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Notes from Springfield, IL...

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  • Originally posted by luvmytbs View Post
    And I remember growing up and teachers encouraging us to form opinions and discussing political issues early on.
    I had to endure reading "Animal Farm" at twelve.

    But I guess today's children are supposed to wait turning into independent thinkers until they actually leave their parent's home?

    The only ones looking stupid in this story are the two grown men with stick horses trying to make a point with fabricated numbers.

    I couldn't agree more!
    She wasn't running away with me, I just couldn't stop her!

    Comment


    • I have a question. How many of you who are applauding this 'education' actually have children and what are their ages?

      Comment


      • Originally posted by RamblinRoseRanch View Post
        I have a question. How many of you who are applauding this 'education' actually have children and what are their ages?
        That is a good question.

        The reason I objected so strongly is because that first post read like they were little kids, not teenagers.
        Little kids should NOT be harassed by anyone.
        Giving them the stick horse, with permission and without lecturing about any causes is ok.
        Any other way would have been wrong, if those were LITTLE kids.

        To then go take the stick horse away from the little kids, or shame them into it and try to make points about the "bad, evil people that slaughter horses", as that post read, that is something that should make anyone mad, parent or not, if they are against slaughter or against these misguided bans.

        That is not about educating but trying to influence kids and that should not be permitted without the parents there, no matter who is doing it.
        This PETA acting group, the other side, a bible thumper for evolution, an atheist to "enlighten", abortion people for or against, no one should try to impose themselves on a group of little school kids like that.

        Rather than trying to excuse it, the OP should have been apologizing for having a lapse of good common sense there, in the heat of the moment.

        Comment


        • Oh lordy here I am . Look I never said I appauded anything I did say they were all protesting at the CAPITOL where it is not all THAT UNUSUAL to see it! Like it or not it is an education an education in how democracy works. Now if anyone was shoving horrid bloody images to children and screaming at them I would have a problem with it for any cause.........oh wait they can see that every night on the news and get to hear our President talk at length about the "terrorist", let's talk about frightening children.

          For the record I have a son that will be turning 7 and I also know that the risks of running into some heated protests at the capitol are much higher than average, so I would act accordingly. It doesn't sound like anything inappropriate was said to these children, it sounds as if both sides were presented, they certainly weren't hounded and yelled at. RRR I hope you home school and have no TV's because your children are getting an education is many, many things, not all good!


          Originally posted by RamblinRoseRanch View Post
          I have a question. How many of you who are applauding this 'education' actually have children and what are their ages?
          NO HORSES TO SLAUGHTER CLIQUE
          http://www.cafepress.com/maneshirts

          Comment


          • county,,,,I thought there was a Texas law that says horse slaughter is illegal. Why do you keep blaming the anti slaughter people about horses no longer being slaughtered for human consumption? You always seem to throw laws into a conversation at times when they are warranted, so why in the world do you feel like the people involved in the horse slaughter business are above the law? I guess you are gonna say that it was the anti horse slaughter people who pushed for the law to be inforced, and if thats the case you are a hipacrit when it come to laws that are on the books.

            Comment


            • gazenna, do you ever actually have a clue what your saying?
              Quality doesn\'t cost it pays.

              Comment


              • county,,,,,,I'm sure you think you are the most educated here. News Flash your not..................

                Comment


                • LOL No gazenna I assure you I have no thoughts I'm the most educated person here at least not formal education. Fact is I babely made it through High school. I do think thought that you go out of your way to pick fights and your not nearly bright enough to have a dioscussion with out making personal and snide remarks. But then dense people rarely can.
                  Quality doesn\'t cost it pays.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by SweatySaddlepad View Post

                    RRR I hope you home school and have no TV's because your children are getting an education is many, many things, not all good!

                    So because I don't want my children to 'learn' the 'facts' about horse slaughter from two opposing groups with less than practical ways of expressing themselves I should homeschool?

                    My children are in no way sheltered, but if there is a possibility that I can control the timeframe in which they learn what they learn, all the better. Should I have presented them with the facts of life right after potty training? Given them the straight poop about Santa and the Easter Bunny as soon as they exited the womb?

                    As a parent, I would be mad as HELL to see my children, or any children used as pawns. Especially in something that they are not involved in nor do they have the information needed to form their OWN decision, not what is shoved down their throats by non-impartial entities.

