Horse Slaughterhouse Bill in TN

[Tamara in TN]

Deserves to be re-stated.

None of the quotes from the representative seem like he means to do anything but look at more humane ways and enforcements concerning horse slaughter.
NJR

he is a horseman and a farmer and he really does care about the animals....

Tamara in TN

[War Admiral]

Some points:

1) Let's not forget that the last foreign slaughterhouse to do business on US soil, Dallas Crown, only paid $5 in US income tax in 1994. This isn't going to help the tax revenue situation in Tenn. by much more than that.

2) In fact, if the idea behind this is to fill the state coffers, we'd be FAR better off taking AWAY the ag exemption for large scale horse breeders. Oh, wait... God forbid the rest of us shouldn't subsidize that...

3) NOBODY else besides me is concerned that the level of horse theft is going to be increased by this? We already have a HUGE horse theft problem in Tennessee; if you put a slaughterhouse up nearby and make it THAT much easier for people to steal horses and get some coin out of it, how much more do you think that's going to increase?

4) Does anyone seriously think any foreign corporation coming into the USA to slaughter horses is going to be any more humane than the last bunch were? We've already seen how they flagrantly disregard the law.

5) You can only kill a horse once. The amount that LIVING horses bring into the TN economy by far surpasses the economic value of killing them.

Deadline is April 7 to contact the TN House Budget Subcommittee. Thanks.

[Alagirl]

Some points:

1) Let's not forget that the last foreign slaughterhouse to do business on US soil, Dallas Crown, only paid $5 in US income tax in 1994. This isn't going to help the tax revenue situation in Tenn. by much more than that.

They used every legal loophole accessable to them, like any other business. It is a business....

2) In fact, if the idea behind this is to fill the state coffers, we'd be FAR better off taking AWAY the ag exemption for large scale horse breeders. Oh, wait... God forbid the rest of us shouldn't subsidize that...

subsidizing agriculture goes a lot further than one slaughter plant. You want open spaces in the future, or Mc Mansions?

3) NOBODY else besides me is concerned that the level of horse theft is going to be increased by this? We already have a HUGE horse theft problem in Tennessee; if you put a slaughterhouse up nearby and make it THAT much easier for people to steal horses and get some coin out of it, how much more do you think that's going to increase?

I loff you, but you are not that special.
That argument does not wash on many levels, and for any one stolen horse there are plenty more that stay in one place, some more some less happy. Like drinking, driving, gun owning, shopping...abuse happens, so we rewrite the whole thing?

BTW, if you have a plant near by, you are also quick to check or make a personal appearance should Dobbins go missing, beats trying to figure out what truck he's on and if he's headed north or south...

4) Does anyone seriously think any foreign corporation coming into the USA to slaughter horses is going to be any more humane than the last bunch were? We've already seen how they flagrantly disregard the law.

who is 'they'? when 'they' enter the stage, it's usually a sign that 'they' ran out of arguments. You think US companies on foreign soil behaved better? Only if government is keeping a close eye on them, but that holds true for all industry.

5) You can only kill a horse once. The amount that LIVING horses bring into the TN economy by far surpasses the economic value of killing them.

but you can beat a dead horse for years and years, pardon my pun.

You over estimate the economic value of a soso horse kept by a soso owner.
Falls under the false assumtion that every horse is fed bute every day and over supplemented. Let's not forget all those unwashed masses who ride without helmet and don't trim feet.
Not to mention, some horses (like some people, cynical, I know) are worth more dead than alive.

Deadline is April 7 to contact the TN House Budget Subcommittee. Thanks.

As non TN resident, what exactly is that to achieve?

[Nojacketrequired]

Kep in mind also that the EU ruling will affect the Horse Slaughter plants inthe US , just as it will in Canada.

6 months feed lotting or a paper trail of the last 6 months of health history/meds.

The auctions are NOT going to take any pig-in-a-poke with a questionable Health Cert and tell his Kill Buyers to bid on it for meat. The Auction Buyer is going to be VERY CAREFUL whose word he takes for Health Certs, and those are the only horses that the Kill Buyers are going to get the "signal" to bid on for horses to go to slaughter right away.

I don't think that stolen horses are going to be much of a marketable item once the EU begins enforcing it's new rulings, come July. Believe me, they are going to be checking carcasses, whihc will all be traceable to the source, and NO auctioneer that deals with kill buyers is going to want to be caught selling a kill destined horse with a questionable health cert.

