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Not exactly the humane end people talk about in the slaughter debate.

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  • Not exactly the humane end people talk about in the slaughter debate.

    http://www.examiner.com/x-9726-Seatt...terhouse-rules
    "All life is precious"
    Sophie Scholl

  • #2
    Totally sickening!!
    Tricia Veley-First Flight Farm
    Boerne, Texas
    830-537-4150 phone/830-537-4154 fax
    www.firstflightfarm.com
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    Comment


    • #3
      Ignorance is bliss, at least from the other side, not for the poor creatures in the midst of the nightmare.

      Comment


      • #4
        They had an episode on either Larry King or AC360 the night before last about this. The USDA inspector said that many inspectors were phsically threatened by the SH owners, and when they complained to their superiors, were basically told to shut up and leave the SHs alone.

        If we can't get the SH's to humanely and safely handle the animals that go into our food supply here in the US, how do you think they handled horses for slaughter that we DON'T eat?

        Or how well do you think the inspectors that were hired BY the SH did their jobs?

        Comment


        • #5
          This inspector should not be the sole voice for what's right - all inspectors should operate this way. This is no different than any other industry - you do things right, by-the-books, or you shut down and don't do it at all. What is the point in having all these government "safeguards" in place if everyone just rubber stamps things thru? Total waste of time and $$.

          You should be able to stand and say, "No. This isn't the right way to do things." without being labeled an activist or a bleeding heart. If they can't train workers on how to correctly slaughter and bleed out a pig, cow, whatever then their employee training (or hiring practices) stinks and they shouldn't be in business. Simple. Shut 'em down and let the companies with good records pick up the extra business and profit.

          Comment


          • #6
            Exactly

            Originally posted by WendellsGirl View Post
            This inspector should not be the sole voice for what's right - all inspectors should operate this way. This is no different than any other industry - you do things right, by-the-books, or you shut down and don't do it at all. What is the point in having all these government "safeguards" in place if everyone just rubber stamps things thru? Total waste of time and $$.

            You should be able to stand and say, "No. This isn't the right way to do things." without being labeled an activist or a bleeding heart. If they can't train workers on how to correctly slaughter and bleed out a pig, cow, whatever then their employee training (or hiring practices) stinks and they shouldn't be in business. Simple. Shut 'em down and let the companies with good records pick up the extra business and profit.
            Everything you said. And that is my main issue with horse slaughter, too. The pipeline and the end.
            Is there really a way to legislate kindeness? Not even kindness, just awareness of another life? No, not when plants are "processing" (like that word? like calling the round up "gathers") thousands of animals a day. You will not be able to make people working the lines to have a care for the animals, so the last and only line of defense for the animals is the inspector.
            My big man - April 27, 1986 - September 04, 2008-
            You're with me every moment, my big red horse.

            Be kinder than necessary, for everyone is fighting a battle of some kind.

            Comment


            • #7
              Of course there SHOULD BE, WG. But that seems to not be the case in the numerous plant atrocities brought to our attention.

              Ok, slaughter supporters, here's your challenge: find and videotape SEVERAL different slaughter locations of any animal any place where the practices truly reflect the laws on animal handling and such. If they are following the law, it shouldn't be a problem, right? But in so many cases, laws are not being followed, and there is secretiveness and hostility to any supervising authority, even the govt. that is supposed to be there.

              If you (and they) think this practice is such a good idea and can so easily be made humane, please educate us. NOT with your arguments and opinions, NOT with your complaints about how the anti-slaughter folks distort your reputations and actions, but with EVIDENCE, videotape of these actions actually taking place. We will all be here, patiently and interestedly waiting................
              I tolerate all kinds of animal idiosyncrasies.
              I've found that I don't tolerate people idiosyncrasies as well. - Casey09

              Comment


              • #8
                Come on, this doesn't has anything to do with horses, I don't think.

                Second, that is put out there by this group, that is an animal rights group:

                http://www.ecostarlaw.com/

                You always tell me that the links that prove something are not credible if it is someone with an agenda that provides them.
                Well, you can't get any closer to someone with an agenda than these folks.

                I will repeat, there are abuse cases every place we look, parents abusing kids, teachers, doctors, priests and yes, also in slaughter.

                What that story doesn't say is that abuse is very rare and no one, not most parents, teachers, doctors, priest and slaughter employees want to see any abuse happen., anywhere.

