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Disaster Preparedness for your horses

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  • #81
    timedjumpoff, I think one of the things that has some people concerned is that Iraq isn't the one making the terroristic threats against the US. So many people are equating Iraq with the Taliban & Al Queda - TWO different things, folks.

    Anyway, last year it was all about finding bin Laden and Mullah Omar. We haven't done that (yet - don't worry, boys, if you're lurking here on the COH boards - oh, we'll get you, not a doubt in my mind), so last year it was all about bin Laden & Mullah Omar and does Bush even mention them anymore? Nope. It's all about Saddam & Iraq now. Look, I believe Saddam is an awful man, and his sons are truly monsters, BUT unlike al Queda Iraq has not attacked us, and just like I can't kill my neighbor because he doesn't like me and threatens me, heck I cannot even kill my neighbor if he kills a family member of mine, can I? No, *if I am responding to an actual, ongoing attack* I can, but if he kills one of mine, under law I cannot then go over there and simply kill him. A country CANNOT remove the leader of another sovereign nation just because we don't like him!

    Simply rephrase it and you'll see: Germany hates the President of France, so Germany has decided that a regime change is necessary and announces that they're going to take out Chirac.

    Vladimir Putin of Russia is NOT a nice guy. Ask the Chechens. In addition the Russians have truly been the biggest threat to the US in the past, they still have nuclear weapons, and they are blocking our plans for Iraq. The US announces that we are going to initiate a regime change in Russia and replace Putin with someone else.

    Comment


    • #82
      What I want to know is, why doesn't anyone talk openly about the Carter Doctrine anymore? It would spare us the insincere concern for oppressed people around the world. The Carter Doctrine has been an official, open tenet of US foreign policy since, well, since Carter.

      Comment


      • #83
        siyafunda: If we attack Iraq there will be increased terrorist attacks. A conventional war is not going to stop terrorism. You need special operations forces to stop terrorism.

        With that said, it is my opinion that this war has nothing to do with terrorism and everything to do with (1) correcting daddy's mistake, (2) keeping people's attention from the economy and (3) getting re-elected.

        "I thought I was dead once but it turns out, I was only in Nebraska."

        Comment


        • #84
          AnneFS; this is my problem with this war as well. Iraq has not threatened or attacked us! Yet many people think Al Qaeda, Osama, and Saddam are all one and the same. My question is, if the UN can't find the stockpiles of WMD now, how are we supposed to find it if we manage to get rid of Saddam? They could still (maybe even it's more likely) end up in the hands of Al qaeda.
          And Hobson; if you are in NY Saturday, stay warm. I was in DC for the protest in January, and the weather was just like it is now. Freezing.

          Comment


          • #85
            <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by siyafunda:
            Timedjumpoff and others who jumped in to agree with her - I have an honest question. What do you think about the fact that highly placed individuals WITHIN this administration (Tom Ridge for one) have warned that Americans will need to prepare themselve for MORE terrorist attacks if we attack Iraq?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

            I believe we will be attacked again whether we go in tonight at 6:00 p.m. or do nothing and draw back all our troops.

            To the radical Islamic person(groups) America represents social, religious and political systems(freedoms) that repulse them. Total control (power) over the Middle East by such groups is the one goal.

            This article provides an interesting summary: http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0...245025,00.html

            To make this horse related- I did purchase mega bags of grain yesterday as I expect the price to go up do to the outragous price of gasoline.

            SLW
            "It is I."

            Comment


            • #86
              <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Anne FS:
              timedjumpoff, I think one of the things that has some people concerned is that Iraq isn't the one making the terroristic threats against the US. So many people are equating Iraq with the Taliban & Al Queda - TWO different things, folks.

              Anyway, last year it was all about finding bin Laden and Mullah Omar. We haven't done that (yet - don't worry, boys, if you're lurking here on the COH boards - oh, we'll get you, not a doubt in my mind), so last year it was all about bin Laden & Mullah Omar and does Bush even mention them anymore? Nope. It's all about Saddam & Iraq now. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


              Anne, we haven't forgotten about binLaden and ultimately will get him. But Iraq has been funding al Queda for many years now and we have taken out many their leaders overseas. But they are literally all over the world. Besides, even without 9/11 as a reason, Iraq has continusously defied our/UN "UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER" agreement they signed after they were defeated in the Gulf War. Not to mention 17 other UN resolutions they've blatantly ignored since then, resulting in continued sanctions for which the Iraqi people have been made to suffer. Sadam threw out the UN inspectors in '98, yet another resolution ignored. We had 17 reasons to go after Iraq even before 9/11. Even Clinton made some futile attempts at bombing their factories.