                    Comment


                    • Know what's also a fact, depending on who you ask? That gays are awful people who are going to hell. That Muslims are murderers. That Catholic priests are pedophiles. These are 'facts' that I'm not racing to teach my child.

                      One does not 'learn' or gain 'facts' by attending political functions. Sure, they might be relaying the truth in their own way, but anyone who takes their words at face value without doing independent research is painfully stupid.

                      Comment


                      • The bottom line is that young people are impressionable and not completely able to make conclusions without 'help'. When they go home and tell their parents (who are probably CLUELESS about horse slaughter) the entire experience will be replaced by the "facts" their parents and teachers spit out at them.

                        My daughter is 8 years old and has experienced losing her own pony (dog, and cats too). She is familiar with a lot of things, but I have not said to her directly, that horses are slaughtered. She knows about horses getting put down (we are caring for a rescue now that may be put down...and she is aware of the reasons why). She can see with her own eyes how poorly some horses are treated and she can barely handle THAT....no reason to numb her with the harsh reality of slaughter when at this age there is little she can do about it.

                        For these reasons we don't teach elementary aged children what REALLY happened to the Indianas....

                        Gail, I'm sorry this thread came to this - but children/young people being involved will really strike a chord with the public (as you can see by some of our responses). I realize it was unexpected, but it really bothers me and casts a shadow over the entire event. If TV media had been there it could have ruined any good that came of that days efforts.

                        Comment


                        • No but don't expect NOT to run into protesting at the state capitol and when I said I would act accordingly that meant if I saw protesting with small child I would walk AROUND it. To me it's like going to a movie called "Natural Born Killers" then complaining it was to violent. For the record which I thought was pretty evident in my post I don't condone either side for what happened, however these were not grammar school kids and they were not yelled at or harassed.

                          Exactly how old do you think one should be before this issue could be explained in age appropriate words? How about middle school FFA or 4-h would that be to young, how about high school. At what age do you explain the facts of life about where their hamburgers come from?


                          Originally posted by RamblinRoseRanch View Post
                          So because I don't want my children to 'learn' the 'facts' about horse slaughter from two opposing groups with less than practical ways of expressing themselves I should homeschool?

                          My children are in no way sheltered, but if there is a possibility that I can control the timeframe in which they learn what they learn, all the better. Should I have presented them with the facts of life right after potty training? Given them the straight poop about Santa and the Easter Bunny as soon as they exited the womb?

                          As a parent, I would be mad as HELL to see my children, or any children used as pawns. Especially in something that they are not involved in nor do they have the information needed to form their OWN decision, not what is shoved down their throats by non-impartial entities.
                          NO HORSES TO SLAUGHTER CLIQUE
                          http://www.cafepress.com/maneshirts

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by SweatySaddlepad View Post
                            No but don't expect NOT to run into protesting at the state capitol and when I said I would act accordingly that meant if I saw protesting with small child I would walk AROUND it. To me it's like going to a movie called "Natural Born Killers" then complaining it was to violent. For the record which I thought was pretty evident in my post I don't condone either side for what happened, however these were not grammar school kids and they were not yelled at or harassed.

                            Exactly how old do you think one should be before this issue could be explained in age appropriate words? How about middle school FFA or 4-h would that be to young, how about high school. At what age do you explain the facts of life about where their hamburgers come from?
                            My children know where their hamburgers come from, and have from about age five. Do they know the facts about how it comes to be a burger from a life on the farm? No. And why should they?

                            I believe that high school is a time for finding out who you are and where you fit in. And for forming your opinions based on your own thoughts.

                            Why should children be exposed un-necessarily to things that do not affect them so young? It robs them of the innocence of childhood.

                            I, among other things, am a portrait photographer. One session that really turned my stomach was a three year old slapping the crap outta his mother and grandmother and screaming "Die, you faggot! Die."
                            He shouldn't have been exposed to the type of violence that led him to feel that hitting the women was okay, nor should he have been exposed to whatever colored his language.
                            Kids have to grow up so damn fast, I simply don't see any need to hasten it.

                            Comment


                            • Are you missing my point or choosing to ignore it? I have no idea how old your children are, unless I missed where you stated it because I also believe that age should play a factor and innocence in our children for as long as we can keep it is good. Actually I think we agree on many points but again my point was if you go to the state capitol you run the risk of protesters, that's all I'm saying.


