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Can someone explain this to me?

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  • Originally posted by endorphins4u View Post
    Yes they are more compliant because and calmer because they just realised they aren't stronger then us and we could put them in their place anytime which you sometimes need with an animal 8-10 times our body weight....
    How can the realize something that isn't true?? I mean, horses are dumb, but they aren't that dumb.

    So I had a really nasty striker here. He took me down once when I was trying to sedate him to have his feet trimmed. So when it was time to have his coggins drawn, I drugged the living snot out of him (first orally over a concrete wall because he would strike maliciously even when handled aroung the face) and put him up in the stocks. He got his coggins pulled. I waited until the drugs wore off and then groomed him and pulled his mane in the stocks. I was hoping this would have the side effect of him realizing that I was stronger than him and striking didn't work. He was absolutely calm in the stocks and went back to his stall nicely. Hahaha. Wrong. When we took him to the TB yearling sale we had two of us on his head to lead him. We handed him over to the handler with the stern warning that he struck. Of course, that coming from a girl, the first thing the guy did was stand in front of the horse and straighten his forelock. Got struck.

    I got a call from the people who bought him. They're riding him around the shedrow. I asked how the managed to break him. They said they just had one person work with him every day and over time he stopped being so defensive and changed his attitude. By working with, I mean grooming, ground manners, going slow and setting up routines. All the stuff we should have done but didn't have time to do before the sale.

    When you have a horse with an engrained bad habit that they found WORKS (not a baby trying out new tricks), Dr. Time is the only solution. It's simply not practical to throw them down continually, nor is that what I think you are advocating. Because horses are creatures of habit, you have to create new, positive habits in order to break old ones. A one time or even two-five time 'trick' isn't going to resolve a habitual problem.

    Horses aren't so complicated that, when they do something evil they think "I am doing this because I am bigger and stronger than you" they are thinking "I am doing this because it WORKS". You have to prove, over time, that it doesn't. You can probably use dropping a horse as a tool, but it's not going to solve a habitual problem and certainly not because you're proving you have bigger balls than they do. (Which is moot in the case of a gelding or mare )

    No video today - rained all day. My big guy is going to nap another day.

    ~Adrienne

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Sandy M View Post
      And isn't it amazing that you and I and most of the people on this board can worm or mount or do any number of procedures or actions with our horses without the help of this marvelous technique? Despite the fact that we're idiots.


      It IS amazing.
      Last edited by Weatherford; Dec. 22, 2006, 04:50 AM.
      http://www.MyVirtualEventingCoach.com

      Comment


      • Yes...children, we can all do wonders with trained horses. I'd expect nothing less paying someone to do the hardwork..
        Man, I must have got the bargain of the century when I bought my guy at 11 months of age - I never *realized* he was already all trained! No wonder he was so easy to start under saddle and will line up to a mounting block and stand there for handicapped people to clamber onto him and lets me worm him in the pasture, no need for a halter or anything. No wonder he is safe in traffic and lets me pony rambunctious youngsters off him and comes when I call him and sticks his head in the bridle if I just hold it out.

        All this time I thought he did all these things because I was quietly and consistently training him - but now I realize that Endo must have flown into the breeder's one dark night before I bought him, and layed him down, and broke him in an hour.

        Had to have happened that way, otherwise there's no way an idiot like me could have trained him to do all the things he does, all by myself.

        Thanks Endo - I owe ya, buddy!

        Comment


        • It is rapidly NOT becoming the season to be jolly. If you people can't play nice, we might do worse than just shut this thread down. It's not like we haven't figured out the same group of posters always shows up in a starring role in a snipefest. We get that reasonable discourse appears to be beyond your grasp, but lay off the personal attacks. This applies to newbies as well!
          "Better dead than red?"