              The only reason we have to do it now is because
              we followed the resolution of the UN in '91 and didn't finish the job. Unfortunately, that allowed Sadam to build up again and now we're paying the price. Where do you think al Queda is getting Weapons of Mass Destruction anyway? Just ask all the Iraqi scientists and engineers who managed to defect in the last few years. The ones who have quoted Sadam as saying if he'd had it, he would've used the nuclear bomb on the US years ago. The factories are buried miles below the ground, just like Sadam's bunkers. The UN is a joke and Sadam knows it.

              At least when we use smartbombs, we try to avoid known civilian targets, unlike Sadam who turns his own people into human targets by placing them in his military installations. If you think he's not another Hitler, just give him time. Sprechen zie Arabic? You might have to one day.

              Appeasement has never appeased a dictator, it just gives them reason/time to demand even more.
              "WHINNYING" IS EVERYTHING!!

              Comment


              • #87
                <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by timedjumpoff:
                But Iraq has been funding al Queda for many years now
                <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                Evidence, please.

                The crux of this whole issue is there is no concrete evidence of Iraq funding al Queda. The British intelligence report even concluded that bin Laden and Iraq tried for an alliance in the 90s and it all fell apart mainly because of the strong secular nature of Saddam's regime - SH has absolutely no interest in a no-smoking, no drinking, etc. society.

                So, maybe he is, maybe he isn't, but there is NO EVIDENCE of it and you can't just say that it's so.

                Now, you are right in that Iraq has repeatedly violated UN sanctions and that the UN is very much in a put up or shut up situation now, and sadly, it looks like they are wimping out. HOWEVER, we must stick to facts here - yes, Iraq has not complied with sanctions, no, no one has proof of a collaboration with al Queda, and therefore we cannot simply go in there and take him out.

                Like our whole equestrian NGB issue, no matter our personal feelings and wishes, we MUST stick to facts, whether we like them or not. I think Saddam is bad news and wouldn't mind if he & his dropped off the face of the earth tonight, in fact, I believe the world would be a better place, but as a good, proud American I am NOT going to silently stand by and watch my own proud country resort to unethical means to take him out.

                Comment


                • #88
                  <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Anne FS:

                  Did you mean to say this? It certainly *is* possible to dislike/distrust Iraq and at the same time disagree with the Bush admin. Otherwise you're saying that if we disagree with anything Bush does that means we're on Iraq's side, which of course is silly.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                  Not; I left out a negative. Insufficient supply of that lovely Arab contribution to civilization--coffee.

                  Unashamed member of the Arab clique...just settin' on the Group W bench.
                  "It's like a Russian nesting doll of train wrecks."--CaitlinandTheBay

                  ...just settin' on the Group W bench.

                  Comment


                  • #89
                    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Anne FS:
                    The crux of this whole issue is there is no concrete evidence of Iraq funding al Queda.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                    On the other hand, there is concrete evidence of the United States funding and supplying weapons to both Hussein and bin Laden, back when it suited us. Who will impose sanctions on us?

                    Even one current alleged "connection" - that al Qaeda has a camp in northern Iraq - you know that the United States and the Iraqi Kurds actually control that part of Iraq, right?

                    For the record, I thought Hussein was a bad guy even when Americans were selling him weapons. I was glad when the US stopped him in Kuwait and when the US went into Afghanistan (I wish we'd finish our work there, BTW - at the moment we're not doing so well in making Afghan lives better.).

