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Salamander Resort/Spa in Middleburg

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  • #61
    [QUOTE]Originally posted by Uberraschung:
    Sheila Johnson has always driven me crazy for only one reason. She is not a real doctor, neither MD or PhD or any other kind of person who has the legitimate right and who has worked like a dog for the title. An honorary doctorate because you donated massive amounts of money to a school does NOT give you the right to call yourself a Dr....God that pisses me off.
    QUOTE]

    I agree - I can't take anything she says without laughing at her for taking herself so seriously. What a bizarre thing to do! I'd think most people would be embarassed to flaunt a non-earned doctorate (as opposed to an honorary, as she has).

    Whatever. This is just another story of the United States. The wealthy get what they want, period

    Comment


    • #62
      Actually, I think this is a case of the wealthier getting what they want and the "merely" wealthy having to settle.

      Thanks to those who posted re: zoning laws/realities/etc.... It cleared up quite a bit!

      Comment


      • #63
        Wow. I didn't know I was wealthy. I guess I should stop buying my clothes at Wal-Mart.
        Brothers and sisters, I bid you beware
        Of giving your heart to a dog to tear.
        -Rudyard Kipling

        Comment


        • #64
          I am not from the area, but seeing as Sheila Johnson is a horse person, why is everyone so against her having a little business in Middleburg?
          Save the Nauga\'s

          Comment


          • #65
            <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by llt:
            I am not from the area, but seeing as Sheila Johnson is a horse person, why is everyone so against her having a little business in Middleburg? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

            "little business"

            Frankly I don't think people would take issue with the Salamander Inn project - and there are other existing Salamander ventures like Market Salamander which fit in just fine - if it wasn't so large. The heart of the issue is suitable development which is in keeping with the character and nature of the low-key community as well as having minimal impact on the environment, light traffic disruptions, etc.

            The plan went from being a small Inn to now something far more on par with a larger-scale destination resort and/or conference center. Equestrian or not the issue isn't if the owner likes, owns or rides horses. Heck toss a stone anywhere in M'burg and you'll hit a person who is one or more of the three.

            One of the recent articles on the grand plans: Virginia Business June 2005 - "Move over, Martha Stewart ..."

            snip: Johnson, 56, wants to build a $70 million to $80 million, 120-room luxury resort and spa on the outskirts of town. “This will be a real destination resort for Loudoun County,” she promises. “I aspire to excellence and want it to be the best — a five-star resort.” Plans call for two restaurants, banquet facilities, a full-service spa, a conference center, stables and miles of trails for horseback riding.

            Comment


            • #66
              Just out of curiosity, what sort of occupancy rate would a place like this need to be viable? Whatever the rate is, is it reasonable to think that this proposed resort would attract enough business to be successful?

              I've only been through the area a few times, so I don't know where the clientele would come from for such an operation.

              Comment


              • #67
                If she's planning on feeding people at this spa, the food had better be of higher quality than that served up at Salamander Market...maybe Middleburg is still provincial, but SM is no match for what's available at the deli counter at Publix in WPB....

                Comment


                • #68
                  Sorry Glimmerglass, after reading the Virginia Business article, I see things a little differently. After reading about her fiance being the judge who presided over her divorce, and her plans to make her market into a chain store, I wonder if she will open an outlet mall to ensure the inn remains at full capacity, or maybe a theme park.
                  Save the Nauga\'s

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    This is not just about the Inn/Spa.

                    First off, Loudoun County NEEDS more overnight beds, there are less than 80 B&B beds in the county, not B&Bs, but the number of rooms available for guests.

                    Second, while the plans are for upscale Spa, I wonder if high vacancy rates will cause business plan changes after a year or two, and it might become a pricey, but do-able for many place to stay during some of the many horse shows.

                    The profitability of a small B&B is not exactly huge. My guess is that the number of rooms went up because of some hotel/spa industry analysis about profitability.

                    The bigger issue here boils down to zoning issues, property owner rights, community citizen wants and rights, and the usual resistance to any and all change.