                That was definitely just another hatchet job at presenting some news.

                People in the beef business were just as mad and ashamed at hearing what happened in that two bit place as everyone else and called for those there to be punished, as rules, regulations and laws demand.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Lori B View Post
                  Of course there SHOULD BE, WG. But that seems to not be the case in the numerous plant atrocities brought to our attention.

                  Ok, slaughter supporters, here's your challenge: find and videotape SEVERAL different slaughter locations of any animal any place where the practices truly reflect the laws on animal handling and such. If they are following the law, it shouldn't be a problem, right? But in so many cases, laws are not being followed, and there is secretiveness and hostility to any supervising authority, even the govt. that is supposed to be there.

                  If you (and they) think this practice is such a good idea and can so easily be made humane, please educate us. NOT with your arguments and opinions, NOT with your complaints about how the anti-slaughter folks distort your reputations and actions, but with EVIDENCE, videotape of these actions actually taking place. We will all be here, patiently and interestedly waiting................
                  There are right now several companies that have live stream videos of slaughter plant operation going to independent observers, as part of contracts with companies they provide those products to.

                  No, the general public won't have access to those videos, they are propietary information, as it should be.

                  Slaughter plants have had that kind of video monitoring for some years now, since some animal rights fanatics paid some workers to drop carcasses and rehang them and made videos of that and then tried to say that was how they operated.

                  The videos in plants are used to train employees and to monitor that no one does something they are not supposed to do.

                  That little plant in Vermont was just one of those that there were complaints about before and someone dropped the ball in following thru with the complaints and hopefully they will be punished or closed.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    But you don't have an agenda right? I mean you don't raise cattle for beef so there is no skin off your nose if the industry gets slammed, right? You are just responding because it's the right thing to do, because this is staged, they got the workers at their worst and you know that. After all they can't stage a good and humane slaughter like they can the abuses, right?

                    PALEEEZ, always one side, your side. This guy is an inspector, he's spent days on the line, not just one time that he witnesses abuses. Any assembly line needs high productivity and when killing animals it's at their expense. This system isn't working, even when one animal is abused in the process of their slaughter it should be a big deal. I'm sure it is for that creature.

                    If you want the complaints to stop, change the system.



                    Originally posted by Bluey View Post
                    Come on, this doesn't has anything to do with horses, I don't think.

                    Second, that is put out there by this group, that is an animal rights group:

                    http://www.ecostarlaw.com/

                    You always tell me that the links that prove something are not credible if it is someone with an agenda that provides them.
                    Well, you can't get any closer to someone with an agenda than these folks.

                    I will repeat, there are abuse cases every place we look, parents abusing kids, teachers, doctors, priests and yes, also in slaughter.

                    What that story doesn't say is that abuse is very rare and no one, not most parents, teachers, doctors, priest and slaughter employees want to see any abuse happen., anywhere.

                    That was definitely just another hatchet job at presenting some news.

                    People in the beef business were just as mad and ashamed at hearing what happened in that two bit place as everyone else and called for those there to be punished, as rules, regulations and laws demand.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      So the USDA vets and inspectors are lying too? All of the video showing abuses were "staged"? And abuse is soooo very rare, yet amazingly cameras "Just happened" to be lucky enough to catch that ONE time it happened...

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        He really did testify last week:
                        http://oversight.house.gov/index.php...4817&Itemid=31 (more reputable source)

                        You can download his prepared statement.

                        Wow.

                        And you wonder why so many vets don't want to do food animal?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by jetsmom View Post
                          So the USDA vets and inspectors are lying too? All of the video showing abuses were "staged"? And abuse is soooo very rare, yet amazingly cameras "Just happened" to be lucky enough to catch that ONE time it happened...
                          Just think about what you are trying to say there.
                          There are MILLIONS of cattle slaughtered and just a few any time can claim there was abuse, sad that any abuse happened at all is.

                          When we hear of a rescue starving horses, do you think then ALL are starving their horses?
                          When you hear of a trainer abusing horses, do you believe everyone in training barns are abusing horses?

                          Right.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Killing animals on an assembly line is a big industrial trade secret? Really? I'm not buying it. I think we all know that such information / video is kept under wraps because it is inherently upsetting and incendiary to people, even if they were doing everything 'right' at a given plant.

