Sexual harrassment by barn help

[ESG]

Why is it that anytime someone's culture is mentioned, it's seen as unimportant? I haven't assumed he's Latino. He probably is, since most barn workers who aren't American seem to be. But he could be French, Italian, Muslim, etc. I don't think anyone has said anything about him being Latino, so it seems that you're the one making assumptions. The truth is, in a lot of cultures, being a "creep" IS okay. In a lot of cultures, women are useful only for sex and are seen as having no rights. My best friend in junior high was black. Her family and mine were culturally different. My sister's best friend is Mexican. Our family is culturally different from hers. It's just fact. It's not necessarily a bad thing. In some ways, yes, it is. But in others, it's wonderful. However, in this situation, his culture is relevant to how he thinks and perceives things done by women and what he can get away with in women. It has nothing to do with "stupid white folk" being prejudiced. I wish the PC movement had never come about. Call a spade a spade.

You go, girl.

[ProzacPuppy]

I would have told the Barn Owner, the clown doing the obnoxious "macho" behavior and my husband - in no particular order. (Husband is ex football, 6'4 and 250 with a temper too. Might be amusing.)

Are you thinking that the BO or the help will "take it out on your pony"? The help should be fired and if not I would make it clear to the BO that should anything "untoward" happen to the pony that he would be held personally and professionally responsible. Maybe get it in writing and signed by all parties. The BO job is to keep his clients and their horses safe and relatively happy.

I would definitely advise the BO ASAP with the understanding that you are holding BO responsible for anything that might happen to the pony. And then shout it to the world, all the boarders should be aware of this guy.

Regarding the assumptions being made as to the ethnicity of the man in question, while some cultures do have different cultural values for women by and large I've been amazed at how chivalrous, courtly and sweet all the Latino barn help has been to my daughter. When she first started working at barns and esp at shows I was extremely worried about her being alone in the big show barns at 11 pm with only the other grooms. (She's young, thin, cute but has very little modesty I'm afraid and is often seen hauling shavings or such with her thong hanging out and a sweaty tank top). I was very afraid that she'd have problems. As it turned out, most of the grooms not only called her "senorita" but also refused to let her haul heavy hay bales, wheelbarrows of shavings etc. and did those jobs for her without being asked, without anything in it for them. Sometimes they've offered to share a few beers after hours with her but generally they are too "careful" to ask the "senorita" to join them. At one show she ended up getting a huge pile of hay bales dropped on her and was buried until a nearby groom rescued her. All afternoon different grooms or barn owners kept asking our trainer how she was and he of course was baffled until one owner told him about the accident. One night when a horse got cast daughter just had to stay out of the way and the grooms from other barns handled the situation.

Not only has she never had a problem with any of the grooms but they have renewed my faith that chivalry is not dead.

Being obnoxious and making overt sexual passes is a guy thing, not a racial or ethnic thing I think.

[pAin't_Misbehavin']

If I were you, I'd find a place to stash the pony at least temporarily. I say this because you're worried - you've brought it up twice - so if something happens to your pony over this you'll spend a long time beating yourself up unless you do all you can to protect the pony. Abusive men often use their victim's animals as targets. I reckon it's also possible this man might try to get back at you through your pony.

Line up alternate accomodations first, then tell the BO. She will probably fire his sorry butt on the spot, so you'll need to be able to whisk your pony away right then. If she doesn't fire him, then make other permanent arrangements for boarding your pony.

Either way you'll be rid of Prince Charmless.

Keep us posted and be careful!

[Sannois]

Susan

Come on!! Why are you not already at the barn owners house. Not another second can you let this slide. And take your hubby with you! Seriously girl, I would have handed the roses back to him and said, Thankyou but I cannot accept. And then I would have been at the barn owners the very next time he even batted an eye wrong. PLEASE IF this goes on much more and something worse happens you wont have a leg to stand on, they will question why you never said anything. It would be awful for me to even go out to the barn and have a pleasant ride. Please Girl, I am worried about you!

