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Training puppies to be around horses?

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  • Training puppies to be around horses?

    So, my husband and I have started looking for our first dog. We're looking at Australian Shepherds, as it's a gorgeous, sweet, and smart breed that we can both agree on.

    As I'm looking at these Shepherds though, I'm wondering how I can get it used to being around horses. Won't Shepherds try to herd horses? A border collie tried herding my horse and his pasture mate about 5 years ago, nipping at his heels, and my horse kicked it in the head. I don't want this to happen with my dog.

    My horse is fine with dogs as long as they are not trying to bite him.

    Any suggestions on how to train a good barn puppy? Thanks!

  • #2
    I have a border collie that learned to not chase the horses without getting kicked. I taught him a very strong leave it before he was ever loose around the horses. He also learned out (like get out of the paddock or arena), and down (like if we were on a trail ride and I want him to wait for whatever reason). During this learning time, I brought him to the barn on leash with a harness. I brought him a bed, and tied him to a stall (I thought later a small screw eye with a trailer tie would have been easy to install and making tying securely easier) in the aisle and would say place when I tied him up there. When horses were secure, I'd go about my chores with him attached to my belt, although when I went in the paddock or arena I tied him to the fence (he was NEVER allowed in the paddock or arena, but that's just my rule). When I did finally bring him to the barn off leash, I played with him with his ball for a while before, to get the puppy crazies out! He is now a lovely farm dog that "helps" with chores but stays out of the way!

    Good Luck with your new addition, the herding breeds can be the joy of your life or the bane of your existence, all depends on what you teach them! I think my next dog will be an Australian Shepherd or another border collie. LOVE them!
    When the student is ready, the teacher will appear.

    Comment


    • #3
      Aussies and BC's have a high drive to "herd"...they need a lot of exercise and the happiest ones I know have "jobs". Even if they aren't REAL jobs, they have a multitude of tricks and commands and are happiest when they perceive that they are working.

      As far as training them to be around horses, I think there are 3 things all dogs who will be around horses need to have an EXCELLENT handle on:

      -recall
      -sit stay
      -leave it

      If you have those three things covered solidly, then your dog can be a good citizen in many situations.

      Personally, my dog is a lab. He grew up around the horses. My rule was that he could not be in the pasture unless I was mounted. He would sit stay outside the pasture fence until I called him.

      He knows to heel and can go on trail rides w/ me.

      He also has learned to read the horses. Some are dog friendly, some are not. The mare that I just rehomed was NOT a dog lover. She would bite, kick, etc. He learned to keep a close eye on her.

      My other mare? If we're trail riding and the bugs are bad, he'll plant his head by her tail to take advantage of the extra pest control. LOL

      Good luck!
      A good horseman doesn't have to tell anyone...the horse already knows.

      Might be a reason, never an excuse...

      Comment


      • #4
        I have an Aussie. I found him when he was 5 weeks old, he is 13 now.
        He showed a lot of interest in the horses when he was little. Aussies are very smart, and we just communicated to him that the horses were not to be messed with. He got it very quickly, and I never had a problem with him to this day.
        When he got older,(I think he was 6 or 7) I taught him that if the horses were out in the farthest field and I said "Ozzie, bring 'em in" he would go out, circle them up (no nipping or barking) and they would come in. The horses don't mind, and they just all trundle in, no mad dash.
        As I said, Aussies are very smart, and therefore easily bored. Bored dogs get in trouble.
        The key with Aussies is they need a job. It doesn't matter what the job is. Ozzie's main job is keeping an eye on me and chasing a tennis ball. So that keeps him from chasing the horses. Some Aussies are more hard headed than others, you may need to invest in a shock colllar, but in the beginning take him around the horses on a leash and if he gets too interested or too aggressive with the horses, tell him differently.

