• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

Credible threats of suicide will be reported to the police along with identifying user information at our disposal, in addition to referring the user to suicide helpline resources such as 1-800-SUICIDE or 1-800-273-TALK.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 2/8/18)
See more
See less

A Must Read about Slaughter hot off the press

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #41
    And to Snowbird, all polititions care about is votes. If a letter is long winded and full of confusing language, the interns are going to make assumptions and send out the form letter.

    It's disgusting... but then Washington is pretty disgusting too. I'm as outraged as you are.
    Power to the People

    Comment


    • #42
      Thank you SafeHorses. . . well said.
      bryn

      Comment


      • #43
        <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sswor:
        <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">But you would send one of your horses to slaughter if you wanted to put it down? If so, why? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

        What the hell are you talking about???????? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

        Just want to know if you'd send one of your well taken care of horses to slaughter. That's what I am talking about.
        Until they are safe.
        www.safehorses.org

        Comment


        • #44
          That is an untrue presumption! I do believe in the right of individuals to make their own choices. I don't believe you have the right to tell me what I can or cannot do!

          If someone finds themselves in an unfortunate place like homeless or ill and there is no one who wants a horse and they cannot afford the costs they have the right to make a decision that suits them. If someone has a dangerous horse they cannot sell because someone may be injured they have a right to make their own choice.

          My vote is for the right to choose what is in the best interests of me, my family and my animals.I don't know of any creature that warrants a life with no quality.

          Government has the right to intervene in cases of cruelty and abuse not to take property without due process.

          I am not certain that the long range effect will not be harmful to the environment. I am not certain that filling the landfill with the rotting carcasses of horses that have been chemically destroyed is better for the environment. I am not certain that it is more important to feed and care for unwanted horses more than we care for unwanted children and adults.

          I wish I was as sure as you are that this will solve all the problems. I don't think so, I think the water will be polluted by the leaching of the huge amount of chemicals from the horse carcasses. If instead foreigners consider this meat good then we are a farm product and the income supports our economy the horse doesn't deserve a better place than an Angus beef Steer, or goats, sheep, lambs, pigs and chickens.

          It sounds pretty and it makes you feel good but in my humble opinion it is neither logical nor rational.
          http://www.usAHSA.org and http://www.noreinstatement.org

          Comment


          • #45
            <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Snowbird:

            <span class="ev_code_red">OUR POINT was that the Senate of the United States was going to given erroneous information as if it was truth. These elected legislators either don't read their mail or don't care or have employed staff members who can't read to sort it for them. </span>

            We do not agree and that is our right, and it is our right that the legislature comprehends that and understands that we are NOT in support of this Law they sponsor.

            As horse people who live by this industry and to care for our horses we have a right to differ and we donot believe the Legislature has the right to interpret our letters differently.

            My personal concern is not that we disagree but rather that I not be counted as one in your midst. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

            That's rich Snowbird...you want to talk about erroneous information? Try the slaughter industry. They are completely dishonest and do what they do under cover because they know that the majority of Americans would be disgusted if they knew how they made their living. Did you actually read the article or are you just here to do your Pro-slaughter preaching?

            No one is stopping you from stating your opinion...drop the martyr stuff. We read what you write and we disagree with you. Stop pretending that you are being censored.
            Until they are safe.
            www.safehorses.org

            Comment


            • #46
              bryn....I agree with you 1000%. There are some horse owners that get rid of their horses for really stupid reasons, such as wrong color, or they are bored. I have heard people say they want a new horse cause their horse is to quiet/lazy. When something as simple as a little more training will take care of it. I have also seen where someone will just get mad of their horse and decide to get rid of it on a wim, and I think when that happens the horse has a higher chance of endeing up at a feedlot or some dealer that really don't give a hoot who buys the horse. Thenyou get the dealers who run their local ads in the paper advertising to buy horses and someone is in a crunch financially and the dealer / trader comes to their house pretending that they have the best interest of the horse in mind and promise to give it a good home, and turn around and sell to the slaughter house. I want to see horse slaughter stopped. There is nothing but deception surrounding horse slaughter, and I think that the people who want it to continue do have their own reasons why, and I don't think its for the wefare of the horses.

              Comment


              • #47
                <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SafeHorses:
                <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sswor:
                <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">But you would send one of your horses to slaughter if you wanted to put it down? If so, why? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                What the hell are you talking about???????? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


                Just want to know if you'd send one of your well taken care of horses to slaughter. That's what I am talking about. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                You tried to make it seem like I had said that and that is sneaky and underhanded.

                What part about them having a forever home did you not understand?