                              Originally posted by RamblinRoseRanch View Post
                              My children know where their hamburgers come from, and have from about age five. Do they know the facts about how it comes to be a burger from a life on the farm? No. And why should they?

                              I believe that high school is a time for finding out who you are and where you fit in. And for forming your opinions based on your own thoughts.

                              Why should children be exposed un-necessarily to things that do not affect them so young? It robs them of the innocence of childhood.

                              I, among other things, am a portrait photographer. One session that really turned my stomach was a three year old slapping the crap outta his mother and grandmother and screaming "Die, you faggot! Die."
                              He shouldn't have been exposed to the type of violence that led him to feel that hitting the women was okay, nor should he have been exposed to whatever colored his language.
                              Kids have to grow up so damn fast, I simply don't see any need to hasten it.
                              NO HORSES TO SLAUGHTER CLIQUE
                              http://www.cafepress.com/maneshirts

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by RamblinRoseRanch View Post
                                ...One session that really turned my stomach was a three year old slapping the crap outta his mother and grandmother and screaming "Die, you faggot! Die."
                                He shouldn't have been exposed to the type of violence that led him to feel that hitting the women was okay, nor should he have been exposed to whatever colored his language.
                                This is a case of *gasp* Parental responsibility - or lack there of - gone horribly wrong. At Three this little monster in training is not only uttering vulgar complex phrases, but hitting people!

                                At the first strike, my reaction would have been "NO!" and holding down the arms, and removal from the situation. Kids learn what they see and hear, and if you don't put a stop to that at the start it will only escalate. Someday these people are going to have a 6' 160lb beast on their hands... and worse, they'll wonder where they went wrong...
                                Euthanasia is taking their pain away and making it your own. ~ Laurierace

                                Comment


                                • Had one of us boys screamed at and struck our mother be it at age 3 or today ( shes 75 now ) well lets just say I'd rather have taken on a my Drill Instructor in the milatary.
                                  Quality doesn\'t cost it pays.

                                  Comment


                                  • Originally posted by SweatySaddlepad View Post
                                    Are you missing my point or choosing to ignore it? I have no idea how old your children are, unless I missed where you stated it because I also believe that age should play a factor and innocence in our children for as long as we can keep it is good. Actually I think we agree on many points but again my point was if you go to the state capitol you run the risk of protesters, that's all I'm saying.
                                    I'm neither missing your point or choosing to ignore it. I agree that visiting the capitol has it's own risks and rewards. I am just saying as a mother I prefer my children to be exposed to things when they are better prepared to deal with the information.

                                    Comment


                                    • Originally posted by CarouselPony View Post
                                      This is a case of *gasp* Parental responsibility - or lack there of - gone horribly wrong. At Three this little monster in training is not only uttering vulgar complex phrases, but hitting people!

                                      At the first strike, my reaction would have been "NO!" and holding down the arms, and removal from the situation. Kids learn what they see and hear, and if you don't put a stop to that at the start it will only escalate. Someday these people are going to have a 6' 160lb beast on their hands... and worse, they'll wonder where they went wrong...

                                      And do you have any idea how hard I had to bite my tongue to keep from turning the two adults over my knee and whalin' the tar out of them?

                                      Case in point, the mentality of this area, not as a whole, but the more 'reneckier' parts. My brother and his wife allowed their 5 and 7 year old children to watch the movie Striptease (when it first came out) because, and I quote "We want them to grow up LIKING women. We don't want them to be GAY!"

                                      Comment


                                      • Originally posted by county View Post
                                        Had one of us boys screamed at and struck our mother be it at age 3 or today ( shes 75 now ) well lets just say I'd rather have taken on a my Drill Instructor in the milatary.
                                        You're not the only one.
                                        I have real issue with the 'time out' generation.

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by RamblinRoseRanch View Post
                                          You're not the only one.
                                          I have real issue with the 'time out' generation.
                                          At times I am ashamed of some of our 4H kids.
                                          Some of them use a language so bad I have rarely heard as if it was normal, polite conversation in mixed company.
                                          I am ashamed for them and at times can say something, or if the parents are there look at them, hoping they will and some don't even seem to have heard it.

                                          I have not watched TV forever, just because I really don't need to know every little detail of other people's lives, bad language and all, in that much detail.

                                          Times are sure changing, when people can jump on anyone's kids to try to make points in a debate, then brag about it and few seem to see anything wrong with it.

                                          Comment

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