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A VERY unscientific poll, Bush or Kerry?

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  • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> The most important issue here is homeland security and safety from terrorist attacks. The rest of the issues don't matter if we're paralyzed by others. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Okay -- I really don't generally like to get into this argument because it sounds paranoid and that is really unlike me.

    However -- do you really believe the statement above?

    Al Qaeda has attacked in 3+ year cycles -- WTC#1 -- 1993, Khobar Towers (if you count that -- it wasn't US but it was a US embassy) 1996, WTC and Pentagon, 2001.

    The fact that we have *not* been attacked since 9/11 don't mean squat. W isn't necessarily keeping us any safer than Jerry Springer.

    Comment


    • wow - just wow - what a great discussion
      Nothing says "I love you" like a tractor. (Clydejumper)

      The reports states, “Elizabeth reported that she accidently put down this pony, ........, at the show.”

      Comment


      • Think you forgot the USS Cole.. October 12, 2000. To think that they only want to attack every 3 years is quite foolish.

        Before you go off thinking you are safe, you better look at this site listing suspected attacks...

        al-qaeda attacks
        Love my Northampton CANTER Cutie - Cessna

        Comment


        • cessna - that list syncs up with all that I know about Al Quaida attacks, and our own state department reported that 2003 was the worst year for terrorism attacks, so there is no reason to think this stuff is infrequent.

          Sadly, I don't think the vast majority of terrorist masterminds were sucked into the flypaper logic that they should go to Iraq to have a little terrorism party. I think your average terrorist is way smarter and more craven than that. I think they are perfectly happy to let local insurgents steal unprotected explosives and blow everybody and their brother up. I think they are perfectly happy to train new recruits all over the world to blow up people and places.

          Sadly, I think we have unwittingly helped them far more than we have hurt them when we look at the long term picture.

          On a much more alarming note, I think if we don't find a way to reach common ground and agreement with the vast majority of nuclear states on this planet, and get the IAEA more fully involved/partnered with our clout, we aren't going to be dealing with terrorists with planes. It's going to be a lot more serious than that.

          Honesty, this administration befuddles me with their "go it alone" attitude. I can appreciate that the neocon doctrine doesn't like internationalism and the global environment, but that strikes me as pointless as not liking the ocean because it has salty water. Oh well. Get over it and cope, because at the end of the day you NEED the ocean. Ditto for behaving living in the global scene.
          Your crazy is showing. You might want to tuck that back in.

          Comment


          • Those of us who support Bush, Small Business and Farms know why we support him. At this point it's rather childish to try and convince the Kerry people who must also believe in the Easter Bunny, Santa's elves and a free lunch.

            Essentially the lines between the parties have been pretty simple. The Republicans and they do support Bush have confidence in their ability to earn a living and have no intention or expectation they will be on the dole and supported by the government.

            The Democrats who support Kerry believe that they might need help and might be needy of the services of a large government. Big government and small people is their base. They do not believe in education because their voter base is essentially the uneducated, unemployed and urban centers.

            The flip flop king even beats Bill Clinton at least Clinton followed polls to find out what he believed. This Vietnam hero went to Congress and testified against his own buddies and declared that our army was guilty of horrors against humanity. Yep! that's the guy I want for my Commander-in-chief. We won't need an army because we'll be an occupied territory.

            I want someone to defend me who has a little more Chutzpah than that. There is an interesting new book out which supposes what might have happened if Charles Lindbergh had been elected President. Charles Lindbergh was the founding father of the "America First Party".

            This is not a new philosophy it's an old one that has been rejected time and time again. Why are we not popular in the world because we are the rich Uncle who won't give them the money they think they deserve. Do I think we need the approval of France and Germany to decide when, against who and how to defend this country NO! But then I'm part of the World War II generation that remembers first hand how the French appeased the Nazi machine.

            Do I need the approval of Germany to decide who, what and how to defend America NO! I am not in favor of a world government but I am in favor of a global economy. The Germans proved to me they weren't too bright when they believed Adolph Hitler when he said the Jews were belocated to pleasant vacation camps.

            If the spokesman for the Heinz money wants to talk about outsourcing then he ought to sit down and talk to his wife about how much of the Heinz products are manuafactured where labor is cheap.

            As to the intelligence of George W. well whenever did anyone in this country respect a candidate with brains. Everytime we've had an election between the down home dedicated candidate and the brilliant intellectual, the intellectual went down in flames. Kerry hasn't gone down in flames because all he's smart at is marrying rich women.

            Therefore we have a tied race! If George W. was the most brilliant man in the world he'd be smart enough to hide it because if you're smart you lose. We don't reward success in this country we pull it down. We'll knock a man or a company off it's pedestal so we can beat it up, then put it back on it's pedestal so we can pull it down again and it makes us feel good.

            If Kerry raises taxes and the economy shuts down and all that money is sent out of the country instead of being spent here what do you think will happen to horse farms? What do you think will happen to the bottom two thirds of this little world isolated and insulated from reality? The European horse world will boom. So will we all then follow our high performance riders to Europe to buy and compete?