[Parysa]

Regarding the assumptions being made as to the ethnicity of the man in question, while some cultures do have different cultural values for women by and large I've been amazed at how chivalrous, courtly and sweet all the Latino barn help has been to my daughter. When she first started working at barns and esp at shows I was extremely worried about her being alone in the big show barns at 11 pm with only the other grooms. (She's young, thin, cute but has very little modesty I'm afraid and is often seen hauling shavings or such with her thong hanging out and a sweaty tank top). I was very afraid that she'd have problems. As it turned out, most of the grooms not only called her "senorita" but also refused to let her haul heavy hay bales, wheelbarrows of shavings etc. and did those jobs for her without being asked, without anything in it for them. Sometimes they've offered to share a few beers after hours with her but generally they are too "careful" to ask the "senorita" to join them. At one show she ended up getting a huge pile of hay bales dropped on her and was buried until a nearby groom rescued her. All afternoon different grooms or barn owners kept asking our trainer how she was and he of course was baffled until one owner told him about the accident. One night when a horse got cast daughter just had to stay out of the way and the grooms from other barns handled the situation.

Not only has she never had a problem with any of the grooms but they have renewed my faith that chivalry is not dead.

Being obnoxious and making overt sexual passes is a guy thing, not a racial or ethnic thing I think.

I think it's a little of both. I've had similar experiences as your daughter's with all of the Latino barn help I've ever been around. However, I am from an area with a high Mexican population and so I've seen both the good and the bad. And the bad is sometimes very, very bad. I went to apply for a job at a place where most of the Mexicans worked and was told that I would never be hired there b/c I was a white female and it wouldn't be safe. And sure enough, when I was walking out, I had almost every man I passed propositioning me. But on the flip side, one came up and asked if I would like him to walk me to my car. I thought he was just taking another tack, but he explained that he was just wanting to protect me and he did. Walking next to him, the other guys left me alone. He opened my car door for me, wished me a good day, and walked back to the building. So it goes both ways.

[MBPearls]

Okay, since we're into blanket stereotypes:

White people are the rudest, most condescneding of all people, and this thread proves it. "Oh, he's hispanic, that means he was raised to treat women as sex objects."

Seriously, you guys are insane. Since you all believe that, I have a really nice bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.

I've been treated way worse by WHITE men than men of any other ethnicity. I've also found out that most racist people are... you guessed it... white.

This guy is a perv, just like good ol' white boy Foley (you know, the day Republican who was hitting on 15 year old boys) is a perv. He's not a perv because he's Hispanic. He's not a perv because he was raised to think that was right (if that "culture" really thinks women are only good for one thing, then I guess all the women I know that work for my company and sending money back home to their families in Mexico don't exist).

My racist coworker is absent today, I thought I'd have a day when I didn't have to hear a bunch of malarky about "cultures" that people spread around without firsthand knowledge.

[ProzacPuppy]

See MBPearls.... It's a guy thing!!!

Particularly at a certain age I believe it is a scientific fact that their brain cells all go on hiatus. Some eventually return but they never get the full number back that they were born with.

Which is why women are the smarter sex.

[Alagirl]

Okay, since we're into blanket stereotypes:

White people are the rudest, most condescneding of all people, and this thread proves it. "Oh, he's hispanic, that means he was raised to treat women as sex objects."

Seriously, you guys are insane. Since you all believe that, I have a really nice bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.

I've been treated way worse by WHITE men than men of any other ethnicity. I've also found out that most racist people are... you guessed it... white.

This guy is a perv, just like good ol' white boy Foley (you know, the day Republican who was hitting on 15 year old boys) is a perv. He's not a perv because he's Hispanic. He's not a perv because he was raised to think that was right (if that "culture" really thinks women are only good for one thing, then I guess all the women I know that work for my company and sending money back home to their families in Mexico don't exist).

My racist coworker is absent today, I thought I'd have a day when I didn't have to hear a bunch of malarky about "cultures" that people spread around without firsthand knowledge.

You are mistaken. Cultural differences in how to treat XYZ do exsist.
And not only whites are racist, it's just not called racismn when someone else does it. Trust me, I have seen it!

[Huntertwo]

In some cultures, it's considered flattering to make overtly sexual innuendos. Just something as simple as a ride to the bank or store or whatever may have opened the door to him considering you fair game. The guy is probably lonely, doesn't know how to relate to women except as sex objects, and needs to be put straight NOW. Doubt he's dangerous - just frustrated. He needs to be told in no uncertain terms by you and/or your husband and/or the BO that this is not acceptable in this country. Just firing him doesn't solve the problem. And no, it may NOT be happening to others - he thought you were his "friend" because you gave him a ride. It's a slippery slope and needs to be stopped NOW. I've been there with barn workers and they don't get the hint when you act disinterested - they think you're playing coy. Be straightforward and enlist whatever help you need to.

