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Need Legal Advice on Sale of my Horse

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  • #21
    OP - while it may not be obvious to you, I AM concerned for you and I would like you to get the legal advice you need rather than taking your legal advice from a BB. I encourage you to check out the martindale website I linked. You can enter your location and find lawyers that may be helpful to you. You are probably looking for a general litigation attorney with a smaller-sized practice. As someone else mentioned, some firms will do a telephone consultation and then pursue the action further if they think you have a case.

    I certainly don't think I'm too important to help. If I thought that, I never would have posted to begin with. I think I CAN'T help, and neither can any of you, other than telling the OP to contact an attorney in her state.

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    • #22
      Originally posted by trubandloki View Post
      So all you lawyers that are willing to post long post about why you can not help are not able to suggest 'look for a lawyer that specializes in .....' or 'here is a great place to find a good lawyer in your state'?
      well since I do not know what state she is in, that would be difficult.
      I am not aware of any online referral sites that are any more than a pay to be on the list type of service and so there is no basis for assessing if they are any good (and therefore I know of no sites to recommend for her). Heck do a google search if you just want a name without any input on whether they are any good. Your best bet in finding an attorney to is ask locally who has a good reputation or who someone has used that they are pleased with.
      I know I am not going to change your mind about my posts, their intent and my general uselessness to you but I thought I would try
      There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man.(Churchill)

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      • #23
        Originally posted by trubandloki View Post
        So all you lawyers that are willing to post long post about why you can not help are not able to suggest 'look for a lawyer that specializes in .....' or 'here is a great place to find a good lawyer in your state'?
        yes--that's what I was trying to say!

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        • #24
          It sounds like the OP has not begun divorce proceedings. She states only that she is out of the house and safe. So perhaps a divorce lawyer can clarify what is community property and what is not. IMHO that's what you need!
          2012 goal: learn to ride like a Barn Rat

          A helmet saved my life.

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          • #25
            Originally posted by trubandloki View Post
            So all you lawyers that are willing to post long post about why you can not help are not able to suggest 'look for a lawyer that specializes in .....' or 'here is a great place to find a good lawyer in your state'?
            FineAlready gave a great place: www.martindale.com

            It has listings of lawyers by state and specialty, and even ranks some of them.

            Honestly, OP came here asking for "legal advice," not "where can I find a lawyer?" so if she's serious, eventually she's going to have to put her money where her mouth is (so to speak) and consult a lawyer. No amount of internet advice will avoid that necessity. As FA posted before, many(most?) lawyers do free initial consultations. I very much second TheHorseProblem's suggestion to consult a divorce lawyer regarding marital property.
            The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's ears. ~ Arabian Proverb

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            • #26
              I posted the link to martindale in my very first post. Apparently, that was lost on all of you. The OP can locate an attorney there. As bambam said, I can't speak to the quality of the lawyers there, but martindale does have a rating system (AV is the best, I believe).

              If someone wanted to find out a poster's identity, there are ways to do that, I am sure. Moreover, fear of lawsuit is not the only reason for lawyers to not provide legal advice online. Violation of ethical rules and complete inability to provide sufficient legal advice online given the limited facts also come to mind.

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              • #27
                Apparently there's some kind of forum for free legal advice here: http://forum.freeadvice.com/ if the OP is interested.

                Can't get into it so I have no idea what it is, but it exists.
                The wind of heaven is that which blows between a horse's ears. ~ Arabian Proverb

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                • #28
                  Originally posted by piccolittle View Post
                  Needed a ")" in there...

                  And reading that, with what little I know of tort as opposed to criminal law, OP, you MUST get a lawyer who knows your state's law if you want to pursue it. Even if they wanted to give free legal advice on the internet, this is a tort called conversion, and it's not a simple question. They can't, without knowing your state's laws and a LOT more detail than you really should provide on the internet. You would need to know about marital/community property laws in your state as well--as he was your husband he may have had every legal right to sell your horse while you were married, if you are a community property state. Statute of limitations will vary by state. There are just too many variables for anyone to give advice here, or for anyone to compare their story as it might be totally different where they live.
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                  • #29
                    Originally posted by SuperSTB View Post
                    the tone is a little bitter... maybe you didn't intend it but that's how it came across to me.

                    I agree with contacting a laywer too but sometimes when someone poses a question on a bb it's not so much about hawking free legal services but rather looking for support or if someone has a similiar situation that are willing to share their experiences.

                    I feel for OP and don't have much to share in the way of experiences or legal knowledge but I wish her the best.
                    It's not about the OP getting "free" legal service. It's about the OP getting accurate legal service.

                    No lawyer who wants to keep her license is going to give out legal advice over an Internet message board. Believe it or not, the lawyers posting here want the OP to get the RIGHT legal advice from someone familiar with this area of law in her state -- and from someone who will be able to help her move forward.