                    Zoning issues, Loudoun County zoning is already approaching HOA levels of restriction, and that doesn't even get into the current political battles over housing development.

                    The county has been attempting to make the western half of Loudoun friendly to BUSINESSES that keep open space. Businesses need to make money.

                    The 15 acre farm is becoming the norm, not the 250 acre farm. We ARE in a major metropolitan area. That is both the curse and blessing. Most of us are here because we work in the DC area, we love the region and like all the things to do...in our case (COTH participants) horse stuff.

                    One thing, when the BOS are reviewing zoning, development plans and all the other stuff, they listen to EVERYONE. Not just horse people, not just developers, not just the winery owners, not just the organic farmers, not just the pick-your-own-farmers, not just the niche-market producers of some product, not just the lawn companies.

                    While I might not like everything about the plan, I would STILL rather see a spa than 100 McMansions.

                    Having had my plans threatened by zoning rules, I know how it feels, and it is awful easy for the peanut gallery to be cavalier about money spent when it is someone else's money. Because obviously, all those someone else's must be rich.

                    Loudoun should stay business friendly, and I'd like it to stay friendly to something other than Walmart, Target, Home Depot and Costco type chains. Rural businesses have many challenges to meet to co-exist with the residential neighborhoods around them, but if they pack up and leave, the open space they have, will turn into another sea of houses.

                    Mel

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      So for those of you saying that the Salamander Resort/Spa needs a nearby golf course in order attract visitors --- here you go!! One big golf course on rural Route 15 with gated McMansions coming right up!

                      http://www.leesburg2day.com/current.cfm?catid=28&newsid=11120


                      "... Also on hand was BET founder Sheila Johnson, who is in the process of developing the Salamander Hospitality Resort and Spa just outside Middleburg."

                      I bet she is delighted!

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        very stupid question but why does she want to build this spa?? for the money??? to better Middleburg??

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          shade-

                          Money.

                          Goodbye, Loudoun county.
                          Brothers and sisters, I bid you beware
                          Of giving your heart to a dog to tear.
                          -Rudyard Kipling

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            OK, I'm probably stepping in it here, as I don't live in Middleburg and am not familiar with the proposed Spa/Resort, but honestly, it's not as though they want to put a nuclear power plant, or a Walmart, or a prison facility, or even a housing development in.
                            And I have a hard time swallowing the comment "The ultimate nveau riche urbanite moved there and decided us hillbillies didn't belong there no more...." - Midleburg has been a very up-scale (though not 'neveau') for quite some time, and I doubt any "hillbillies" have been able to afford to live there in any of our life-times!

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              I don't think her motivation can be money - the inn/spa/gourmet chain store will not have the same return on her investment that BET did. And she couldn't possibly need more money!
                              Save the Nauga\'s

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                I personally can't stand the idea of the area being changed, at all. Showing at the racetrack as a little girl and seeing the beautiful farms has always been a treat when we come that way.

                                If she is so hell bent on building a spa, then why wouldn't she either renovate an old, existing home, or build one in the time era of those that already exist there?

                                A conference center? I think not. Do you realize what the additional traffic and pollution will do to the area? Roads getting widened, parking lots, etc.

                                The absolute best is saying no to Sheila, in my opinion.
                                Randee Beckman ~Otteridge Farm, LLC (http://on.fb.me/1iJEqvR)~ Marketing Manager - The Clothes Horse & Jennifer Oliver Equine Insurance Specialist

                                Comment


                                • #76
                                  Why does anyone have an idea for something new?

                                  Why do the people who operate a B&B decide to do that? Why do people who grow grapes do that?

                                  Why do wineries have their product?

                                  WHY? Because they have something they hope other people will like and want and enjoy.

                                  Why did I decide to build extra stalls to have boarders?

                                  Yes, most business ventures do want to turn a profit, and most of them don't turn a profit immediately.

                                  I agree with those who think it is pretentious and annoying for her to use the honorary "Dr." title, but in the grand scheme of things, does that really matter?