        All of that said, my Ozzie is the best dog ever and I know his days are numbered. He's almost deaf and has cataracts and is pretty stiff some days, but he still wants to play and chase his ball, and ride in the truck. The day he goes they might as well bury me with him. As much as I love him, I don't think I will get another Aussie. It would have too much to live up to.
        Get the Aussie, you won't be sorry.
        "Perhaps the final test of anybody's love of dogs is their willingness to permit them to make a camping ground of the bed" -Henry T. Merwin

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        • #5
          You've already stated that you're looking into a specific breed, so I don't know how helpful this will be, but I had a Rottweiler for six years (lost him to bone cancer, sadly) who was an excellent horse/trail dog.

          Part of that came from just getting him used to being around horses, which was accomplished by lots of on-leash time at the barn. I also did formal obedience classes with him, which translated very well to his barn time. Having a solid "leave it" and "drop it" command was useful when he found something he wasn't supposed to have!

          Occasionally, when working my horse in the arena, I'd bring Sebastian with me and actually do "heel" work while I rode. . .sits, downs, stays, recalls (with a "down" command even as he was running toward me). I also took him trail riding, and he would cross rivers, jump logs, and basically go wherever I did. Never left my horse's side to chase wildlife, never went near the other horses in the group.

          Once on a trail ride, the training was put to practical use when I saw a loose dog heading for us from across a field. I put Sebastian in a down-stay in some bushes, and cantered straight for the approaching dog, yelling "get outta here! Go home!" The dog, of course, wasn't expecting that reaction and quickly turned-tail and ran home. When he was gone, I went back and collected Sebastian (who was still lying there patiently), and we continued on our way.

          A lot of people have dogs that they bring to the barn, but it does take committment to have a good, reliable horse dog.

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_fzstrQWHE
          Please copy and paste this to your signature if you know someone, or have been affected by someone who needs a smack upside the head. Lets raise awareness.

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          • Original Poster

            #6
            Originally posted by BuddyRoo View Post
            Aussies and BC's have a high drive to "herd"...they need a lot of exercise and the happiest ones I know have "jobs". Even if they aren't REAL jobs, they have a multitude of tricks and commands and are happiest when they perceive that they are working.
            A couple of you mentioned Aussies need jobs. I'm planning on doing agility training with the dog (already bought a starter kit). Do you think that is enough of a job to keep him not bored?

            Comment


            • #7
              It doesn't matter what the job is, or how complicated it is, as long as HE thinks it's his mission in life. Point is you just can't expect an Aussie to just lie around all day while you're playing with your horse. He will find some mischief to get into (digging holes, collecting things like gloves, half chaps, brushes, etc and bringing them to you, or any sort of things) because they are very smart.
              Watching me and getting his ball are Ozzie's job. He will wear you out with that damn ball.
              You may find "get somewhere" to be a useful command. Ozzie would sometimes get underfoot while I was tacking up or feeding or otherwise unable to entertain him, but would go lie down if I told him to "get somewhere"

              I used to take his ball and if i was longeing my horse I would throw the ball the other way for him. This ended up being good for the horse too because I foxhunt and she got really used to the dog being underfoot, running around and not bothering her.
              I never did much with my Aussie. He knows the basics of being a good dog, come, sit, lie down, get your ball, leave it, etc etc etc. But we didn't do anything serious. Most of what I taught him was just sort of as it came up during life. Now that he's getting on in years I've had to teach him some sign language, and he's caught on very quickly.
              Agility would probably be good, training is always good for dogs, esp dogs around barns.
              "Perhaps the final test of anybody's love of dogs is their willingness to permit them to make a camping ground of the bed" -Henry T. Merwin

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by GoodAsGold View Post
                A couple of you mentioned Aussies need jobs. I'm planning on doing agility training with the dog (already bought a starter kit). Do you think that is enough of a job to keep him not bored?

                How much time have you spent around the breed?

                I personally am not a huge fan because I don't find them to be the best family/social dogs. I think they're nice and all, but I don't like their single minded focus on a "job" nor their crouch and wait thing. I've known several who were pretty bad fear biters but I don't know their breeding and it may have been due to that or lack of socialization.

                My dog goes all over with me, to work, etc and I need a dog who is a little more easy going than most of the herding breeds.