                    The analogy to Hitler doesn't wash. At the time the Hitler had a mighty army, one of the mightiest in the world. Hussein's army is small, and while an annoying threat, it is not even the mightiest in its small region.
                    If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket

                    Comment


                    • #90
                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by poltroon:

                      The analogy to Hitler doesn't wash.
                      <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      Another reason the Hitler analogy doesn't wash is that Hitler wasn't just sitting there being creepy. The mistake was that no move was made to stop Hitler when he annexed the Sudetenland, iow, the world allowed Hitler to invade, to take, other places. When Iraq invaded Kuwait, we moved. No problem. If Iraq invades someone again, we move again. As long as Iraq is sitting there being a pill to its own people we can't logically go in. First the USA railed that we should attack because Iraq wouldn't let the inspectors in. Well, the inspectors are in. So now we have to find something else to attack about. The hope is that the inspectors will find something concrete. Until then, we are on thin ice with justifications.

                      Comment


                      • #91
                        While we moved when Kuwait was threatened, we did not move when Iraq tried to invade Iran. Iran defeted his army, however it proves that he has ambitions. And it is obvious that during the past years his ambitions have not changed. He moved on these two wars withen 30 years of each other, each time on his neighbors.

                        Another point to put out is that the people of Germany supported Hitler, very few people in Iraq willingly support Hussein. He rules by terror and the people want him out.

                        "Because contrary to the wisdom of the bumper sticker,
                        it is not enough these days to simply QUESTION AUTHORITY.
                        You have to speak with it, too"--Taylor Mali
                        Hanlon's Razor

                        Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

                        Comment


                        • #92
                          <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Tootsie:
                          While we moved when Kuwait was threatened, we did not move when Iraq tried to invade Iran<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
                          Not only did we not "move on him" we gave him money and weapons to fight Iran.

                          [This message was edited by maggymay on Feb. 14, 2003 at 07:16 PM.]

                          Comment


                          • #93
                            It's gotten to the point I WANT another attack on the USA. It's the only way to shut up the "it's just a warning for political reasons" people.

                            Did you ever think that a higher state of alert may HAVE ALREADY stopped an attack. No I guess not.

                            bin laden+saddam+.50 BMG= I'm happy.

                            Comment


                            • #94
                              <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by maggymay:
                              <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sallylou:I have had the luck in my short life to have lived/visited many places around the world, some that were free, many that were not and I have to believe that the people in countries that have no freedom need us to help them out...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
                              Have you ever been to Chile after Allende was ousted? Or Panama? Or Greece in the 50s and 60s?
                              I'm sure the people on the street were _thrilled_ about the "help"
                              <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                              My mother grew up in Panama during that time. What I've heard of that period of time, (besides the radicals, of course, who were busy setting off bombs in public places where Americans were) from someone who was there, is that the majority of people were quite happy with having the Americans there.

                              But that's all irrelavent to this thread. Just a small piece of information I would like to interject, to say that while I don't think that we should just go into every nation and free them all so they can be just like us -most of these countries have absolutely no idea how to live free.. they end up better off the way they were before we decided to get involved- (because gee.. that would be something like.. pushing OUR beliefs upon another country? Hmm.. ), not all of the places we have gone into have been worse off because of it.

                              As for the terror alerts and what my emergency plans are...
                              Duct tape is going to be saved for absesses and other needs such as that... The plastic will be saved for use for covering hay.. Same ole' Same ole..

                              The fact that terrorism and war are happening and are possibilities are very very real to me- my uncle and 2 of my cousins have already been called up and are awaiting deployment. I know that no one is going to target my little corner of the world- Hot Springs, Arkansas isn't exactly a threat to much of anyone, unless you don't like hot water..- but if it happens, it happens.. We'll all go..

                              Like we had to do after 9/11-- Keep on Keepin' On, everyone.

                              ________
                              Sarah

                              "Half the failures in life arise from pulling in one's horse as he is leaping."~ Julius Hare
                              ________
                              Sarah
                              formerly known as Alohamora
                              \"Half the failures in life arise from pulling in one\'s horse as he is leaping.\"~ Julius Hare

                              Comment


                              • #95
                                <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Anne FS:
                                The British intelligence report even concluded that bin Laden and Iraq tried for an alliance in the 90s and it all fell apart <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                and this is good news??

                                bin Laden also tried unsuccessfully to knock down the World Trade Centre in the 1990's.

                                Saddam promised terrorist acts in 1991 when we kicked him out of Kuwait and he delivered. Link or not, he's an unabashed terrorist.

