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2013 Kentucky Derby 139th Edition: congrats to Orb (Shug, Joel, Phipps/Janney)

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  • Original Poster

    Video replays of Derby:

    139th Derby - Mark Johnson (Churchill Downs in house) race version

    139th Derby - Larry Collmus (NBC Sports caller) race version

    Comment


    • It sure was nice to see the horse that had trained so well coming into the race get the trip he needed to win. Kudos to Joel for being the patient rider that he was today and letting this horse get to where he needed to be for his successful trip! Thrilled for the connections especially Shug who at first appeared a little shell shocked that they won.
      On a more snarky side note while Pletcher sure has a barn full of very talented horses(and I take nothing away from that) maybe next year he will enter 10 and at least have a 50% shot.
      "When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro."-Hunter S. Thompson

      Comment


      • Glim, you rock hard!!! I've been on the tb champ site waiting for someone to post a video. I pop in here and see you've set two, thanks.

        Nice win by Orb, I was glad to see Revolutionary do well too. The Preakness is going to be exciting! Congrats to the Orb camp.
        Hillary Rodham Clinton - the peoples choice for president.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by MadeYaLook View Post
          It sure was nice to see the horse that had trained so well coming into the race get the trip he needed to win. Kudos to Joel for being the patient rider that he was today and letting this horse get to where he needed to be for his successful trip! Thrilled for the connections especially Shug who at first appeared a little shell shocked that they won.
          On a more snarky side note while Pletcher sure has a barn full of very talented horses(and I take nothing away from that) maybe next year he will enter 10 and at least have a 50% shot.
          I don't get the Pletcher comment, it's not him, it's five sets of owners with five exceptionally talented horses that trust him above anyone else with their horses. From my perspective, the fact that he had five horses of derby caliber means he must be doing something right.

          Do you think he just rounded up five ponies and then magically qualified them overnight for this ONE race? Gah... Having more than one horse in any graded stake is something all trainers dream of. I'm glad for him that he can make that happen.

          "Pat the horse; kick yourself" - Carl Hester

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Angelico View Post
            I don't get the Pletcher comment, it's not him, it's five sets of owners with five exceptionally talented horses that trust him above anyone else with their horses. From my perspective, the fact that he had five horses of derby caliber means he must be doing something right.

            Do you think he just rounded up five ponies and then magically qualified them overnight for this ONE race? Gah... Having more than one horse in any graded stake is something all trainers dream of. I'm glad for him that he can make that happen.
            Right off the top of my head is that he is a cold fish, one of the "business" school type trainers and he has lots of rich owners. What's to like? He is a student of D Wayne and goes through lots of horses.

            A nice horse, with a wonderful old school gentleman trainer. It was so nice to see that horse come through that pack from way off the pace, in the mud, no tongue hanging out of his mouth turning blue, no blinkers, no funny nose bands. Good ride, and wonderful race. I am glad.
            "We, too, will be remembered not for victories or defeats in battle or in politics, but for our contribution to the human spirit." JFK

            Comment


            • Pletcher used Palace Malice as a rabbit to set up the race. The early fractions were brutal. His best shot was Revolutionary. I'm just thankful that ORB won and especially for Orb's connections. Good karma.
              In an age when scientists are creating artificial intelligence, too many of our educational institutions seem to be creating artificial stupidity.—Thomas Sowell, Is Thinking Obsolete?

              Comment


              • Glad Orb won for all the above reasons - tradition, etc.
                And kudos to Rosie - not sure any other jockey could have had her horse at 5th - same for Gary Stevens getting Lukas's horse to 6th.

                But still love Normandy Invasion. And would like to like him, but just don't think Castellano is a gutsy or precise enough rider in the big races, especially this one. Think if they changed jockeys (why didn't they use Lezcano?) he'll give Orb continued competition in the big races.

                Hope everyone came back to the barn fine with no issues this morning.
                But he thought, "This procession has got to go on." So he walked more proudly than ever, as his noblemen held high the train that wasn't there at all. H.C.Anderson

                Comment


                • Glad I am not the only one who with the same reaction to that plain brown bridle- no white, no do dads on that plain bay looking like the subject of a grainy black and white shot in a history book.

                  Not so sure old school is the right term either, prefer time tested and often ignored in our age of instant gratification. Making the horseman's call to work with the horse the way that suits the horse, not make the horse fit the race to satisfy the whims of owners and promises of trainers.