          Comment


          • He is still a jerk on his training methods though. That must be made clear.
            Last edited by Weatherford; Dec. 22, 2006, 04:53 AM.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by YoungFilly View Post
              He is still a jerk on his training methods though. That must be made clear.
              That I certainly agree with! I can see it's use possibly as last ditch efforts with a horse that is proving untrainable with other methods. But this horse in "Tantrum" apearred to be a green horse that frankly could have just been led. And if "dangerous" were a term to use for this horse by some...why did I never see it buck or rear? And why oh why was a door leading out of the riding area left open? I genuinely would love to see answers to those questions by endorphins.
              RIP Bo, the real Appassionato
              5/5/84-7/12/08

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Appassionato View Post
                That I certainly agree with! I can see it's use possibly as last ditch efforts with a horse that is proving untrainable with other methods. But this horse in "Tantrum" apearred to be a green horse that frankly could have just been led. And if "dangerous" were a term to use for this horse by some...why did I never see it buck or rear? And why oh why was a door leading out of the riding area left open? I genuinely would love to see answers to those questions by endorphins.
                It's a public training facility with about 400 horses working there everyday, you can't shut the door whenever you want..

                She was taken there so I had more space to work with because the roundpen backfired once she felt a wall on her butt..

                Leading made her back up worse because she didn't care what was behind her..

                She didn't buck or rear because backing up was her thang..

                Not all horse buck and rear and they can't mutlitask and switch from one to the other to ther next..they are only good at one or two of these tricks at the most..

                The first time she layed down was intentionable because she went down head first but most of the other were because her legs gave out from running backwards. Untrained horses haven't got the stamina to keep running back like that..
                http://www.myspace.com/pinkbitz
                http://www.youtube.com/endospink
                http://www.hybrid-horseman.com/

                Comment


                • It's a public training facility with about 400 horses working there everyday, you can't shut the door whenever you want.
                  Why not? People can't open and close things?

                  She was taken there so I had more space to work with because the roundpen backfired once she felt a wall on her butt..
                  Out of curiosity, what happened?

                  Leading made her back up worse because she didn't care what was behind her.
                  Ok, explain please? Most lead from the front/side...

                  She didn't buck or rear because backing up was her thang.
                  A fairly minor evil most would think.

                  Not all horse buck and rear and they can't mutlitask and switch from one to the other to ther next..they are only good at one or two of these tricks at the most.
                  Ok...? All she did was back up.

                  The first time she layed down was intentionable because she went down head first but most of the other were because her legs gave out from running backwards. Untrained horses haven't got the stamina to keep running back like that.
                  Ok, what does putting them down intentionally do? Physiologically, psychologically...?
                  RIP Bo, the real Appassionato
                  5/5/84-7/12/08

                  Comment


                  • I have just one question: Is this nitwit a colored sporthorse breeder in his spare time?
                    Congratulate me! My CANTER cutie is an honor student at Goofball University!

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by endorphins4u View Post
                      Yes...children, we can all do wonders with trained horses. I'd expect nothing less paying someone to do the hardwork..

                      Have you ever seen the ugly side of a horse..?

                      Yes I expect a good many of us have and have TRAINED them to not be that way. As did I. She's a sweetheart now but she was a royal monster when I got her. And I never ONCE even dreamed of a need to lay her down either much less make her pass out. Now she will do things because I ask her to and she trusts me, not because I broke her spirit or made her think she was dying at my hands...
                      Every mighty oak was once a nut that stood its ground.

                      Proud Closet Canterer! Member Riders with Fibromyalgia clique.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Chevalnoir View Post
                        Man, I must have got the bargain of the century when I bought my guy at 11 months of age - I never *realized* he was already all trained! No wonder he was so easy to start under saddle and will line up to a mounting block and stand there for handicapped people to clamber onto him and lets me worm him in the pasture, no need for a halter or anything. No wonder he is safe in traffic and lets me pony rambunctious youngsters off him and comes when I call him and sticks his head in the bridle if I just hold it out.

                        All this time I thought he did all these things because I was quietly and consistently training him - but now I realize that Endo must have flown into the breeder's one dark night before I bought him, and layed him down, and broke him in an hour.

                        Had to have happened that way, otherwise there's no way an idiot like me could have trained him to do all the things he does, all by myself.

                        Thanks Endo - I owe ya, buddy!
                        LOL

                        Maybe he flies around like Santa and his sleigh?
                        Every mighty oak was once a nut that stood its ground.

