - named Sin Town or something that sounds similar but may have different spelling?

    I did find a "Sin Town" but he's a 2003 model and this stallion would be a fair bit older. The one I'm looking for would be the sire of a horse likely born in the 80s.

    I'm pretty sure this is much too vague to have any luck, but I figured I'd give it a shot.

    TIA
    Last edited by overthemoon; Feb. 19, 2013, 01:43 PM. Reason: Looking for more info!

  • #2
    Do you or anyone you know have the horse born in the 80's paperwork? Usually for TBs its easy to come by. I did a bunch of variant spellings of Sin Town (Sin, sinn, towne, cinn, cin, etc) in the database but didn't get anything ):
    AETERNUM VALE, INVICTUS - 7/10/2012

    Comment

    • Original Poster

      #3
      Originally posted by beowulf View Post
      Do you or anyone you know have the horse born in the 80's paperwork? Usually for TBs its easy to come by. I did a bunch of variant spellings of Sin Town (Sin, sinn, towne, cinn, cin, etc) in the database but didn't get anything ):
      No.

      Thank you for checking though! I appreciate you trying.

      Comment

      • Original Poster

        #4
        Update: I think it is "Sintown" (one word)... Still can't find anything though.

        Comment

        • Original Poster

          #5
          Here is the only thing I can find in reference to him. An ad from a 1980 paper in Montreal. Ad is about halfway down the page.

          They mentioned a registered stallion... I would think that would make things easier, haha.

          Comment


          • #6
            I can find only 1 Sintown registered with the Jockey Club (that is, in addition to the mare born in 2003 named Sin Town). I didn't find anything else, but here is his pedigree:

            http://www.equineline.com/Free-5X-Pe...ts_indicator=Y
            Hidden Echo Farm, Carlisle, PA -- home of JC palomino sire Canadian Kid (1990 - 2013) & AQHA sire Lark's Favorite, son of Rugged Lark.

            Comment

            • Original Poster

              #7
              Originally posted by KBEquine View Post
              I can find only 1 Sintown registered with the Jockey Club (that is, in addition to the mare born in 2003 named Sin Town). I didn't find anything else, but here is his pedigree:

              http://www.equineline.com/Free-5X-Pe...ts_indicator=Y
              Foaled in Ontario! That's probably him! Thank you!

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by KBEquine View Post
                I can find only 1 Sintown registered with the Jockey Club (that is, in addition to the mare born in 2003 named Sin Town). I didn't find anything else, but here is his pedigree:

                http://www.equineline.com/Free-5X-Pedigree.cfm?page_state=ORDER_AND_CONFIRM&referenc e_number=457410&registry=T&horse_name=Sintown&dam_ name=Fabius Fanny&foaling_year=1969&nicking_stats_indicator=Y
                A rare sire line even then. Did he have any progeny of note?
                **********
                Starts with an 'S,' ends with a 'T.' You figure it out.

                **********
                "Houston, Tranquility Base here, picking up where we left off ..."

                Comment


                • #9
                  "A rare sire line even then. "

                  Why rare? I'm not getting it but I'm not as knowledgeable as many of you about breeding. If anyone could kindly explain. Thanks.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Sire lines become "rare" usually from being non-productive. Successful sire lines breed on, unsuccessful ones don't.

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      #11
                      Originally posted by WhiteCamry View Post
                      A rare sire line even then. Did he have any progeny of note?
                      I know nothing about him, apart from the mare we had. She was a phenomenal hunter/jumper producer. One of our best, certainly.

                      Speaking of - I was going to make a separate thread for this, but does anyone know anything about Sintown's breeding?

                      Comment

                      • Original Poster

                        #12
                        Anyone? I take it his breeding isn't anything special. Just curious to learn more!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Only By Night View Post
                          Anyone? I take it his breeding isn't anything special. Just curious to learn more!
                          I'm the amateur's amateur's amateur, so anything I offer should be taken with a saltmine.

                          That much said, Sintown was tail-male great-great-grandson of Man o'War. But a four-generation separation is no great indicator of future performance. Even a two-generation separation is no great promise - indeed, most thoroughbreds have at least one notable stakes-winning grandparent and, often as not, two.

                          According to this user-participant website, Sintown's sire Yorktown won a couple of minor handicap races at age 5. His one notable progeny was Yorkville (Sintown's half-brother, in human terms) who won the Sanford Stakes (a top race for two-year-olds) and hit the board in several other races but was himself no great racing sire.