                  When speaking of TP they did point out his average odds over the years have been something like 27-1 and PPs have indicated they should have been longer for a lot of them. That said, I had Verrazano ( alone and with Orb in an exacta)who was legit IMO, hope he just hated the mud and is OK.
                  In the post race show they had a camera on TP watching the finish live in the clubhouse...his reaction seemed obvious disappointment in his jock...

                  Imagine the next 2 weeks will be the best of Orbs connections track lives because they know what they may have in that colt and what could happen as well as the worst because they know what they may have and what else could happen.

                  Its certainly time and maybe he is THE one to break the drought. Or yet another of the coulda, shoulda, woulda crowd. I like this one lot better then alot of those, but that's been sort if a curse in past years.
                  When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

                  The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

                  Comment

                  • Original Poster

                    Daisy Phipps Pulito tweeted this yesterday - before the Derby - quite the sentiment

                    Twitter pic of Orb this morning - before being shipped to NY

                    Who is running in the Preakness against Orb? As is very typical in this era few Derby starters:

                    Pletcher says none of his 5 Derby runners will run in Preakness. Verrazano had gash on left hock, likely stepped on, will be ok.

                    Comment

                    • Original Poster

                      Equibase Derby Chart - final - Race 11, May 4, 2013

                      Finnish. Horse. (Jockey)
                      1. Orb (Rosario, Joel) [won by 2 1/2 lengths]
                      2. Golden Soul (Albarado, Robby) [1 length to 3rd]
                      3. Revolutionary (Borel, Calvin) [a head back to 4th]

                      4. Normandy Invasion (Castellano, Javier)
                      5. Mylute (Napravnik, Rosie)
                      6. Oxbow (Stevens, Gary)
                      7. Lines of Battle (Moore, Ryan)
                      8. Will Take Charge (Court, Jon)
                      9. Charming Kitten (Prado, Edgar)
                      10. Giant Finish (Espinoza, Jose)
                      11. Overanalyze (Bejarano, Rafael)
                      12. Palace Malice (Smith, Mike)
                      13. Java's War (Leparoux, Julien)
                      14. Verrazano (Velazquez, John)
                      15. Itsmyluckyday (Trujillo, Elvis)
                      16. Frac Daddy (Lebron, Victor)
                      17. Goldencents (Krigger, Kevin)
                      18. Vyjack (Gomez, Garrett)
                      19. Falling Sky (Saez, Luis) [finished 19 lengths behind Orb]

                      Comment


                      • To me the most remarkable thing about this year's Derby was Golden Soul's 2nd place finish, but I haven't seen much mentioned about it anywhere. Pre race he wasn't seen as a real contender. I don't know much about racing, but it seemed like an awesome accomplishment given that he was up against the best of the best on a difficult track and came through. Was it more luck than skill and talent?

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by capricorn View Post
                          To me the most remarkable thing about this year's Derby was Golden Soul's 2nd place finish, but I haven't seen much mentioned about it anywhere. Pre race he wasn't seen as a real contender. I don't know much about racing, but it seemed like an awesome accomplishment given that he was up against the best of the best on a difficult track and came through. Was it more luck than skill and talent?
                          Just read this!

                          http://www.courier-journal.com/artic...nishing-second
                          But he thought, "This procession has got to go on." So he walked more proudly than ever, as his noblemen held high the train that wasn't there at all. H.C.Anderson

                          Comment

                          • Original Poster

                            Originally posted by capricorn View Post
                            To me the most remarkable thing about this year's Derby was Golden Soul's 2nd place finish, but I haven't seen much mentioned about it anywhere.
                            Agreed that he was well under the radar, although to be fair he only got into the Derby early last week. The late withdrawal by Bob Baffert of two runners who had enough points opened the door for Dallas Stewart (a former D. Wayne Lukas assistant) to get in. In hind sight, comments in NOLA last week:

                            Stewart is equally confident in Golden Soul even though he's won just once in five starts.

                            Golden Soul is a stone-cold closer. His sire is Irish stayer Perfect Soul the Canadian champion turf horse in 2003. His dam is Hollywood Gold, an unraced daughter of Mr. Prospector, who sired 2000 Derby winner Fusaichi Pegasus.

                            "I think he'll be competitive," said Stewart, 53. "He got beat four lengths (in the Louisiana Derby) to a very good horse in Revolutionary and he had a wide trip. The distance will suit him. The horse has great stamina."