                What part about me never taking one to auction did you not get?

                I can afford euthanasia for all my pets. I see providing a dignified and painless end as my responsibility as a pet owner, and will do so when necessary. None of mine are going to slaughter, ever. EVER EVER EVER. Clear enough?

                Congratulations. You have reinforced my beliefs. Cemented and set in stone. Ugh.
                Power to the People

                Comment


                • #48
                  <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Snowbird:
                  That is an untrue presumption! I do believe in the right of individuals to make their own choices. I don't believe you have the right to tell me what I can or cannot do!

                  If someone finds themselves in an unfortunate place like homeless or ill and there is no one who wants a horse and they cannot afford the costs they have the right to make a decision that suits them. If someone has a dangerous horse they cannot sell because someone may be injured they have a right to make their own choice.

                  My vote is for the right to choose what is in the best interests of me, my family and my animals.I don't know of any creature that warrants a life with no quality.

                  Government has the right to intervene in cases of cruelty and abuse not to take property without due process.

                  I am not certain that the long range effect will not be harmful to the environment. I am not certain that filling the landfill with the rotting carcasses of horses that have been chemically destroyed is better for the environment. I am not certain that it is more important to feed and care for unwanted horses more than we care for unwanted children and adults.

                  I wish I was as sure as you are that this will solve all the problems. I don't think so, I think the water will be polluted by the leaching of the huge amount of chemicals from the horse carcasses. If instead foreigners consider this meat good then we are a farm product and the income supports our economy the horse doesn't deserve a better place than an Angus beef Steer, or goats, sheep, lambs, pigs and chickens.

                  It sounds pretty and it makes you feel good but in my humble opinion it is neither logical nor rational. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                  I don't object to a horse owner needing to euthanize one of their horses. I object to the brutal death sentance that slaughter is.

                  You go on and on about carcasses in the environment, but you have apparently missed the lawsuit filed by the city of Kaufman against the slaughter house in their city due to the pollution they cause with blood run off from the abbatoir and body parts that fall out of trucks onto city streets as they leave the site.

                  You need to better explain what you mean in your fourth paragraph...what are you talking about? No one is talking about grabbing property. If you wish to dispose of it, fine...just do it humanely.
                  Until they are safe.
                  www.safehorses.org

                  Comment


                  • #49
                    And if I don't disagree with your diagnosis but rather disagree with your treatment of the problem, that makes me what the enemy?
                    http://www.usAHSA.org and http://www.noreinstatement.org

                    Comment


                    • #50
                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sswor:
                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SafeHorses:
                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sswor:
                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">But you would send one of your horses to slaughter if you wanted to put it down? If so, why? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      What the hell are you talking about???????? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


                      Just want to know if you'd send one of your well taken care of horses to slaughter. That's what I am talking about. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      You tried to make it seem like I had said that and that is sneaky and underhanded.

                      What part about them having a forever home did you not understand?

                      What part about me never taking one to auction did you not get?

                      I can afford euthanasia for all my pets. I see providing a dignified and painless end as my responsibility as a pet owner, and will do so when necessary. None of mine are going to slaughter, ever. EVER EVER EVER. Clear enough?

                      Congratulations. You have reinforced my beliefs. Cemented and set in stone. Ugh. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                      Okay...good for you. I am glad to hear you wouldn't send one of your horses to slaughter. Just curious.

                      And you made up your mind about me before I ever responded to you. Stop pretending otherwise.
                      Until they are safe.
                      www.safehorses.org

                      Comment


                      • #51
                        What Snowbird is talking about (I think, excuse me if I'm incorrect), as part of this bill, if an owner sells a horse to someone who in turn sells it to slaughter, that original owner is subject to having all of their animals confiscated. The upkeep of the confiscated horses shall become the financial responsibility of said original owner.

                        Which means, dear reader, that if I sell a horse to Joe Shmoe, who then sells it to another party who ships it off to slaughter, the feds will come and take ALL of my horses AND I will have to pay whatever amount of money they say for as long as they feel like charging me. That's screwed up and very very scary to all of us in the industry.
                        Power to the People

                        Comment


                        • #52
                          <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sswor:
                          What Snowbird is talking about (I think, excuse me if I'm incorrect), as part of this bill, if an owner sells a horse to someone who in turn sells it to slaughter, that original owner is subject to having all of their animals confiscated. The upkeep of the confiscated horses shall become the financial responsibility of said original owner.

