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The Triple Crown Races 2019

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  • Originally posted by Sunflower View Post
    A law suit for what?
    It wouldnt be the first time the outcome of a sporting event would be challenged in court because of calls made by officials that completely changed the outcome. I’m not saying they should sue, just that if they do they have some arguments that deserve some consideration and thought. Personally, I think they should just focus on blowing away the competition in the next two TC races and the BC later this season, make that their statement.
    Talking to some people is like folding a fitted sheet.

    Comment


    • 2019 Kentucky Derby: What Happens When Snowflakes Become Jockeys

      I say this only half tongue in cheek because I deal with college students who will cry foul at ANYTHING (even invent things) to improve their grade.

      Comment


      • They just showed the slow-motion film. Why they didn't show it while all the hoopla was going on I don't know. I thought it looked clearer in slo-mo what happened with MS and War of Will. I wish they had showed that at the time.
        Rack on!

        Comment


        • Triple Crowns winners do not happen every year-- in fact-- not so long ago-- it had been decades between them- so I do not see this affecting racing interest.... it is just racing. The basis upon which the horse is DQ'd-- i.e. the rule-- is not being clearly stated in any of the media so far. Perhaps someone with some racing knowledge could clarify-- but my lunderstanding is that the DQ is due to the severity of what happened-- not whether it happened to Country House or to another horse-- and that it has to be very serious to be a DQ rather than a change to the order of finish. Blood Horse is saying the objection came from Country House's jockey.
          A canter is a cure for every evil. ~Benjamin Disraeli

          Comment


          • I just wish Bayern had been DQ'ed in the 2014 Classic. What he did was worse. Not saying this was wrong, but Country House was not winning that race.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by AffirmedHope View Post

              It wouldnt be the first time the outcome of a sporting event would be challenged in court because of calls made by officials that completely changed the outcome. I’m not saying they should sue, just that if they do they have some arguments that deserve some consideration and thought. Personally, I think they should just focus on blowing away the competition in the next two TC races and the BC later this season, make that their statement.
              Yes, but on what basis would a law suit be brought? i.e. what cause of action?
              A canter is a cure for every evil. ~Benjamin Disraeli

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Runner57 View Post
                I just wish Bayern had been DQ'ed in the 2014 Classic. What he did was worse. Not saying this was wrong, but Country House was not winning that race.
                For others like me who might need a memory refresher:
                https://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/02/s...ld-finish.html

                Rack on!

                Comment


                • Had anyone heard what War of Will’s jockey had to say? MS definitely affected some other horses but not sure if I agree with Country House being declared the winner or MS being taken down to last.
                  Last edited by ravenclaw; May. 4, 2019, 08:53 PM.

                  Comment


                  • I honestly believe CH's objection had less to do with it than the stewards inquiry. Isn't that supported by the fact that they completely DQ'ed him as opposed to placing him only behind the horse filing the objection? I thought I heard Bill Mott said in the post race he didn't think his horse was all that affected..

                    It's clear Maximum Security was the best horse in the race, but that doesn't mean he can completely cut off the path of the horses behind him. It isn't about only affecting the outcome of the race, it's impeding the forward course of another horse, and if you can't see that he did that to War of Wills (and consequently the 18 horse), you're watching a different race.

                    I feel awful for the connections bc I'm sure it wasn't intentional and MS was clearly the best, but you don't a free pass on that. Thank goodness WoW held his feet bc that would've been disastrous. And honestly, CH didn't run the winning race but he definitely outran his odds. I'm sure they would've been tickled with 2nd too.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Sunflower View Post

                      Yes, but on what basis would a law suit be brought? i.e. what cause of action?
                      Most likely against the stewards and track management and whether or not they properly interpreted and applied the rules when making the call. They would probably claim economic damages ($1.86 million is a hell of an amount even for wealthy race horse owners) and of course I’m sure they would claim things like emotional distress as well.
                      Talking to some people is like folding a fitted sheet.

                      Comment


                      • Thank God War of Wills grew a 5th leg and then some.
                        HAS provides hospital care to 340,000 people in Haiti's Artibonite Valley 24/7/365/earthquake/cholera/whatever.
                        www.hashaiti.org blog:http://hashaiti.org/blog

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Big_Tag View Post
                          IAnd honestly, CH didn't run the winning race but he definitely outran his odds. I'm sure they would've been tickled with 2nd too.
                          All evidence to the contrary ...
                          Rack on!

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Sunflower View Post

                            Yes, but on what basis would a law suit be brought? i.e. what cause of action?
                            Well, if Country House's connections can whine about an incident that did not impede their horse... then Maximum Security's connections should object to a loud, obnoxious crowd (many of whom were likely inebriated) being allowed in the infield. Everyone knows young (and old) horses can spook. Therefore, it is logical to assume that the potential existed for the crowd to spook a horse. Therefore, it is a safety issue. Tracks claim they want safe racing. But greed drives them to sell tickets to the infield (along with beer sales, betting, etc.).