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by findeight View Post
                              Glad I am not the only one who with the same reaction to that plain brown bridle- no white, no do dads on that plain bay looking like the subject of a grainy black and white shot in a history book.
                              LOL

                              Its certainly time and maybe he is THE one to break the drought. Or yet another of the coulda, shoulda, woulda crowd. I like this one lot better then alot of those, but that's been sort if a curse in past years.
                              True, it would be satisfying seeing a Triple Crown going to someone who would deserve a Triple Crown, rather than the horse merely shouldering all the work.
                              But he thought, "This procession has got to go on." So he walked more proudly than ever, as his noblemen held high the train that wasn't there at all. H.C.Anderson

                              Comment


                              • Interesting that the 1-5 finishers all had Secretariat in their pedigree on the 40th anniversary of his triple crown win! As a matter of fact, I was surprised at how many of the entrants did, mostly through AP Indy and Dehere (although I only looked at the top 8 or 9 finishers).

                                Comment


                                • Originally posted by Calamber View Post
                                  Right off the top of my head is that he is a cold fish, one of the "business" school type trainers and he has lots of rich owners. What's to like? He is a student of D Wayne and goes through lots of horses.

                                  A nice horse, with a wonderful old school gentleman trainer. It was so nice to see that horse come through that pack from way off the pace, in the mud, no tongue hanging out of his mouth turning blue, no blinkers, no funny nose bands. Good ride, and wonderful race. I am glad.
                                  So do you know him personally? His "business school" approach is obviously working for him. You do know that Shug works for the Phipps, and they aren't exactly poor themselves...

                                  A little newsflash for you, the more horses you have sent to you, the more you will run through that don't cut it. That average will remain consistent no matter how old school your bridle looks.

                                  "Pat the horse; kick yourself" - Carl Hester

                                  Comment


                                  • OK, so now I'm hitting myself upside the head.

                                    Always wondered why it took Orb so long to break his maiden. His first 4 races, including his first win, all done without Lasix. Didn't see that until just minutes ago reading about it and then looking up those races. I realize the first race often done without, but the first four... That really seems conservative in a great way.

                                    Am also curious about those nostrils. They appear so flared and larger appearing than normal. Guessing it's a help getting lots of air back to the lungs?

                                    Let alone all the other good things going for him.
                                    But he thought, "This procession has got to go on." So he walked more proudly than ever, as his noblemen held high the train that wasn't there at all. H.C.Anderson

                                    Comment


                                    • Originally posted by CVPeg View Post
                                      OK, so now I'm hitting myself upside the head.

                                      Always wondered why it took Orb so long to break his maiden. His first 4 races, including his first win, all done without Lasix. Didn't see that until just minutes ago reading about it and then looking up those races. I realize the first race often done without, but the first four... That really seems conservative in a great way.

                                      Am also curious about those nostrils. They appear so flared and larger appearing than normal. Guessing it's a help getting lots of air back to the lungs?

                                      Let alone all the other good things going for him.
                                      I noticed his nostrils too, and it almost looked like his right one might have had a cut at some point? They are huge!
                                      Mystic Owl Sporthorses
                                      www.mysticowlsporthorses.com

                                      Comment


                                      • Originally posted by Calamber View Post
                                        Right off the top of my head is that he is a cold fish, one of the "business" school type trainers and he has lots of rich owners. What's to like? He is a student of D Wayne and goes through lots of horses.

                                        A nice horse, with a wonderful old school gentleman trainer. It was so nice to see that horse come through that pack from way off the pace, in the mud, no tongue hanging out of his mouth turning blue, no blinkers, no funny nose bands. Good ride, and wonderful race. I am glad.
                                        I just hope you don't kid yourself that it's not a business for Shug, too. People who don't treat horses as a business don't stay in the business that long or have that many good horses. It's kind of a freak set of circumstances this is his first Derby--he's had lots of right horses, finally his horse had the right day! Pletcher has a lot of owners and works that business model--if it means he has five who can qualify, he's doing something that works.

                                        And I see a lot more funny nose bands and blue tongues in horse sports that don't involve anything but hobby riders after shiny ribbons and coolers than in racing. People use equipment they think will help with horses, whether they've got paying owners who'd like a win picture to hang in the living room or paying owners who want a tri-color ribbon to hang in their living room.
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                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by Peggy View Post
                                          Were some of the horses wearing flash nosebands? It looked like it. Seems like an odd choice if you want to horse to be able to breathe efficiently.
                                          Yes they were. Flash nosebands are quite common, and the rubber figure-8 noseband is the new *in style* of racetrack noseband.
                                          imo unless you need a shadow roll why a noseband in a TB racer at all?

                                          Comment

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