                          Which means, dear reader, that if I sell a horse to Joe Shmoe, who then sells it to another party who ships it off to slaughter, the feds will come and take ALL of my horses AND I will have to pay whatever amount of money they say for as long as they feel like charging me. That's screwed up and very very scary to all of us in the industry. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                          Oh really? Where does it say that? If I go to read that in the bill, where would I look?
                          Until they are safe.
                          www.safehorses.org

                          Comment


                          • #53
                            I gotta go to my office for a little while here. Here's the bill...can someone point out where it says that a person can be prosecuted for selling their horse to someone who then sells or gives it into slaughter? Seriously, I want to see where it says that. Thanks.

                            http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c109:H.R.503:
                            Until they are safe.
                            www.safehorses.org

                            Comment


                            • #54
                              Ok, I was refering to the old bill that was attempted in Illinois this past spring.

                              You all seem to be refering to a new bill that I was not familier with.

                              I think Snowbird was rtefering to this:

                              Authorizes the Secretary of Agriculture to detain for examination, testing, or the taking of evidence: (1) any horse at any horse show, horse exhibition, or horse sale or auction which is sore or which the Secretary has probable cause to believe is sore; and (2) any horse or other equine which the Secretary has probable cause to believe is being shipped, transported, moved, delivered, received, possessed, purchased, sold, or donated in violation of such prohibition.

                              Sorry I was confused to what bill was being refered to.
                              Power to the People

                              Comment


                              • #55
                                SafeHorses, thank you once again. You said it much better than I could.
                                bryn

                                Comment


                                • #56
                                  Do you ever notice that on CBER the horses going for slaughter are nice sweet well taken care of horses that for one reason of another ended up there, they aren't sick dangerous neglected horses......wierd hu? you'd think that if they can send out nearly EVERY horse EVERY time, that other rescues could follow suit? PERHAPS some are being to hasty....where is your faith in humanity....the glass is half full over here....
                                  *No horses to Slaughter Clique, Rossbacher Gamaholics Clique, International Velvet Movie Lovers Clique, Member of the Deep South Support Group, Confused Member of the \"What is BOSS??\" Cult..er..CLIQUE, PROUDEST MEMBER of the Irrelevant Posters Cliqu

                                  Comment


                                  • #57
                                    i sure as he*& wouldn't sell my sweet horse to some joe shmoe then.......*thinking hurts i know*
                                    *No horses to Slaughter Clique, Rossbacher Gamaholics Clique, International Velvet Movie Lovers Clique, Member of the Deep South Support Group, Confused Member of the \"What is BOSS??\" Cult..er..CLIQUE, PROUDEST MEMBER of the Irrelevant Posters Cliqu

                                    Comment


                                    • #58
                                      Simple curiosity, but as many here feel that slaughter is horrendous and inhumane...do any of you eat beef?
                                      Until slaughter is outright banned, why not try to educate the workers in the slaughter houses, look into better restraining chutes and help to encourage kill buyers to treat horses more humanely during their trip.
                                      IF I were a kill buyer, I would travel under the cover of darkness and load the sale horses as quick as possible to avoid the persecution that follows them. Until the government bans it, we could at least try to make it as quick and humane as possible.
                                      As as far as beef goes..if you are truely "anti slaughter" can I assume you all are vegans? It is not just horses that die an agonizing death!

                                      Comment


                                      • #59
                                        Actually, I am very concerned about how any livestock is treated on the way to slaughter and in the slaughterhouses themselves. The biggest thing I object to regarding horse slaughter is that the slaughter industry has not adapted it's tooling to make it a humane death. And yes, cows, chickens and pigs suffer too and I object to that as well. They all suffer when the industry puts number of animals slaughtered per hour above humane slaughter practices. Dominion is a very good source for information on this subject. Actually I think the article in the original post lists a couple of books at the end of the article to read for more information on slaughter.

                                        I am not a vegetarian, but after getting involved in this subject I sometimes think about it. These days my moral middle ground is to only buy meat from certified humane suppliers. Whole Foods only buys certified humane meat, so I buy from them. I don't think wanting to eat meat is a green light for agribusiness to treat animals as badly as they sometimes do.
                                        Until they are safe.
                                        www.safehorses.org

                                        Comment


                                        • #60
                                          <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">The captive bolt is a very efficent way to slaugher livestock it works 99% of the time first try with cattle. The problem with horses is the restraining chutes they need to be changed a great deal for horses. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                          Actually in the Washington Post article "They Die Piece by Piece" the slaughter industry targeted a 95% success rate and only 36% of the facilities audited even made that. 95% means 5 out of a hundred or 1 out of 20 are not rendered 'unconsious' on the first blow.
                                          http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=artic...ntId=A60798-2001Apr9

                                          Comment

                                          Working...
                                          X