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I have this OTTB mare...opinions please

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  • I have this OTTB mare...opinions please

    I have this 8yr old OTTB mare that I bought here in WA state. She ran at age 4 only four times and didn't place, her owner had health problems so gave up on her and all her siblings, dam and other various family members and had a big sell out last year and I picked this mare up because she "looked nice".

    Can anyone please tell me what I really have in quality, no holds barred.


    Here is a link to her photo on my web site also plus a couple of videos if you want to see her move.


    Her dosage index is 6.20 and her dosage profile is 11 2 5 0 0 (what ever that means..total rookie here).

    IF, (Big IF), I were to breed her to a TB stallion who would be the best match for her? I was told that I should keep away from any Bold Ruler lines as she already has him both top and bottom so who out there in WA especially would be her best partner.

    Thanks for all your help on this, she is the sweetest, friendliest girl I have had the pleasure of owning for a long time.

    Last edited by welshrwonderful; Dec. 29, 2007, 07:59 PM. Reason: This mare ran at age 5, not age 4.
    Home of SMOKE TREE GOLD FEVER Welsh pony stallion and other animals

  • #2
    I suggest you find a stallion with a long neck, as hers is short in proportion to the rest of her body. I dont breed so i cannot offer stallion suggestion. But at first glance her neck needs at least 8"
    chaque pas est fait ensemble


    • #3
      I have seen quite a few babies selling across the country out of Gold Meridian mares and they're selling well. I'm a junkie for reading the sales results in the back of the bloodhorse and I always pick up on Gold Meridian since he was local.

      I have worked with quite a few Gold Meridian babies and I would suggest finding a stallion that is COMMERCIAL (In WA you need a commercial stallion to breed an unproven mare to if you are going to sell), will add bone mass to your mare and will add some length. It's hard to tell from the pictures, but most of the Gold Meridians I've been around were finer boned and shorter bodied.

      The market here in WA is about as bad as it's going to get without completely ceasing to exist so if you're going to get started know that we can't go anywhere but up.

      If you have some studs in mind you can PM me. We've bred to quite a few stallions in the area and I'd be glad to share my expereinces with you.


      • #4
        No advice but she is lovely with a great eye!


        • #5
          What would be your plans with the foal? To sell or to race or as a riding horse?

          Regardless, jennywho has good advice regarding breeding to a commercial stallion. No matter what your plans are, it's good to breed a foal that you could sell if you decide you want to. I am not at all familiar with WA stallions, so I'll leave recs to the experts, but I can tell you to look for a stallion high on the WA leading sire list (not just on the list, but high on the list) and ideally, one whose AEI exceeds the CI and whose sales averages exceed his stud fee. If there is a young stallion (first or second year at stud) that has a good race record and the farm who is standing him knows how to "make" a stallion, that wouldn't be bad, either. Because the mare did not prove herself as a racehorse, I would be hesitant to breed to an unproven, unraced/poorly raced stallion.

          Pedigreequery automatically offers up dosage info., but it's not a big deal and I don't know anyone who pays it much attention.

          I don't think another return to Bold Ruler would hurt anything if you liked everything else about the stallion.

          Good luck!


          • Original Poster

            Thanks very much all of you for your opinion, as for saying she has a short neck, well I must say I disagree with you on that; to me and to others who have seen her and have helped me train her she has a sufficient neck, maybe it was the angle of the photo, I added another picture to my site just in case that was what you thought you saw.

            I spent a lot of time on the internet trying to find out what the Dosage index and center of distribution stuff all means and found it fascinating, at least I know she is bred to be more a sprinter than a stayer. Did I get that right?

            So is the racing indistry depressed all across the country?
            Racing at age 5 is rather unusual isn't it? Could that be why she didn't do as well as she could?

            Thanks for the PM's and the responses here, greatly appreciated.
            Home of SMOKE TREE GOLD FEVER Welsh pony stallion and other animals


            • #7
              I think her neck looks short because of the way she's being ridden, in more of a dressage-type, upright frame. I think she's overall a well-balanced sort.

              I echo the question of what you're looking to produce out of this mare: a racehorse or a sporthorse? And if you are trying to produce a racehorse, is the goal to sell as a yearling or to race yourself?

              Either way, be prepared to spend lots of money!
              Life would be infinitely better if pinatas suddenly appeared throughout the day.


              • #8
                Originally posted by welshrwonderful View Post
                So is the racing indistry depressed all across the country?
                Nope. It's got problems in some places, but is on the rise in others.

                Racing at age 5 is rather unusual isn't it? Could that be why she didn't do as well as she could?
                Not racing until 5 is unusual, but racing at 5 isn't. Could be a bunch of reasons she didn't run until late. Most likely, she got hurt (probably more than once). It's possible she had some sort of nagging issue that kept her from running well. Or, it's possible nobody tried to run her until late for some reason.


                • Original Poster

                  *commercial* TB stallion in WA??

                  Hello and Happy New Year everyone

                  Actually I have no plans for "her foal" as I really have no plans at this time to even want to breed her. I was just curious about her pedigree and DI, no one seems to have anything to say to me about that yet.

                  Someone did PM me and said she had a STOUT MARE LINE with Foolish Pleasure and Decidedly back there.

                  I love TB's and racing was an idea that I thought I might try one time, but it's not a game I would take lightly either, I want to get the best foal I can from her IF she is quality herself. To own her and to ride her she is quality (to me) but thats not enough to breed a race horse, I need to know LOTS more.