                                Comment


                                • #96
                                  <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Elghund2:
                                  siyafunda: If we attack Iraq there will be increased terrorist attacks. A conventional war is not going to stop terrorism. You need special operations forces to stop terrorism.

                                  With that said, it is my opinion that this war has nothing to do with terrorism and everything to do with (1) correcting daddy's mistake, (2) keeping people's attention from the economy and (3) getting re-elected.

                                  "I thought I was dead once but it turns out, I was only in Nebraska."<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


                                  Bravo Elghund..........
                                  A war is not going to solve everything, we can't just can't start "blowing" countries away.
                                  With war comes severe consequences, it should be properly thought out and strategically planned.
                                  If we had done it "right" the first time, we wouldn't be in this position!

                                  Comment


                                  • #97
                                    I hope I'm not the only one that sees the irony in the violence that's happening in the anti-war protests.

                                    Just because I have a short attention span doesn't mean I
                                    Just because I have a short attention span doesn\'t mean I

                                    Comment


                                    • #98
                                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Totallynuts:
                                      It's gotten to the point I WANT another attack on the USA. It's the only way to shut up the "it's just a warning for political reasons" people.

                                      Did you ever think that a higher state of alert may HAVE ALREADY stopped an attack. No I guess not.

                                      bin laden+saddam+.50 BMG= I'm happy. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                      NO, TOTALLYNUTS, you're not totaly nuts in saying that. In fact the day after 9/11, I heard one "official" predict that despite the nationwide/worldwide shock and horror, in 6 months people would have gone back to their lives and all but forgotten it. He said, it would take a 2nd attack to convince the Americans that they would never again be safe unless terrorism around the world was permanently contained/eliminated.

                                      This is a snake with hundreds of heads.
                                      Cut off one, and there's always another ready to take its place. Looks as though his words may come true.

                                      TRICKPONY, you're right, we didn't finish the job in '91. You can thank the UN RESOLUTION we agreed to follow for that.

                                      "Unofficial founder of the underground KLUTZ KLIQUE"
                                      "WHINNYING" IS EVERYTHING!!

                                      Comment


                                      • #99
                                        Here's a nice little tidbit from the Washington Post:

                                        <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
                                        That most lamentable duct tape suggestion last week by a Homeland Security official -- which drove countless panicked citizens out to buy the product -- has been widely derided as useless and pretty crazy.

                                        But maybe not so crazy. Turns out that nearly half -- 46 percent to be precise -- of the duct tape sold in this country is manufactured by a company in Avon, Ohio. And the founder of that company, that would be Jack Kahl, gave how much to the Republican National Committee and other GOP committees in the 2000 election cycle? Would that be more than $100,000?

                                        <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                        That said, I'm embarrased to say I bought duct tape recently - but not because I think it will help me against terrorists. I'm using it to hold the Universe together. Oh, and a horse blanket.
                                        If you are allergic to a thing, it is best not to put that thing in your mouth, particularly if the thing is cats. - Lemony Snicket

                                        Comment


                                        • &lt;BUMP&gt;

                                          Now here's something worth buying that's a little more promising than duct tape: NEW FULLY-FUNCTIONAL MILITARY ISSUE ADULT GAS MASKS.

                                          www.sportsmansguide.com (see GOVERNMENT SURPLUS section)

                                          They may be out of them when you check but they get new inventory every day. When I last looked they offered various models with air filters up to 3 hours: Russian/Israeli/Swedish (yes, Swedish!) and British-made, in prices ranging from $20 -$70 .

                                          CAVEAT EMPTOR: Read the descriptions carefully. Some of them say "don't count on it to filter air" - you guessed it--that would be the Swedish one. Looks like you could strap some of them onto your horses, though the filter looks as if it would be kind of heavy for the horses to lug around, but no heavier than those strap-on feed bags you might've seen.

                                          This website is VERY good (dependable service/fast shipping/easy returns). Lots of other "non-Military" products (outdoor gear/clothing/jewelry/electronics/ etc.) also available at great prices. No duct tape though!



                                          "Unofficial founder of the underground KLUTZ KLIQUE"
                                          "WHINNYING" IS EVERYTHING!!

                                          Comment

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