Another bump - their last day is Sunday unless the broker(s) decide to keep them for another week. Some nice horses, make an offer thru Christy!!!!
Announcement
Collapse
Forum rules and no-advertising policy
As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.
Board Rules
1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.
This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.
Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.
Credible threats of suicide will be reported to the police along with identifying user information at our disposal, in addition to referring the user to suicide helpline resources such as 1-800-SUICIDE or 1-800-273-TALK.
2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.
3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.
4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.
Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.
Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.
Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:
Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.
Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.
Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.
Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.
Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.
Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.
Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.
5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.
6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.
If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.
Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.
7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.
8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.
Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.
Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!
(Revised 2/8/18)
Board Rules
1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.
This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.
Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.
Credible threats of suicide will be reported to the police along with identifying user information at our disposal, in addition to referring the user to suicide helpline resources such as 1-800-SUICIDE or 1-800-273-TALK.
2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.
3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.
4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.
Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.
Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.
Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:
Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.
Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.
Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.
Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.
Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.
Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.
Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.
5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.
6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.
If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.
Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.
7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.
8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.
Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.
Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!
(Revised 2/8/18)
See more
See less
12/01/09 Broker Owned (AC4H)
Collapse
X
-
Rescue? They ARe advertised, for-sale horses, owned by a low-end dealer. Adopted? NO. Just for sale, at unreasonably inflated prices, and you've got to buy sight unseen. I read one story of one of these horses, bought sight unseen, and it turned out to be in MUCH rougher shape than the pictures on the web site showed, with MAJOR, perhaps unsolvable, soundness issues.Originally posted by littletuna View PostThese horses are much more closely labeled as a rescue than advertising sales horses, as if they are not adopted they are sent to slaughter.
Comment
-
I am sorry about the story you heard with the unsound horse, but the rules are spelled out and no one is under any obligation to buy or adopt through the broker program if they do not want to -- the group seems to have its own set of horses that they adopt out that you can come see ahead of time if you want to avoid the "sight unseen" aspect.
For the record, I am not affiliated with AC4H at all, but I did "adopt" a broker-owned horse through them recently. The web site's broker page clearly states that they do not own the horses and are only describing them based on their best guess after seeing them very briefly. I knew what the risks of unsoundness or unsuitability were going in, as they were clearly spelled out through every step of the process. I was in a position to be able to take her, sight unseen but for a few pictures, with the hope that she would be good for low-level eventing but if not, she will just hang out. She certainly seems cute, but I still have no idea if she'll be sound once she gets put into work.
As to the sale/adoption issue, the "overly inflated" price I paid was reimbursing the group for the Coggins and health certificate, and paying the shipping company. The original owner stepped up to pay the broker. Maybe this situation was different because the original owner stepped in and "bought" the horse, but I did sign an agreement with the group that I would not sell the horse on and I did not get her papers, so in that sense it really was like an adoption.
Regardless, brokers exist because there is a market for these horses, even if it is often for slaughter. The broker will get $ either from someone like me or the horse's prior owners/trainers, etc., or from the meat truck. Certainly not ideal, but the reality. The threads about these horses help some of them find new jobs, better homes, and happier lives.
Comment
-
I guess "unreasonably inflated" means different things to different people. I don't consider the prices of these three (my personal favorites from AC4H's current listings) to be "unreasonable" at all, particularly this first mare:Originally posted by nightsong View Post...Just for sale, at unreasonably inflated prices...
12-1-8 Chestnut QH mare - approx 15 hands and smooth mouth which means late teens/early 20's. This girl was wonderful during the evaluation very much took care of her rider - western broke neck reins and gentle. $375.00
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3a8jqRQJds
And two very nice-looking TB's:
12-1-02 - TB gelding approx 11 yr old and 15.3 hands very gentle to work with and patient. Looks well cared for and is very easy to ride. $500.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbXATqucO9k
11-24-09 - Chestnut Thoroughbred mare 5 yr old. $500.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WErBhTeHnyM
If it's the same story I read (which has circulated far and wide over the Internet), don't forget there are always at least two sides to every story (usually 3). Google can be a big help to those who wish to look further than just one person's version.Originally posted by nightsong View Post...I read one story of one of these horses, bought sight unseen, and it turned out to be in MUCH rougher shape than the pictures on the web site showed, with MAJOR, perhaps unsolvable, soundness issues.
I guess, for some people, it doesn't matter that there are those out there stepping in to try to help horses who, through no fault of their own, find themselves facing very uncertain fates. Horses that would otherwise not be given one last chance at loving homes.Equus Keepus Brokus
Comment
-
Actually it is a rescue situation. When you go to new holland and rescue a horse from the kill pen...you are in fact paying for it and you are in fact purchasing it. if you didnt purchase that horse; its definate future is the slaughterhouse and a horrible death, so yes it is in fact a rescue.Originally posted by nightsong View PostRescue? They ARe advertised, for-sale horses, owned by a low-end dealer. Adopted? NO. Just for sale, at unreasonably inflated prices, and you've got to buy sight unseen. I read one story of one of these horses, bought sight unseen, and it turned out to be in MUCH rougher shape than the pictures on the web site showed, with MAJOR, perhaps unsolvable, soundness issues.