                    It's not about being insensitive or bitter about people looking for free legal advice. For us, it actually IS a matter of ethics. (Cue bad lawyer jokes and/or bitter people. )

                    OP - look for a good contracts lawyer. Only an experienced lawyer licensed in your state can really help you here. I would encourage you to find someone. An initial consultation with most lawyers is free, so you should be able to get a preliminary idea if there is something you can do before having to commit to anything or pay any fees.

                    Good luck. I really am so sorry you are going through this. I hope you are able to get the help you need. If you don't know where to start looking for a lawyer near you, contact your local bar association (state or county). They should have a lawyer referral service that can point you in the right direction.


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                    • #30
                      Originally posted by NovasMom View Post
                      Late September 09, in the midst of a long term illness, my husband sold my ISH without my knowledge. At the time I was too ill to do anything and also in a marriage with an abusive man. I am now out of the house and safe and want to know what legal recourse, if any, I have to get my beloved horse back! I know where he is and who he has been sold too, he is safe, loved and well cared for, but I miss him desperately and now that my health is on an upswing, I want him back in my life. Any legal help or advice would be greatly appreciated! I would be eternally grateful!

                      P.S. I cannot call the current owner, it seems as though her and my husband worked together to have this occur behind my back.
                      You need to talk to a lawyer in the state where you live.

                      G.
                      Mangalarga Marchador: Uma Raça, Uma Paixão

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                      • #31
                        Originally posted by NovasMom View Post
                        Late September 09, in the midst of a long term illness, my husband sold my ISH without my knowledge. At the time I was too ill to do anything and also in a marriage with an abusive man. I am now out of the house and safe and want to know what legal recourse, if any, I have to get my beloved horse back! I know where he is and who he has been sold too, he is safe, loved and well cared for, but I miss him desperately and now that my health is on an upswing, I want him back in my life. Any legal help or advice would be greatly appreciated! I would be eternally grateful!

                        P.S. I cannot call the current owner, it seems as though her and my husband worked together to have this occur behind my back.
                        You don't have to answer these questions but really, you haven't given enough detail to know what really went on. These are just things to think about:

                        Did you buy the horse before or during the marriage? If during, then...I think you are completely out of luck -short of throwing money at the new owners.

                        Were you so sick that you couldn't care for the horse? Was your husband (still married -as you didn't write ex) taking care of the bills, etc? If yes, then -again...I think you are completely out of luck -short of throwing money at the new owners.

                        As you are STILL married, if your statements above are correct, I really don't think you are going to succeed in getting him back, short of buying him. If your husband was your ex at the time, that would be different. But he is your husband still -yes? certainly during this time period, and you were so sick that you were unable to either care for the horse or were so out of it, that you were unaware of what was happening. That is pretty darn sick...

                        Honestly, your husband may very well have thought he was doing the right thing. I don't think any court of law (no matter how hurt you are) is going to do squat as you were/ are still married and were very, very ill. If what you have written is as you have written it, and you are still married...no court of law is going to get your horse back for you.

                        Write a letter to the couple, explain the situation, ask for them to contact you if they ever want to sell and move on.

                        I am sorry for your losing your "heart horse," I know how painful that can be.
                        Luistano Stallion standing for 2013: Wolverine UVF
                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IZPHDzgX3s

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                        • #32
                          I think your first stop should be a family court lawyer. And not just because I are one. If you're still married to this man, you need to get some property issues straightened out. That will help you know where you stand on this issue, and may prevent some future disasters.

                          Many family lawyers do free initial consultations. Ask your friends who've gotten divorced for referrals, or google your state bar association. Since marital property laws vary greatly from state to state, you really need to talk to someone local.
                          I'm not ignoring the rules. I'm interpreting the rules. Tamal, The Great British Baking Show

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                          • #33
                            Shakespeare was right.
                            www.headsupspecialriders.com

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                            • #34
                              I have been in a similar situation. As I was hosptialized and in intensive care...my husband (estranged) and others very close to me and my farm shipped my mares out of state. I never saw them again. I was never paid for the imported 2X DAD winner,Ster mare and the mare I bred by Silver medalist Starman out of a Lucky Boy mare. Everyone but the "buyers" knew me personally. I never knew where the mares had gone..it was agonizing. A foal born to my own mare was registered as they claimed the mare had been leased! In the end after months/years of legal proceedings and a divorce....(PA is a Commonwealth State) I was forced to sign over the papers to my own beloved mares.

                              They went to Michigan. I was heart sick they were gone. My own site was used to check out the horses! It was one of the worst betrayals I have known.


                              Maybe a writ of replevin? Never sure how that worked. it was a tterm thrown around in my case.

                              You can "lawyer up" but in the end in my expereince...the parties with the horse and their bottom line will determine the outcome.

                              Good Luck.
                              Tradition of "Grande" Sporthorse Champions
                              GRANDE SOVEREIGN 2014 USEF 8th Leading HB Sire
                              & Sire of OWN IT - USEF National HB 3yo Champion

                              Grand Affiar, Grande Desire, GR Impression, Couture du Jour

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                              • #35
                                Originally posted by trubandloki View Post
                                So all you lawyers that are willing to post long post about why you can not help are not able to suggest 'look for a lawyer that specializes in .....' or 'here is a great place to find a good lawyer in your state'?
                                Yes, we are -- and I did.

