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Help with stallion choices!

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  • Help with stallion choices!

    Trying to decide between Flatter (3 graded stakes horses running this weekend), Flashy Bull, or Suave. Would sell as weanling or yearling. Any thoughts?

  • #2
    need more info

    who is the mare?
    A man must love a thing very much if he not only practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practices it without any hope of doing it well.--G. K. Chesterton


    • #3
      What's the mare's pedigree?

      Flatter: love his female family and like AP Indy, but he wasn't the most durable runner. He has been okay commercially, but not exactly setting the world on fire, and I wouldn't be surprised to see those numbers dip after his moderate ranking on the freshman sire list.

      Suave: a higher priced AP Indy, but a very good race record. If his first foals look good, you'll be golden. Darby Dan, although a wonderful operation, hasn't been terribly impressive making stallions recently, though.

      Flashy Bull: Holy Bull doesn't get enough respect and this is going to hurt this horse. But, with Macho Uno's recently becoming hot, this might be the time to go to a son of HB. He's a good looking horse and a GR1 winner, so if his foals look as good as he does, they should have some appeal. I'd like him a lot more at $7,500.


      • Original Poster

        Came Home mare but honestly most concerned with commercial yearling


        • #5
          Lots of buyers still like to see the dam's side (sometimes even more) than the sire's side, especially for commercial sale.

          I know when I look at a catalog page, I look more towards the dam lines than the sire lines. The mare is going to be a BIGGER factor than the sire in a commercial yearling.


          • Original Poster

            Sleepy Fox, I agree with most points. But do you think Flatter will get more commercial now that he has all these graded stakes runners? He has MSW all the time lately as well. Suave makes me nervous being a second year and trying to sell the baby if his 2 yr olds aren't precocious. Flashy Bull is first year and therefore a safer commercial bet and Macho Uno should do Holy Bull some good


            • Original Poster

              Mare's family is very commercial. Her half brother sold this September for 120. The dam sold for 260. Another half for 230. So her family is good. Just trying to get a commercial foal to get some income while I wait and see if these high selling relatives improve family


              • #8
                Originally posted by keepthelegend View Post
                Sleepy Fox, I agree with most points. But do you think Flatter will get more commercial now that he has all these graded stakes runners? He has MSW all the time lately as well. Suave makes me nervous being a second year and trying to sell the baby if his 2 yr olds aren't precocious. Flashy Bull is first year and therefore a safer commercial bet and Macho Uno should do Holy Bull some good
                If your mare is a Came Home, she's young. Unraced? But, still she sounds like a pretty strong mare. Potentially too much mare for Flatter? Is that a bad thing? IDK. TT has Flatter still at #16 on the second crop sire list as of today (I checked). If he has a big weekend, how much do you think it will pull him up?

                I understand your point about Suave, and his babies may not be the most precocious. He did well as a 2yo, but you can't argue that he wasn't more of a classic horse. However, you can always sell a Suave as a weanling.

                I agree, the first year stallion is a good bet commercially. But, I'm thinking his babies are really going to have to look the part to sell well. Have you heard anything about what kind of book he's getting quality- and quantity-wise? And, Airdrie's plans to support him? For some reason, I suspect this is another Airdrie horse that will be sold off after his first couple of seasons. Not a bad thing if you breed to him now to sell as a yearling, though.

                Yeah, I'm not a lot of help, am I? Sorry!


                • Original Poster

                  Thanks so much. Even if Flatter is 16th he has some high quality horses - not just a lot of fast early types that rack up the 2 yr old wins. Flashy Bull is full and hard to get to so appears popular. Suave....feel like if I go to him I might as well go to the proven A.P. Indy at 1/4 price! But still a consideration. Any other sires I should think about? The mare is 4 and had a short career never out of money but no black type


                  • #10
                    Flatter has Mad Flatter running in the Lecomte this weekend in NoLa. I'd have to snoop into Flashy Bull's female family, but as a freshman, if there is going to be a "good early season" come sales time, it will be his first season.
                    F O.B
                    Resident racing historian ~~~ Re-riders Clique
                    Founder of the Mighty Thoroughbred Clique


                    • Original Poster

                      Hoping Champagne Eyes (Flatter) runs well today but also now considering Songster, Kafwain and Yankee Gentlemen. Opinions grealy appreciated especially regarding Songster - I have been in pony hunter land for the last few years!


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by keepthelegend View Post
                        Hoping Champagne Eyes (Flatter) runs well today but also now considering Songster, Kafwain and Yankee Gentlemen. Opinions grealy appreciated especially regarding Songster - I have been in pony hunter land for the last few years!
                        Mad Flatter looked good in the LeCompte, but over the weekend, Flatter actually moved down a spot on the second crop sire list.

                        Songster is at a good farm, but I suspect he's going to be their next Rossini. I'd make sure your mare is a good physical match with him. Foals out of young, unproven mares by young, unproven stallions do sell well, but I'm hesitant that Songster is going to be the flavor of the month any time soon. If pedigree, physical, etc. matches well, you could take the gamble, but I wouldn't risk it with this horse if the mating was iffy in any aspect.

                        I like Kafwain. His sales figures are a little more consistent than Yankee Gentleman's, too. YG is at a farm where they quickly discard horses - will he be there when it's time to sell your foal or if his first crop doesn't come on strong as 3yos, will he be expelled from KY?


                        • Original Poster

                          Good points, I am now deciding between Flashy Bull and Songster. Flashy Bull is bigger and for a first foal that makes me feel a little better. But in the mare's immediate family there is a Songandprayer 2 yr old with Jerry Hollendorfer that sold well....would look very smart if it becomes SW and I bred to Songster! Haha, now that I have thought that its guaranteed to be a maiden for life!


                          • Original Poster

                            Ended up going with Flashy Bull and mare is 45 days in foal!


                            • #15
                              I am acquanted with one of the partners in Flashy Bull from his race days. They were devastated when he retired but have high hopes for him. I think he will do well. I'll let her know that I "met" someone who's bred to him already.
                              Best of luck!
                              F O.B
                              Resident racing historian ~~~ Re-riders Clique
                              Founder of the Mighty Thoroughbred Clique