            Raise taxes, destroy small business and the farms (they are small business) And all our horses will be from Europe because there will be no American Bred horses on American horse farms. There will be no Riding Schools and there will be no Private barns where you can board your horses.

            So if all you dreamers of the perfect world for yourselves don't care, what the h*** I'll make a fortune selling my 70 acres to a developer.

            This industry is under attack from the animal rights people who think we shouldn't have horses and we certainly shouldn't jump them its extreme cruelty, turn those babies loose in the new wilderness and let them fend for themselves. If they have their way we won't be in the Department of Agriculture so no Farmland tax discounts for us. Then if that doesn't knock us off our pedestal they will with the clean water solid waste management programs that want you to put your manure in plastic bags and truck it out to the land fill daily.

            So, if you want Kerry go for it, I'll die a rich old lady and I won't be horse poor anymore. Hey! kids don't need horses when they have soccer balls.
            http://www.usAHSA.org and http://www.noreinstatement.org

            Comment


            • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Snowbird:

              The Democrats who support Kerry believe that they might need help and might be needy of the services of a large government. Big government and small people is their base. They do not believe in education because their voter base is essentially the uneducated, unemployed and urban centers. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
              I would bet you good money that the majority of people voting for Kerry are both wealthier* and better educated than those voting for Bush.

              *Excluding multi-millionaire oil barons of course

              Comment


              • Yeah! right that's why they are voting to pay more taxes.Someone said Kerry pays only 13% well then the rest of us poor slobs are stupid because we're paying 30%. Do you belive Mrs. Heinz wants to pay 30% instead? Tsk! Tsk you can't win that bet.

                Yep! all those rich folks are standing in line and they can't wait to support Kerry so he can bump up their taxes. They've all probably already moved all their money out of the country just in case Kerry does get elected.

                Tell me is there anyone who knows someone who makes a lot of money, like the CEO's getting millions in salary and benefits, is there even one that you know who says sure! I've been cheating the government for years. I only owe 13% but this country has been so good to me can't I give you another 20% just because you need it?

                No way! they're donating that 20% to both political parties to hedge their bets and buy power and access.
                http://www.usAHSA.org and http://www.noreinstatement.org

                Comment


                • My Reasons for voting Kerry in no particular order:

                  health care
                  women's issues
                  education
                  iraq/homeland security
                  the economy & jobs
                  Environment

                  I never voted for Bush to begin with and he scares the hell out of me. The blunders with Iraq are ridiculous. The fact that we potentially will have 3 spots to fill on the Supreme Court in the next 4 years also worries me.
                  Hopeful Farm Sport Horses
                  Midwest Breeders Group
                  Follow me on Twitter
                  Join me on Facebook

                  Comment


                  • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by silver:
                    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Snowbird:

                    The Democrats who support Kerry believe that they might need help and might be needy of the services of a large government. Big government and small people is their base. They do not believe in education because their voter base is essentially the uneducated, unemployed and urban centers. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
                    I would bet you good money that the majority of people voting for Kerry are both wealthier* and better educated than those voting for Bush.

                    *Excluding multi-millionaire oil barons of course <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                    I'll take that bet!!!
                    Love my Northampton CANTER Cutie - Cessna

                    Comment


                    • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by silver:
                      I would bet you good money that the majority of people voting for Kerry are both wealthier* and better educated than those voting for Bush.
                      <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      I totally DISAGREE. Not sure where you got that idea, but just from the people I know, and who've told me who they are voting for, you've got it backwards (in my area anyway!).

                      Hopeful Farm Sport Horses
                      Midwest Breeders Group
                      Follow me on Twitter
                      Join me on Facebook

                      Comment


                      • Yeah, sure Silver I'm just some ignrant redneck Idjit from Switzerland...who speaks four languages, shows on the A circuit and owns 13 horses. Keep telling yourself that!!!
                        visit us at www.levremont.com

                        Comment


                        • I have a random question for people who still support Bush...

                          Does it not bother you that he restricts access to his rallies/campaign speeches by requiring that all attendees sign a pledge to vote for him before they're allowed inside? What about the citizens who wanted to hear both candidates speak so they could more thoughtfully weigh their decision?
                          ---------------------------

                          Comment


                          • Plus: isn't that illegal to make someone tell you how they're going to vote and to ask them to sign a pledge?

                            Comment


                            • WildBlue: did you hear the news about a class of students who were sent to a rally as part of a class assignment??? THEY WERE REFUSED entrance because they were not all Bush supporters, and these were 17 year old kids that don't even get to vote. That certainly leaves a bad taste in my mouth for our president.