                            Until someone wants to show us EVIDENCE that bad acts are somehow statistical outliers, color me unpersuaded.

                            Calling me and my opinions stupid and emotional is strangely ineffective at persuading me that your case is based on facts.
                            I tolerate all kinds of animal idiosyncrasies.
                            I've found that I don't tolerate people idiosyncrasies as well. - Casey09

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by FatPalomino View Post
                              He really did testify last week:
                              http://oversight.house.gov/index.php...4817&Itemid=31 (more reputable source)

                              You can download his prepared statement.

                              Wow.

                              And you wonder why so many vets don't want to do food animal?


                              Yes, he did and you know what, that plant was one that had citations and was closed before.

                              The system was working, just not good enough in that situation.

                              Just like when we hear of abuse any other place, the system at times doesn't work well, until the break is found and fixed.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by Lori B View Post
                                Killing animals on an assembly line is a big industrial trade secret? Really? I'm not buying it. I think we all know that such information / video is kept under wraps because it is inherently upsetting and incendiary to people, even if they were doing everything 'right' at a given plant.

                                Until someone wants to show us EVIDENCE that bad acts are somehow statistical outliers, color me unpersuaded.

                                Calling me and my opinions stupid and emotional is strangely ineffective at persuading me that your case is based on facts.
                                Anything industries do is propietary information, nothing sinister about it.

                                You are free to believe anything or not, of course, but I am free to disagree when what you say doesn't agree with what I know.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Oh, Bluey come on.

                                  A few? So, the cruel nasty slaughter house worker, or the farm worker, or the driver , and all those the animals encounter along the way. "Only a few" are abused? Oh please.

                                  I've read or seen more than 15 different videos from different sources, read articles, etc. over the last 25 years. I guess that was just a few.

                                  So, "The Jungle" - just fiction? Certainly had nothing to do with the humane slaughter act, too. And ever since then, things are normally fine. Except for a few.
                                  My big man - April 27, 1986 - September 04, 2008-
                                  You're with me every moment, my big red horse.

                                  Be kinder than necessary, for everyone is fighting a battle of some kind.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by Brandy76 View Post
                                    Oh, Bluey come on.

                                    A few? So, the cruel nasty slaughter house worker, or the farm worker, or the driver , and all those the animals encounter along the way. "Only a few" are abused? Oh please.

                                    I've read or seen more than 15 different videos from different sources, read articles, etc. over the last 25 years. I guess that was just a few.

                                    So, "The Jungle" - just fiction? Certainly had nothing to do with the humane slaughter act, too. And ever since then, things are normally fine. Except for a few.
                                    How many stories of rescues abusing horses have you read in COTH lately?
                                    Do you now assume all rescues of course must be abusing horses?

                                    That is without anyone having an agenda against rescues.

                                    Imagine if people would be running around trying to video rescues in operation and all they do, editing the videos in the worst light they can manage to, to really, really make those rescues look terrible, if they were or not making mistakes or really abusive?

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by Bluey View Post
                                      There are right now several companies that have live stream videos of slaughter plant operation going to independent observers, as part of contracts with companies they provide those products to.

                                      No, the general public won't have access to those videos, they are propietary information, as it should be.
                                      If they have nothing to hide, then why not make the videos public?

                                      It's because if people actually saw the process, they may decide to no longer eat meat!
                                      Proud owner of a Slaughter-Bound TB from a feedlot, and her surprise baby...!
                                      http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e350/Jen4USC/fave.jpg
                                      http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...SC/running.jpg

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by Bluey View Post
                                        Just think about what you are trying to say there.
                                        There are MILLIONS of cattle slaughtered and just a few any time can claim there was abuse, sad that any abuse happened at all is.

                                        When we hear of a rescue starving horses, do you think then ALL are starving their horses?
                                        When you hear of a trainer abusing horses, do you believe everyone in training barns are abusing horses?

                                        Right.
                                        This is testimony from a DIFFERENT USDA inspector who became a whistleblower-(Pay attention to where he states that the abuse is routine, not the exception.)

                                        Whistleblower Complaint: Statement of a Former USDA Inspector
                                        I worked for a number of years as a U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA) slaughterhouse inspector. I inspected facilities that slaughtered cows, pigs, and goats, but most of the time, I worked at a Perdue poultry slaughter plant and an Allen's Family Foods poultry slaughter plant in the Delmarva region. During that time, I observed systematic and routine cruelty to animals. These abuses were not isolated incidents or restricted to a single facility—they were routine and accepted by the industry.