These brokers work in one way. They go to the auctions and purchase the cheap ones. in today's market, there isnt anyone buying horses at auctions as projects/riding horses there just isnt. people dont have the money right now and frankly, the way i see it, dont want to be bothered the brokers are picking them up and so are the kill buyers. people also need to understand that these brokers are kill buyers too. they have feedlot pastures of horses after horses and they ship weekly to slaughter.
If it wasn't for AC4H listing these horses for the brokers; these horses would be sold to the slaughterhouse. Some do get run back through the auction ring; but many of the horses who dont find homes on AC4H broker listings do in fact ship to slaughter on a weekly basis.
I bought a warmblood at an auction over the summer. the show barn dropped him off there after the lady stopped paying board for months. Hes fancy, very well built, dark bay with a big white blaze and socks. hes a gorgeous mover, jumps anything, and has auto lead changes. his legs are clean and hes been sound as can be...AND he has great feet. The final bid price on him was $375.00. That horse is easily worth about 9-10K when he's back in a full time program
Saying that everything at an auction or at a broker lot is "unsound" and a peice of crap is just a plain lie and its being stereotypical. Do quite a few have issues and soundness issues? sure they do. Do quite a few of them have little to no problems? of course.
There is a reason why AC4H takes video and quite a few pictures of each horse. it is your responsibility to watch those videos with a close eye and also the photos in the same light. AC4H lists their email for a reason as well as their phone number. if you have any questions about a horse; email or call. they went and viewed every horse listed so if you have questions or concerns; its your responsibility to call and ask them, they want these horses to find homes.
These horses ended up at an auction. it is very likely the majority were not looked after in their best interest. feet go untrimmed. some have lameness isues to due lack of or bad farrier work. some just dont have good farrier work and thats that. They are underweight, teeth probably need to be floated, they are not groomed, bathed, etc. they just havnt been looked after in the same light that horses should be.
You are not buying these horses from a show barn or breeder. you are buying them from someone who makes a living off of the auction networks and the horse meat industry. They do not pay to have horses' feet looked after, they do not de-worm them, the do not give them high quality feed and grains, and they do not have veterinarians look at them unless they plan to keep the horse for themselves.
they will not pay to have the horse drugged when AC4H comes to view them. they wont waste their time and money over something like that. they need to make money somehow off the horse they just bought at the auction whether it means selling it to a private person or selling it to the slaughterhouse...it really doesnt matter to them.
If the horse had major, unsolvable lameness issues...that should be very apparent in the videos AC4H posted and if you had even questioned it; your friend should've called AC4H to confirm anything they saw.
And personally, 300-800 for a reasonable, quiet, honest horse doesnt seem so bad to me. many of them have had some decent training in their backgrounds and all they really need is some TLC, feed, grain, farrier, and some veterinary look overs. most of them just need someone who cares about them and thats the bottom line
Sure these horses are for sale...but many listed are in the same situation as any horse who is in the kill pen awaiting their fate and this is why AC4H goes to these places and does what they do. And this is why we post the links to them on a weekly basis. many of these horses have found wonderful, caring homes on a weekly basis due to the fact that AC4H is wonderful for what they do and there is a list of carin ghorse folk on forums like these who want to help these horses in some way possible. there are many folks here who have bought horses off of these listings or out of the kill pens that we've posted links to and many people are very happy with what theyve purchased.
You are not buying a horse who is sparkling, happy, etc. you are buying a horse who is in a situation it didnt ask for who needs some tender loving care. these horses need help and if it wasnt for those who send links and post these horses; we all know where they'd be every week.
I'm honestly very sorry for those who have a problem with these horses being listed every week and shared on this board. If it wasnt for people like this; these horses would be on the weekly truckload to a horrible death.and im also sorry that folks had bad luck with purchasing but many people havnt and most people need to understand that there is a reason why ac4h posts photos, videos, their email and phone numbers, if you spot something that is questionable on a horse it is your responsibility as a potential buyer to follow up on it and get some more info from those that saw the horse. any deplorable lameness issue that potential will never be fixed should be quite obvious in a video.Last edited by farmgirl88; Dec. 6, 2009, 11:39 AM.
Comment
-
I did send an email to AC4H about this one, but haven't received a reply. TIER would have taken this mare in a red hot minute except that she is too far and funds are all earmarked for feed/farrier.12-1-8 Chestnut QH mare - approx 15 hands and smooth mouth which means late teens/early 20's. This girl was wonderful during the evaluation very much took care of her rider - western broke neck reins and gentle. $375.00
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3a8jqRQJds
I absolutely love the oldies but goodies. I haven't checked to see if she is still there because I'm afraid her story will have a bad ending.
All her years of service and now this. Sad.Be kind to the animals for they are the True Innocents!
True Innocents Equine Rescue: www.tierrescue.org
Join us on Facebook!
Comment


Comment