                              I put out the Kerry signs last week. Even my husband, die hard Rep, is voting Kerry. Not that he likes him much, but he has become so disgusted with Bush and how he has made Americans MORE of a target with his trying to rule the world he is looking at farmland in Costa Rica!
                              Beth Davidson
                              Black Dog Farm Connemaras & Sport Horses
                              http://blackdogconnemara.com
                              visit my blog: http://ponyeventer.blogspot.com

                              Comment


                              • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>The Democrats who support Kerry believe that they might need help and might be needy of the services of a large government. Big government and small people is their base. They do not believe in education because their voter base is essentially the uneducated, unemployed and urban centers. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                Hey Snowbird - pssst - you're wrong. Many of the Democrats pay taxes in the highest bracet, are very highly educated & employed at the highest levels. We just happen to support a lot of the things that the Democratic party advocates. So be careful with those sweeping generalizations. You what what they say about assuming

                                Oh & just so we're clear - Bush has actually increased both the size & spending of government. from the non-partisan Congressional Budget Office:

                                Overall Bush spending increase, 2002 through 2004: $441 billion, or 23.7 percent.

                                Overall discretionary spending increase under Bush, 2002 through 2004: $209 billion, or 10.5 percent annually.
                                Visit us on Facebook at www.facebook.com/ranchopampa or our website at www.ranchopampa.com

                                Comment


                                • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by silver:
                                  Plus: isn't that illegal to make someone tell you how they're going to vote and to ask them to sign a pledge? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                  I don't think you have to tell them how you are going to vote, but you have to provide proof you are a registered republican, sign a loyalty oath and surrender your first born male child. But I think you can vote how you like. As long as you don't want that child back.

                                  But isn't that one of the scariest things out there? Here we have a president who doesn't ever hold press conferences, is good for one highly scripted SOTU address per year and very little else, and the only way a person can get access to hear him speak is to sign a loyalty oath.

                                  I don't care what party he is affiliated with. That's offensive in a democracy.
                                  Your crazy is showing. You might want to tuck that back in.

                                  Comment


                                  • Found this at another forum and thought it was interesting:

                                    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Look at this interesting report:

                                    http://www.pipa.org/OnlineReports/Pr...rt10_21_04.pdf

                                    The first part of the report shows that Kerry and Bush supporters live in two different "realities." Each set of supporters believes a fundamentally different set of statements is true about the most import issues, like: Were there WMDs in Iraq? Did Iraq support al Qaeda?

                                    The second part is really telling: Most people that support Bush do not really know what his stances are on issues! For example: Bush opposes labor and environmental standards in trade agreements, but only 13% of Bush supporters know that!

                                    What does this mean? There can be two explanations:

                                    One is that some people that support Bush are doing so in error. They are misinformed about Bush's policies, and would (theoretically) not support him if they knew more about them.

                                    Another is that some people "blindly" support Bush (maybe just an emotional, irrational thing), and do so without being aware of what he supports and opposes. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


                                    Comment


                                    • Urban legends abound here....

                                      However, take a look at the conventions - at the Democratic convention, protesters were literally caged up in an area away from the convention. Republican convention had no such "Holding area"...
                                      Love my Northampton CANTER Cutie - Cessna

                                      Comment


                                      • The so-called "terror alerts" have been played up to the hilt in this country, and interestingly enough, every time Bush and his policies have been criticized. See "Timeline of Terror Alerts" here:
                                        http://juliusblog.blogspot.com/2004_...56476570482138

                                        I used to sit back and say to people, "How much do you want to bet that in the next day or so, the bin Laden videotape is going to magically appear again?" And sure enough, the next day the headlines would show a picture of bin Laden with some blurb about the video. Then the news shows would report that our country's terror alert level was now at orange or something ridiculous. And it was always on the heels of Bush's actions being criticized!

                                        I don't know if any of you have read this interview with Noam Chomsky:

                                        "It's Extremely Easy to Frighten People":

                                        http://www.chomsky.info/interviews/20021018.htm

                                        It's an old interview from 2002, but as Chomsky explains:

                                        <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>It's extremely easy to frighten people -- it's hard to explain to them, to get people to understand that the fear is manufactured. ... When Rumsfeld gets up on television and says we have definitive intelligence that al Qaeda is working with Iraq, how is an ordinary citizen supposed to react? They won't tell you the evidence, and when anyone asks, they say, "Well, you know: It's secret. ... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                        In my opinion, the American public has been manipulated by the present administration every step of the way, and it's very disheartening to see.

                                        Comment


                                        • <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CessnaPilot:
                                          <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by silver:
                                          <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Snowbird:

                                          The Democrats who support Kerry believe that they might need help and might be needy of the services of a large government. Big government and small people is their base. They do not believe in education because their voter base is essentially the uneducated, unemployed and urban centers. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
                                          I would bet you good money that the majority of people voting for Kerry are both wealthier* and better educated than those voting for Bush.

                                          *Excluding multi-millionaire oil barons of course <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                          I'll take that bet!!! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                          This just reminded me of Jon Stewart last night... they had a clip of one of the NASCAR drivers who supports Bush and he was like "Well when Bush shakes your hand he looks you in the eye like a real man... I mean I don't really care about the issues" then they made a funny comment, something along the lines of "that's what you'd expect from someone who spend their entire life driving around in circles" Unfortunatly I think most of Bush's supporters have the exact same attitude. I know my roomate does, when I asked her why she was voting for Bush she said "he's just so cute, he's like a teddy bear" um, yeah, a teddy bear that starts wars for no reason...

                                          Comment

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