                  Jennywho....question for you, who is considered COMMERCIAL up here? Thanks for info on Gold Meridian, I heard he died a couple of years back and I can't find any pictures of him anywhere.

                  Sleepyfox.....Her owner had health problems and was also overloaded with too many horses so this mare got put on the back burner until later in her life, this is what he (owner) told me but who knows what truly went on.

                  Home of SMOKE TREE GOLD FEVER Welsh pony stallion and other animals


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by welshrwonderful View Post
                    I love TB's and racing was an idea that I thought I might try one time, but it's not a game I would take lightly either, I want to get the best foal I can from her IF she is quality herself. To own her and to ride her she is quality (to me) but thats not enough to breed a race horse, I need to know LOTS more.

                    Sleepyfox.....Her owner had health problems and was also overloaded with too many horses so this mare got put on the back burner until later in her life, this is what he (owner) told me but who knows what truly went on.
                    Well, if you're asking if she's nice enough to try to breed a racehorse from her, I'd say she's a decent prospect for a regional market. What I mean by that is that I think she could produce runners for you, or to sell privately and if mated to the right stallion you could do okay with her foals at a regional sale. As you know, she's not the best mare out there, but if you like her and can afford to breed her and do right by the foal, I don't see anything wrong with breeding her. Her half sister Ibura has been a good producer (no blacktype, but several good, solid runners - the kind any breeder would be happy to produce) and her dam is a 1/2 to a multi GRI winner in Mexico. Ibura's best foal ($135k in earnings) is by Cherokee Run, so that might give you some ideas for potential stallion pedigrees.

                    If you are serious about breeding her, run a catalog style pedigree report on her through Equineline or Brisnet so you can really see what all is the family.

                    Also, you may want to run a detailed past performance report to learn more about her race record.

                    As far as what the previous owner told you, yeah, you see that a lot. It's a lot easier to breed them than it is to get them to the track. At least he got her there eventually.


                    • #11
                      Just wanted to say that I have been around two Gold Meridian sisters (Wilmaglen and Miss Fiona) both of whom won in the PNW and both of whom are great mares. Wilma is still racing and Fiona is an eventer and jumper.

                      Good luck with your mare.


                      • Original Poster

                        Crimson Satan - Delineator - Storm Cat lines.

                        I have an account with equineline so will run a report like suggested. I do remember that when Mr Crawford (previous owner) had all his stock up for sale last year (Nov 2007) two of his stock that were also by Gold Meridian had already sold very quickly for sport horse careers, one was a chestnut gelding, forget his name...Righty Tighty or something??

                        Thanks for telling me about that costco-muffins, it makes me feel good to hear reports back like that.

                        NOW who would be considered a COMMERCIAL stallion in this area? Delineator? He is related to my mare through Crimson Satan who is on my mares dam side. Anyone know anything about him??? Strom Cat was only 15.2hh going by the allbreedpedigree site, is that accurate??

                        Thanks again
                        Home of SMOKE TREE GOLD FEVER Welsh pony stallion and other animals


                        • #13
                          Delineators sell okay but they can be HOT. If you breed to him, handle the foal as much as possible.

                          Keep in mind that if you're breeding the horse to race it yourself, you don't need to go so "commercial." The WA industry is VERY political - lots of stallions get a lot more mares than they should, and others don't get enough.

                          Having said that, commercial stallions in WA include Tribunal, You and I, He's Tops. Many of the old standbys have passed away or been pensioned, which leaves the door open for many new stallions. Newer WA stallions I see with good commercial potential include Matty G, Polish Miner, and Makors Mark. Stolen Gold is also one to seriously consider - he hasn't bred many mares in the last few years but is the only WA stallion in recent times to sire a Grade 1 winner. I had a lovely Stolen Gold mare.

                          The Washington Thoroughbred stallion register includes all the WA and OR big names, plus a few in neighboring states. You can buy the print edition from the WTBA (about $10) or view it online here - http://www.washingtonthoroughbred.co...ter/ByFarm.htm
                          It's a uterus, not a clown car. - Sayyedati


                          • #14
                            You might make more money training her for show (or whatever she has a knack for) and selling her as an ammy horse than selling her in foal. She looks like a nice prospect but selling her in foal knocks out a large % of people who are looking for a broke riding horse. TB mares in foal in that area aren't bringing large amounts of money. My advice would be only breed her if YOU want the foal (to race, show, whatever), otherwise put training on her and sell her as a riding horse or to a trainer who can take her higher than you could (or would want to put the money in).
                            Every mighty oak was once a nut that stood its ground.

                            Proud Closet Canterer! Member Riders with Fibromyalgia clique.


                            • #15
                              Interesting outcross

                              I'm no expert, but she does appear to be a nice outcross for Northern Dancer and Mr. Prospector. And I love the fact that she's got Decidedly so close up. Interesting pedigree, for sure.
                              Don't wrassle with a hog. You just get dirty, and the hog likes it.

                              Collecting Thoroughbreds - tales of a re-rider and some TBs


                              • #16
                                I would have to agree with Slewdledo on her list of "commercial" stallions while maybe adding Cahill Road (make sure you've got a mare with excellent knees) and noting that Tribunal is most likely out for the season.

                                When I said commercial I was thinking of breeding to sell. I think that my decision on who to breed to would differ if I was breeding to race rather than to sell.