                                Giving a recommendation for an attorney or recommending that someone consult a specific type of attorney to see if they even have a colorable claim doesn't constitute legal advice.


                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  Originally posted by pAin't_Misbehavin' View Post
                                  I think your first stop should be a family court lawyer. And not just because I are one. If you're still married to this man, you need to get some property issues straightened out. That will help you know where you stand on this issue, and may prevent some future disasters.

                                  Many family lawyers do free initial consultations. Ask your friends who've gotten divorced for referrals, or google your state bar association. Since marital property laws vary greatly from state to state, you really need to talk to someone local.
                                  Also a good idea. Matrimonial / family laws vary quite a bit from state to state, moreso than most others.


                                  Comment


                                  • #37
                                    Again, thank you all, by no means did I ever mean to create a "disturbance" and maybe I should rephrase what I was looking for. If anyone know about professional licenses, it is me as a Nurse, so I would never want anyone to jeapordize theirs, no matter the profession.
                                    I am very aware of the fact that I need an attorney for this matter if it is something that I can do, and I do have access to them. I guess what I was looking for was more of peoples "opinions" on whether they thought this was "doable" for me, and yes, If I may have a leg to stand on!
                                    This horse was purchased for me, by HIM, in lieu of a diamond engagement ring (who needs rings like that when you around horses all day anyway!!) and obviously prior to the wedding. I was working until 6 months prior to the sale when I started getting sick. I was not so sick that I wasn't aware, but I could not take care of my horses at that time, so I put them at a barn close by, and found a wonderful, talented shareboarder for this one to help pay the expenses and take care of him. This is the women who purchased him without even a phone call to me. Yes, my husband was paying the bills at that time, even though the bills were in my name. We are in NY, and equitable distribution state. As of now, he will not even provide me with a copy of the bill of sale. Our legal separation papers are in the hands of the mediator right now and won't be ready for a few weeks, but I don't intend to sign them until I know what is possible with this case. He stated after the sale that he did it to punish me for a million ridiculous accusations he had against me (probably to ease his own guilty conscience) We had agreed in counseling three weeks prior to the sale that he would pay for them through October and then re-evaluate where my health was. He sold the horse in September, the morning after a night of fighting with me.

                                    So.....do any of you guys have any suggestions (other than walking away), does anyone think I can get him back, has anyone ever heard or dealt with a situation like this??
                                    I really really do appreciate your help and support. It has been encouraging even to read what has been posted thus far. I thank you all a million times over.

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      I agree with the poster who suggested considering moving on. I can't imagine how betrayed you must feel over what happened--to have someone do that to you when you were vulnerable is horrible. I'm sure that getting the horse back would be great, but at what cost? I'm no lawyer, and I don't know anything about the merits of a case like this, but I do know that every legal battle I've seen friends and family have has been incredibly emotionally and financially draining. By all means consult a lawyer and consider your options, maybe they will say that you have a great case and it won't cost too much. But think carefully before getting sucked into sacrificing months of your life as well as your sanity dealing with this. You finally got away from this abusive person, do you really want to possibly spend more time fighting with him? There ARE other horses. And maybe there is another special horse out there who is meant to be part of your life.

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                                      • #39
                                        I do not disagree with all of you who say to "walk away", I will, if it becomes too much of a financial burden. I will walk away and give a home to a horse who desperately needs one, absolutely! But if I am able to get my boy back I sure as sh#* am gonna do so!

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                                        • #40
                                          My advice is, like everyone else's, consult a lawyer. Since your STB ex purchased the horse, I am afraid that you may not have a leg to stand on. A lawyer can tell you that definitively, however.

                                          If it turns out that you do not have legal recourse to get this horse back, I would send the buyer a very gently worded letter. Without going into too much detail, let her know that you were seriously ill, that you never okayed the horse being sold, and that you are absolutely devastated. DO NOT BLAME HER FOR ANYTHING. Treat her like she did nothing wrong, and don't get too far into blaming your ex. Let her know that if there is any chance she wants to sell the horse, now or in the future, that you would be more than willing to buy him. Even though you know she did a really s***ty thing to you, appeal to her humanity. She may have been told awful things about you and never change her mind, but she may also realize that you're a person who had her beloved horse taken away. Maybe she'll feel sorry enough that she'll let you visit your boy. Or, she may not respond immediately but eventually might fall on hard times and give you the horse. You never know. But you've stated that the horse is in a secure and loving home. The only thing you can do is plant a seed in the buyers' head and pray he comes home to you. (DO NOT DO THIS UNTIL A LAWYER TELLS YOU TO GIVE UP. ANY communication about this horse, even theoretically on this board, could jeopardize your case. Be careful.)

                                          Good luck, and as always, let us know what happens. I am interested to know how this story shakes out legally.

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