                But my mom has an Aussie and I have quite a bit of experience with them both in working at the clinic and due to friends.

                Anyway...my point is...go spend some serious time with them. I would honestly say that these herding breeds, more than nearly any other breed, need lots and lots of mental stimulation. Exercise, yes of course. But even more so, mental stimulation. I'm talking daily...not once a day on the weekend.

                If you're ready to spend 30-60 min per day working on agility stuff and the dog is getting another 2 hours of exercise at least per day, then I think it would work.

                I do not think these are good "stay at home while we work and then behave when we're home" dogs.

                They're smart. And if you don't give them something to use their brain power for, they'll find something else. And often times, it's destructive. That's true for many breeds really....but I think a lot of people get a dog and expect it to be a cat. Dogs need the social interaction. NEED it.

                A good dog is a tired dog. LOL

                The agility stuff is great! I think that's a wonderful plan. But I really would encourage you to spend some time with a local breed rescue, a breeder or a group that does the agility and see what you're looking at. These dogs need a job. They are so much happier when they have that.
                A good horseman doesn't have to tell anyone...the horse already knows.

                Might be a reason, never an excuse...

                Comment


                • #9
                  We've had three aussies and they've all been great dogs. None of them have had a 'job' per say. Their job has just been to be nice family dogs! We have a yard that's pretty big, so they have room to play. A couple times a week we get them out for more intense exercise (a long walk, some chuck-it time, etc) but they've always been really good- even without regular/intense exercise.

                  None of ours have tried to herd the horses. The current aussie will try and herd any wild birds that are in the yard, and he closely supervises the chickens but never really bothers them.

                  We have several friends with aussies that are pretty similar to the ones we've had. Maybe it depends some on their breeding how high stung they are?
                  Cascadia- OTTB mare. 04/04-05/10
                  If love could have saved you, you would have lived forever

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I have 2 Aussies and I keep them leashed around the barn. Both have a very high herding instinct. I just don't want to take any chances, even with the training they've had - I'm afraid instinct will trump training in the end...
                    She wasn't running away with me, I just couldn't stop her!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      We have two Aussie/Catahoula crosses from the same litter. They are the smartest, most athletic dogs I've ever come across. I am glad they have each other to chase and wrestle with. If they are not sleeping they have to be kept busy or they find their own entertainment. Cats and birds ( and anything else that moves) are among their favorite targets. They are outstanding at obeying the rules ........ when you're watching them.

                      Buffyblue wrote:

                      "I have 2 Aussies and I keep them leashed around the barn. Both have a very high herding instinct. I just don't want to take any chances, even with the training they've had - I'm afraid instinct will trump training in the end..."

                      I couldn't agree more.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        The other thing to talk to your breeder about is not wanting a hard eyed puppy. Let them know you are looking for something with a low herding drive (plus, if you find a working breeder you can probably get one of these puppies cheaper). The best dog I ever met was working bred but the breeder sold to a non-working home (brothers and sisters in the litter were sent to England to herd cattle) and she was the BEST family and farm dog. Smart but not overly ambitious!

                        Agility is a great outlet for the herding breeds (they usually win their size class in competition) as it is thinking and running. Flyball is good too. I often thought of "eventing" with my guy, training him to do dressage, cross country jumping and stadium jumping. Just for fun!

                        But I agree that it is VERY important to start socializing him/her immediately! The herding breeds can be shy outside of their family, so it's important that they view the world at large as ok.
                        When the student is ready, the teacher will appear.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          What Buffyblue said and I think it goes for all dogs!

                          I'm an animal lover--bar none--but after a couple bad incidents at barns with two different dogs (which resulted in physical injuries) I have to say that there is no way, no how I would allow a dog to run, free will inside or outside a barn where there are people and horses working.

                          It's much easier to prevent an "accident" than it is to try and pick up the pieces after an unfortunate incident has occurred!
                          "Don't blame Hogg or the other teens. The adults are supposed to know better. If only we could find any." ~Tom Nichols, professor of national security affairs at the Naval War College~

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