NJR

[Guilherme]

Some points:

1) Let's not forget that the last foreign slaughterhouse to do business on US soil, Dallas Crown, only paid $5 in US income tax in 1994. This isn't going to help the tax revenue situation in Tenn. by much more than that.

Income tax is not the only tax paid by a business. The Alphabet Soup gets little bites of the apple from beginning to end.

2) In fact, if the idea behind this is to fill the state coffers, we'd be FAR better off taking AWAY the ag exemption for large scale horse breeders. Oh, wait... God forbid the rest of us shouldn't subsidize that...

What ag exemption for "large scale horse breeders" would that be?

3) NOBODY else besides me is concerned that the level of horse theft is going to be increased by this? We already have a HUGE horse theft problem in Tennessee; if you put a slaughterhouse up nearby and make it THAT much easier for people to steal horses and get some coin out of it, how much more do you think that's going to increase?

Do we now? Have a "large scale horse theft problem in TN?" I've worked part time in a local DA's office since 1994 and have not seen ONE horse (or cattle) theft case.

On the other hand on Monday I saw three shoplifting cases from Family Dollar. Maybe we should close up that den of iniquity.

4) Does anyone seriously think any foreign corporation coming into the USA to slaughter horses is going to be any more humane than the last bunch were? We've already seen how they flagrantly disregard the law.

No, we've seen a lot of propaganda about abuse.

5) You can only kill a horse once. The amount that LIVING horses bring into the TN economy by far surpasses the economic value of killing them.

Indeed? Perhaps you can enligten us about just how this is true?

Deadline is April 7 to contact the TN House Budget Subcommittee. Thanks.

Letters already in the mail supporting the legislation.

G.

[War Admiral]

Honestly, I can't be bothered to feed the trolls. Anyway, we've all done these issues over and over again.

All I came on to say is that TN HB1428 narrowly passed the Budget Subcommittee earlier today (7/6) and will be voted on by the full TN Finance, Ways & Means Committee on April 13.

Do as you will.

[Alagirl]

Honestly, I can't be bothered to feed the trolls. Anyway, we've all done these issues over and over again.

All I came on to say is that TN HB1428 narrowly passed the Budget Subcommittee earlier today (7/6) and will be voted on by the full TN Finance, Ways & Means Committee on April 13.

Do as you will.

I'd expect better of you.

[Bluey]

Honestly, I can't be bothered to feed the trolls. Anyway, we've all done these issues over and over again.

All I came on to say is that TN HB1428 narrowly passed the Budget Subcommittee earlier today (7/6) and will be voted on by the full TN Finance, Ways & Means Committee on April 13.

Do as you will.

I didn't expect such a uncalled for response to good answers from you?

Your COTH persona is generally sensible, but calling regular posters trolls I would not expect, from how you normally respond.

Lets remember that, if we don't have something sensible to contribute, we maybe ought to edit ourselves a little bit.

Wichever way the votes go, I bet all will do the best they can under those laws.
I sure hope that, if the animal rights groups got their way, those that support them won't have to regret that later.

[Bluey]

I'd expect better of you.

We both were thinking the same.
Guess that we don't know posters as well as we thought we do.

[War Admiral]

Sorry, I'm not going to engage with you. It's not about me, nor should it be. I simply dropped by here to report to any interested parties on the current status of the Tennessee bill. That is all.

If you care to, you may watch the video of the Budget Subcommittee Proceedings.

[subk]

A few thoughts:

1. "The Nashville Scene" is a lowlife urban joke and an excellent example of yellow journalism. The reporters are consistently bias and unprofessional. Take what they write with a huge grain of salt. Or better yet don't read them at all as doing so similar to feeding the trolls.

2. Rep. Nicely is a class act and you would be hard pressed to find anybody on either side of the aisle question his integrity. Agriculture is a subject matter he is very astute on and it is no accident that he is a state leader in that area of expertise.

3. I've personally known this bill was in the works for almost a year--long before our "high profile" incidents of neglect/abuse made the news. How anyone would report that it has somehow been "slipped" in so voters don't know about it is unfathomable to me.

4. That the bill "narrowly" passed the sub committee vote is a reflection of the current Dem/Repub make up of the legislature, not at all a commentary on the bill itself.

5. Plenty of businesses "don't pay income tax" yet are routinely courted to relocate to a community because of things like the jobs they create--and the value to the community of those jobs. Just ask Gov. Bresesen who has negotiated away everything and the kitchen sink just to get companies like Dell, Nissan and the TN Titans to move to town.