                        Proud Closet Canterer! Member Riders with Fibromyalgia clique.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by endorphins4u View Post

                          Not all horse buck and rear and they can't mutlitask and switch from one to the other to ther next..they are only good at one or two of these tricks at the most..

                          Oh, I beg to differ dear, they have plenty of tricks in their bags...keep talking, this is hilarious.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by tbtrailrider View Post
                            Oh, I beg to differ dear, they have plenty of tricks in their bags...keep talking, this is hilarious.
                            I too have seen them acquire "skills" when trying to evade. Especially the "thinkers".
                            RIP Bo, the real Appassionato
                            5/5/84-7/12/08

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Appassionato View Post
                              Why not? People can't open and close things?
                              [quote=Appassionato;2080394]Can somebody break that down for this chick ? Shutting the door would stop PAYING people from working their horse and they would be P'ed

                              Originally posted by Appassionato View Post
                              Out of curiosity, what happened?
                              I know your just trying to pick this to pieces but for those who wanna know, she ran back until the wall stopped her and any pressure to get her to come off only made her rear against the wall...

                              Originally posted by Appassionato View Post
                              Ok, explain please? Most lead from the front/side...
                              She was on the wall and pulling on the head collar only made her fight more...yes you saw her leading but she wouldn't take one step with a rider on her , I get off she leads fine, get on she stop...only fillies do that crap ....

                              Originally posted by Appassionato View Post
                              A fairly minor evil most would think.
                              Did you see me panic...? I had her number

                              Originally posted by Appassionato View Post
                              Ok...? All she did was back up.
                              Watch it again...geez is there an echo in here or what..

                              Originally posted by Appassionato View Post
                              Ok, what does putting them down intentionally do? Physiologically, psychologically...?
                              It was her intetion not mine..she was doing that..not me
                              Last edited by Weatherford; Dec. 22, 2006, 04:56 AM. Reason: unnecessary comment
                              http://www.myspace.com/pinkbitz
                              http://www.youtube.com/endospink
                              http://www.hybrid-horseman.com/

                              Comment


                              • [quote=endorphins4u;2080490]
                                Originally posted by Appassionato View Post



                                I get off she leads fine, get on she stop...only fillies do that crap ....



                                and with that statement..I vote shut down this thread and boot this arse hole.

                                Who's with me ?
                                Last edited by Weatherford; Dec. 22, 2006, 04:56 AM.

                                Comment


                                • [QUOTE=tbtrailrider;2080675]
                                  Originally posted by endorphins4u View Post


                                  and with that statement..I vote shut down this thread and boot this arse hole.

                                  Who's with me ?

                                  Eh, tbtrailrider, I long ago learned that men who think that way have simply never learned the right way to use the tools in their shed, iffn you know what I mean.

                                  In other words, they tend to blame the plumbing rather than the plumber.

                                  Such a viewpoint causes much less damage to the would-be stud muffin's ego. And I would bet this one wears a big hat to cover the lack of steer.
                                  Congratulate me! My CANTER cutie is an honor student at Goofball University!

                                  Comment


                                  • [QUOTE=tbtrailrider;2080675]
                                    Originally posted by endorphins4u View Post


                                    and with that statement..I vote shut down this thread and boot this arse hole.

                                    Who's with me ?

                                    Oh chill out..

                                    How can you take anything in this thread seriously...
                                    http://www.myspace.com/pinkbitz
                                    http://www.youtube.com/endospink
                                    http://www.hybrid-horseman.com/

                                    Comment


                                    • endorphins, I'm very curious about the training facility in the "tantrum" video - could you tell me more about it? Where is it?

                                      Thanks
                                      "My friends, love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we'll change the world." ~ Jack Layton

                                      Comment


                                      • Originally posted by hitchinmygetalong View Post
                                        endorphins, I'm very curious about the training facility in the "tantrum" video - could you tell me more about it? Where is it?

                                        Thanks
                                        Japan

                                        I've gotta grand tour movie comming up soon ok..
                                        http://www.myspace.com/pinkbitz
                                        http://www.youtube.com/endospink
                                        http://www.hybrid-horseman.com/

                                        Comment


                                        • Closed
                                          "Better dead than red?"

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