                                  I think that most people who have never run a business, paying their own taxes, dealing with government, and licenses are absolutely clueless when it comes to how business development works. That would be ANY development, not just housing. They are also pretty clueless about the economies of running a business.

                                  Mel

                                  Comment


                                  • #77
                                    A.P. - there really just isn't room for that type of traffic. 15 +/- (hard to remember) years ago they put in the stoplight. THE ONE stoplight and that nearly fried everyone. Truly, it's not the right location for such a resort. YEs, there is plenty of attraction to Middleburg and there is nowhere close to stay other than Leesburg, but the roads just aren't up to the in/out. I'm afraid next we will be hearing of a bypass for Middleburg (then Upperville too) in order to keep up with this size growth. IF or when that happens, I could see this size development having proper access.

                                    Also, there is housing for the not so rich in Middleburg. That is new in the last what, 6 years? Time flies.

                                    Traffic is bad enough on Sat with the tourism and during the week, RT 50 is bumper to bumper at 6 am. They still have not finished building all the houses out there... it's a problem with or without the resort/spa. Imagine how different the county/countryside would be if this corridor ends up like Leesburg/RT 7. Once is starts that direction, there's no stopping it.


                                    g

                                    Comment


                                    • #78
                                      Oh, and for those who don't want it to change, you simply get to do what everyone else does...

                                      BUY THE LAND.

                                      You want no change, you buy it, you pay the taxes on that land, maintain the fields, keep it beautifully weedeated and mown, keep the coops in the fencelines, allow the hunts to come through, run a few cattle, etc.

                                      My neighbors didn't want me to build a horse farm, but I bought the land, it was an allowed use, and I built it.

                                      People don't want change, but change is inevitable, it is mostly trying to find a direction of change that will keep at least some of the character of the region.

                                      Mel

                                      Comment


                                      • #79
                                        <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
                                        So for those of you saying that the Salamander Resort/Spa needs a nearby golf course in order attract visitors ... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                        The four star Goodstone Inn, which is only a miles and half awa, just off Foxcroft Road has always listed a round of golf at the nearby Stoneleigh Golf & Country Club in Round Hill as an activity included in the nightly rate.

                                        <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
                                        Sorry Glimmerglass, after reading the Virginia Business article, I see things a little differently. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                        Not sure what you are to be sorry about or how you think I see this venture as good or bad.

                                        This spa/inn project wouldn't be the end of the world if it simply occured on a smaller scale. I won't even remark about the proposed architecture which doesn't fit the area IMHO. Stone and slate with a Federal style is more of the Hunt Country experience.

                                        Anyhow ..

                                        If Mrs. Johnson has aspirations of building a lifestyle company I say that is great! This is America and what is wrong if she wants to go to France and have custom bedsheets created and assorted food products, et al? If she wants to make Market Salamander into the next Harry and David or Dean & Deluca, or Trotter's To Go, good luck!

                                        My personal objection is simply tied to this Inn being a mammoth (relatively speaking) conference center that suggests it could easily alter the quaint charm of the Village and ruin the lovely, quiet Foxcroft area.

                                        To SaddleFitterVA's comment I agree - "it is awful easy for the peanut gallery to be cavalier about money spent when it is someone else's money." Yet regardless if she is a billionaire (Forbes didn't mention her at all on the 2005 list of the 400) or just a person who put together an investment group the end product is the same.

                                        M'burg and the rest of Loudoun should be friendly to business provided each venture makes sense. I'm sure the Village, could easily support a McDonald's .. but is that in keeping with the character of the town? I say no and the same applies to 120-room Inn.

                                        As to why she is doing the whole Inn thing, purportedly she stayed here The Inn at the Round Barn Farm, VT and thought the concept would work in Virginia too.

                                        Comment

                                        • Original Poster

                                          #80
                                          Well it's obviously not to help Middleburg out.... so then what would it be???

                                          Didn't her hubby start BET???
                                          They call it PMS because Mad Cow Disease was already taken...

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