[Alagirl]

Sorry, I'm not going to engage with you. It's not about me, nor should it be. I simply dropped by here to report to any interested parties on the current status of the Tennessee bill. That is all.

If you care to, you may watch the video of the Budget Subcommittee Proceedings.

Oh, Bluey, seems like we are dismissed, with the rest of the rebble

[Guilherme]

Honestly, I can't be bothered to feed the trolls. Anyway, we've all done these issues over and over again.

All I came on to say is that TN HB1428 narrowly passed the Budget Subcommittee earlier today (7/6) and will be voted on by the full TN Finance, Ways & Means Committee on April 13.

Do as you will.

In other words when you posted mis- and dis-information and got called on it you resorted whining.

As a young lad I was taught that, "if you have the law, pound the law; if you have the facts, pound the facts; if you have neither, pound the table."

We've just had a fine example of table-pounding.

Note that I watched the Channel 6 review of the hearing last night. The best that opponents of this bill can do is import Willie Nelson's kin to read a prepared statement on why this is a bad idea. Maybe Willie hisself will show up next time.

As noted before, Nicely is a class act who's got a lot of equine experience. He knows what he is about, even if other folks do not.

G.

[Angela Freda]

Horse slaughter is still alive and well, horses ship to slaughter from the US every day in the same or larger #s then they did when we had the 3 US plants in operation.
If TN peeps wanted to sell their horse to slaughter instead of starving them, they still can without this plant.

Further, neglect is not legal.
Get those laws enforced, call AC to report the starved horse next door.
If you're going to say 'the AC is overwhelmed, they can't enforce' pray tell how the laws surrounding the slaughter industry and the new EU guidelines for no drugs will then be enforced? Who is going to manage the environmental impact this type of plant will have on your area and the local community? It would serve those who are pro-plant well to look at the issues surrounding the close of the Ill plant that was overwhelming local infrastructure.

[lesson junkie]

I simply don't believe the plants will be run humanely. It will cost time and money, and the operaters won't have the will to impact their bottom line. Nor will the regulating authorities enforce the laws-look at the reluctance to enforce the anti-neglect/cruelty that we have now.

If I could have confidence that the plants would be operated in a humane manner, then the very logical arguments supporting slaughter could pursuade me. I just don't have that much confidence in human nature. Human greed is going to get in the way of that-people are very willing to let some other living thing suffer a great deal for their own gain.

[Alagirl]

I simply don't believe the plants will be run humanely. It will cost time and money, and the operaters won't have the will to impact their bottom line. Nor will the regulating authorities enforce the laws-look at the reluctance to enforce the anti-neglect/cruelty that we have now.

that is part of the problem.

I do believe Temple Grandin has found out that it is beneficial to individuals on both ends of the bolt gun to take a moment reprieve.
'The Operators' are human beings.
it's that simple.

[Angela Freda]

Temple Grandin, I think in an NPR interview, talked about a hog plant she helped make more gentle/kind/humane, and also that made it more efficient. Win/win, right? Alas when she went back months later the workers had regressed to their previous rough handling, etc.
Because the workers are human and doing a job that would probably make Mother Teresa curse, there is no one time fix, no one regulation that can be put into effect and then walked away from. Oversight, as I see it, is where the downfall is.

[Alagirl]

Temple Grandin, I think in an NPR interview, talked about a hog plant she helped make more gentle/kind/humane, and also that made it more efficient. Win/win, right? Alas when she went back months later the workers had regressed to their previous rough handling, etc.
Because the workers are human and doing a job that would probably make Mother Teresa curse, there is no one time fix, no one regulation that can be put into effect and then walked away from. Oversight, as I see it, is where the downfall is.

Yes. To all of it.

I mean, for thousands of years we have been drilled to not kill, in the last 30 years killing animals has become a tabu...sheesh, how can one do the job and not go nuts...or you devalue the life in front of you...

But then again, every place you pay people to work for you needs to be under survailance at all times, or people slack off and act not in the company's best interest.

BUT

that is a greater problem in other lifestock plants, we actually do eat that ourselves...and there are more to process...

and also, it is a problem, though it needs constant attention - it can be addressed.

[Scruffy]

"In other words when you posted mis- and dis-information and got called on it you resorted whining.

As a young lad I was taught that, "if you have the law, pound the law; if you have the facts, pound the facts; if you have neither, pound the table."

We've just had a fine example of table-pounding."


Loved it!