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by HorsesinHaiti View Post
                              Thank God War of Wills grew a 5th leg and then some.
                              He lived up to his name in that moment, fighting the possible fall.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Event Horse View Post
                                2019 Kentucky Derby: What Happens When Snowflakes Become Jockeys

                                I say this only half tongue in cheek because I deal with college students who will cry foul at ANYTHING (even invent things) to improve their grade.
                                Sorry but you missed the trees completely here. Bill Mott saw an opportunity to win a Kentucky Derby and he used his jockey to do it. He admitted his horse was not at all affected. He knew all he had to do was bring up the bogus objection the stewards would take a look at the other horses, and his horse would benefit greatly from the DQ. War of Will's trainer/jockey were going to let the outcome stand as evidenced by the fact they did not put up an objection. This was some seriously sleazy crap on the part of Mott. I cringed as I listen to him speaking while they were waiting for the results. He was as subtle as a tornado. His horse stood no chance, but he manipulated the rules to get it done.

                                If the race had been won by a nose, and the affected horse (WOW's) jockey had asked for the inquiry, I can see today's outcome being fair. Instead, a horse who had them all beat long after they all had recovered from the bobble was taken down for no good reason.
                                "Do what you can't do"

                                Comment


                                • This is bad for race on the perspective of keeping the public interested in the sport. Also people will cry fowl because of betting. How many bet on that horse only to lose that money? Say what you want about racing good or bad, but every first Saturday in May horses get coverage and that brings all horse industries more interest because people are aware of horses.
                                  I want to be like Barbie because that bitch has everything!

                                  Comment


                                  • Originally posted by Rackonteur View Post

                                    All evidence to the contrary ...
                                    If a steward's inquiry hadn't been called on what Maximum Security did to the #1 and #18, it would have been a disservice to racing rules. I do agree the objection filed by #20 was pretty cheap. But again, if the objection had stood, as opposed to the steward's inquiry, he would have only been placed 2nd, I believe?

                                    Comment


                                    • Originally posted by Big_Tag View Post
                                      I honestly believe CH's objection had less to do with it than the stewards inquiry. Isn't that supported by the fact that they completely DQ'ed him as opposed to placing him only behind the horse filing the objection? I thought I heard Bill Mott said in the post race he didn't think his horse was all that affected..

                                      It's clear Maximum Security was the best horse in the race, but that doesn't mean he can completely cut off the path of the horses behind him. It isn't about only affecting the outcome of the race, it's impeding the forward course of another horse, and if you can't see that he did that to War of Wills (and consequently the 18 horse), you're watching a different race.

                                      I feel awful for the connections bc I'm sure it wasn't intentional and MS was clearly the best, but you don't a free pass on that. Thank goodness WoW held his feet bc that would've been disastrous. And honestly, CH didn't run the winning race but he definitely outran his odds. I'm sure they would've been tickled with 2nd too.
                                      Very well said and what I have been trying to get at. It didn't end up as an accident but it easily could have and it would have been horrible had that happened. Its not about whether Country House was impeded or not, other horses WERE impeded and it could have been a horrible accident. MS was disqualified, he wasn't just moved to second, what he did was so dangerous, he was disqualified. Spook or not, its not ok and there should not be any free passes just because its the Kentucky Derby.

                                      Comment


                                      • Originally posted by AffirmedHope View Post

                                        Personally, I think they should just focus on blowing away the competition in the next two TC races and the BC later this season, make that their statement.
                                        Yep. Maximum Security was clearly the best horse out there today. Cheap win for second place horse who wasn't even affected by the bobble.

                                        Comment


                                        • I still don't understand on what basis a law suit would be brought. Against whom? For what? The stewards overseeing the race investigated an objection that was raised, under the rules that govern. Unfortunately, the media is failing to give a factual basis on the matter of why the ruling was made and what the rules are. There is just a lot of emotional sensationalism --but then sadly that is the state of a lot of media these days. I would like to understand the rules governing objections-- and what the stewards must see to make a DQ ruling.

                                          Just because the DQ'd horse could have had more money for its connections had it not bee DQ'd is not on its own any kind of reason for a law suit. There has to be a legal basis for the claim. Even in litigation happy America, claims have to have a legal basis- there must be a legal cause of action.

                                          And I have to say COTH dissapoints in part-- usually there are level headed and informative discussions here, but this whole thread seems to be degenerating into playground name calling against Country House and its connections, without much insight into what ruling was made and why.
                                          A canter is a cure for every evil. ~Benjamin Disraeli

                                          Comment

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