                          Look around that site; you'll find interesting notes. Yorktown's own sire Battlefield was a stellar performer, winning half his 44 starts in a four year career (numbers you just don't see today!) but was a mediocre sire - Yorktown was his best progeny. You'd be hard pressed to find descendants of Battlefield in the thoroughbred studbook today (whether you could find half-bred descendants I've no idea.)

                          On Sintown's mother's side his damsire (maternal grandfather) Fabius won the Preakness, ran 2nd in the KD and 3rd in the Belmont; this alone would ensure that his daughters would find their way onto stud farms. His own progeny were no great shakes on or off the track, and I've yet to read of him at any website that he was a decent damsire.
                          Last edited by WhiteCamry; Mar. 26, 2013, 03:17 PM.
                          **********
                          Starts with an 'S,' ends with a 'T.' You figure it out.

                          **********
                          "Houston, Tranquility Base here, picking up where we left off ..."

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Possibly the reason your mare was a good h/j producer is found in the depths of the pedigree. There you find many lines that were superlative producers in those disciplines.

                            War Relic is about as good as it gets. Then there is a Display daughter, and the other sires from Display daughters (Bold Ruler, Native Dancer, Traffic Judge (?), Hasty Road (and more), all fairly reliably passed on "the Jump", as did Royal Charger. Then you have several lines to the Roi Herode branch of the Herod line, and they jump.That's the source of Bonne Nuit and many more. As does the Dollar Herod line that is represented here by Ksar/Tourbillon. Tiberius was from a Captain Cuttle mare from the European Matchem line, and Captain Cuttle himself is a good jumping line. Foxlaw himself (by Son-In-Law, a golden line in sport) has many sport descendants, mostly through his son Foxhunter. who was the sire of Hunter's Moon IV and several others who sired excellent chasers and sport horses.

                            His bottom side has an almost perfect sport horse TB pedigree.

                            In short, while he might not have been able to sire runners, it's no surprise at all that he could sire sport horses. If you look at the pedigrees of the old USET TB jumpers--and I do mean old--, you see many commonalities.

                            Sintown is a stallion who should have been in an almost non-existent sport horse TB breeding program.
                            Last edited by vineyridge; Feb. 21, 2013, 01:09 PM.
                            "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
                            Thread killer Extraordinaire

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                            • #15
                              I had a Pilate (1928) grandson as my pony club horse in the 60s. He could do anything. The week before my A test I was bored with practicing so I taught him to pull a cart.
                              A man must love a thing very much if he not only practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practices it without any hope of doing it well.--G. K. Chesterton

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                              • #16
                                Originally posted by vineyridge View Post
                                If you look at the pedigrees of the old USET TB jumpers--and I do mean old--, you see many commonalities.
                                Where are they listed?
                                **********
                                Starts with an 'S,' ends with a 'T.' You figure it out.

                                **********
                                "Houston, Tranquility Base here, picking up where we left off ..."

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Some are in the Show Jumping Hall of Fame. Names often have been changed, so it's not always easy.

                                  Peter Birdsall, DVM from Canada published some books in the 1980s on bloodlines of North American Hunters and Jumpers. I have one three volume set that is called just that--"Bloodlines of Hunters and Jumpers in North America". It was published in 1981, and I believe there is an update in 1985 which I have not yet found. The set has 4 generation pedigrees of the horses that he determined were superior from results. There are also a set of articles by him on TB sport horse bloodlines that can be found on Hugh Mahon's website. Unfortunately, I've lost all my bookmarks.

                                  You could try googling Birdsall and bloodlines.
                                  "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
                                  Thread killer Extraordinaire

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                                  • Original Poster

                                    #18
                                    Wow, thanks for the information. Very, very interesting.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      From the ad, it actually looks as if he was in a sport horse breeding program. That's probably why he's so rare in racing.
                                      "I'm a lumberjack, and I'm okay."
                                      Thread killer Extraordinaire

                                      Comment

                                      • Original Poster

                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by vineyridge View Post
                                        From the ad, it actually looks as if he was in a sport horse breeding program. That's probably why he's so rare in racing.
                                        Do you know anything about his breeders listed on the secondary website? I tried to track down the farm but didn't have any luck. Doesn't help much that he was born in the 60s, haha.

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