                                        Chickens arrived at the slaughter plant already showing signs of mistreatment. As a result of inadequate conditions on the farms where the birds were raised, disease was rampant. Sometimes close to half of the birds coming in had to be condemned as unfit for human consumption because of air sacculitis or inflammatory process, which results from inhumane living conditions.1 Inspectors condemned many birds—it could be 100 or more in a night—because they were covered with severe bruises. Many other birds were not condemned but had body parts so bruised that they had to be cut off their carcasses. These bruises were probably inflicted by chicken gatherers' violently grabbing them and throwing them onto trucks or by slaughterhouse workers' forcing them into shackles. Walking around the plant, I'd see the piles of dead birds, including those who were mutilated or ripped apart by the machinery—I'd guess that about another 100 or so birds a night were condemned for such reasons even before they reached the inspection floor. Sometimes these birds are still alive when they're thrown in the condemned barrels, their wings are still flapping, and they just get dead birds thrown on top of them.

                                        Chickens were transported to slaughter stuffed inside little cages on the back of flatbed trucks, completely exposed to the elements and without any food or water. They were often trucked in from farms several hours away and then sat for hours more on the trucks waiting to be unloaded. In the summer, birds regularly died from the extreme heat. On a really hot day, massive numbers of birds would arrive dead. I'd see 10 to 15 industrial-size barrels 5 feet high, each filled with dead birds. In the winter, birds had no protection while exposed for hours to below-freezing temperatures and extreme wind chill while traveling at 65 miles per hour. In many cases, by the time a truck was unloaded, birds had already frozen to death.

                                        The chickens were dumped from their cages into the hanging area, where the mostly immigrant workers grabbed the birds and forced their legs into shackles as fast as they could. Workers would tell me about abusive treatment of birds in the hanging area, but no one seemed to care. I could see from the way the birds were hanging by their legs that many of their legs were broken. The birds are then dragged hanging upside-down by their legs through an electric trawl, which is supposed to stun them before a mechanical knife slits their throats. However, they did not look stunned to me, and many were pulling their heads away from the knife, so the plant had to place a worker there to cut their throats by hand while they were still conscious. The worker's face would be covered in chicken blood. Sometimes the machine was broken, so workers slit the throats of all the birds by hand while the birds were still conscious. Other times the machine was not working properly, and it missed maybe every fifth bird. In spite of the back-up killers, many birds were still alive when they were submerged in tanks of scalding-hot water used to loosen their feathers. They were dragged through the scalding-hot water for 15 to 20 feet, until they drowned. You could tell they were alive when they entered the tanks because they come out beet-red and full of blood. On an average night, about 150 birds died this way. On a bad night, it could easily be more than 1,000 birds. The inspectors condemned these birds.

                                        Sometimes chickens fell off the kill line. Workers would often just ignore these birds and sometimes kick them. On a typical night there were 10 to 15 birds running around somewhere in the plant, often hiding in a dark corner. At the end of the day, workers used hoses and washed these live birds away with all the feces, blood, and dead carcasses and dumped them in barrels where they probably suffocated to death. In addition, equipment breakdowns were frequent, and when they occurred, chickens hanging on the line were sometimes left there for several hours. A lot of them died there while waiting for repairs. They had to be pulled off the line before equipment was started up again.

                                        USDA veterinarians at the plants showed no interest in the welfare of the animals. I have never seen any of these veterinarians enforce any form of humane treatment. They simply do not care. [Editor's Note: The few who do care can be punished for doing their jobs. Click here to read more.] It appears to me that they do not want to cause trouble when it could cause a loss of production or money at the plant. These veterinarians are mostly from third-world countries like Pakistan, India, and Egypt, and their training seems questionable, because they did not seem very knowledgeable. They were all completely useless. One USDA veterinarian would spend all day sleeping in his office. Everyone knew that he was never to be bothered. Once in a while he'd walk up and down the plant, and when people would come to him with problems, he would just tell them, "It's OK. Let it go."

                                        I observed an enormous amount of abuse and suffering at these slaughter plants. On some days, after coming home from work, I'd grab my little dog and just cry. In the past couple of years, I've become a complete vegetarian.

                                        Signed,

                                        [Name withheld to protect the whistleblower]


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