Jan, I think you hit the nail on the head. By giving him a ride, it probably gave him the idea to be more than friends. I watch the other boarders around him and they say nothing more than "Hi".
I felt sorry for him as I didn't want to think he was any less of a person, because he was hired help. So, I did talk to him more and I really think he got the wrong idea.

There are no teenagers around. The barn consists of all adults and I'm probably one of the youngest at 46. I don't want to tell the other boarders, because the B.O. always stresses if you have a problem, talk to her first. And I do respect that. That is what makes it a nice barn, no gossip. This is the reason, I don't want to leave.

I know the B.O. would NEVER harm my pony, to clarify that.

I went riding today and *hoped* he would come on to me. But, I totally ignored him, except to say hi. Even then, I didn't make eye contact. And he was very polite. Didn't say anything unless he had to, regarding the horses.

He was getting chummy with my sister (who leases there) and she did the whole ignore thing and now he leaves her alone.

I usually see the B.O. on weekends and I will mention it to her.

THANK YOU everyone for all your replies. I really appreciate it.

[Huntertwo]

Would it be such a bad thing if Mr H2 stopped by the barn and let him know that he would beat the crap out of him if anything like that ever happened again?

I was thinking of it, except this guy knows very little English and Mr. H2
doesn't know Spanish.

But, I guess a fist and getting run over by a pickup truck is a pretty universal symbol

Little creepy guy is probably 5'2 and 130lbs. Mr. H2 is 6'1 and about 275lbs.
And he said he'd kill him if he ever touched me, that is why I never told him that creepy guy kissed me on the cheek.

[Aggie4Bar]

I thought I'd have a day when I didn't have to hear a bunch of malarky about "cultures" that people spread around without firsthand knowledge.

Which Latin country did you live in? I'd be interested to hear of your experiences.

[circusponydreams]

Huntertwo, you seem like a smart lady - please don't rely on your beefcake husband to fix this for you!

It sounds like the barn worker is starting to get the hint. I would definitely talk to the BO anyway, and continue to ignore, ignore, ignore him. If he stops, perfect. If not, the BO will probably want to start looking for another worker.

[Not So Practical Horse(WO)man]

H2, it sounds like you are letting yourself think the problem is getting better. It's not. Firmly tell the BO, don't just mention it. It's only gonna get worse if you let yourself beleive that he's leaving you alone. And then one day, just when you thought everything was going well, he'll turn on you.

Keep Us Updated

[MissBri]

And please do not wait for the weekend - call the BO and set up a time tonight to talk with her.

Take this seriously - do not brush it off.

Be safe and smart!

[philosoraptor]

I understand your uncomfortable feelings, but I don't think you need to be scared of this guy. He just likes you... REALLY really likes you.

Not every amourous guy will "get revenge" if the woman takes a stand against him. Also consider he's from a different culture where pursing women more openly isn't so unusual.

Laugh it off and consider it a compliment. Tell the BO if you really feel you can't handle it. I do draw the line if he's outright stalking you but so far it sounds more like he's just being a bit pushy.

Good luck!

[Parysa]

White people are the rudest, most condescneding of all people, and this thread proves it. "Oh, he's hispanic, that means he was raised to treat women as sex objects."

Actually, I've been to Mexico several times. I have family who are Mexican. My sister's best friend is Mexican and we have a lot of contact with them. Their culture truly does regard women differently than white culture. It's not racist to say that. It's the truth.

I've been treated way worse by WHITE men than men of any other ethnicity. I've also found out that most racist people are... you guessed it... white.

Why is it that when white people make a comment about people of other races it's a racist comment but other people can say whatever about whites and it's not? There's no way we could have White Entertainment Television or White Miss America, or all-white colleges (there's a college in my state that is 90% black, 5% white, and 5% other. You could NEVER get away with that if it were the other way around). Why is it okay for them to call us crackers and that's not racist? But if we call someone a spic or wetback or chink, God forbid! We're racist crackers. Why can they call themselves N*&^^&s but if we say it, it's racist? It's just as racist for someone to call me a cracker b/c I'm white. It's just as racist to say I'm rich b/c I'm white or that my family owned slaves b/c I'm white. I'm not rich. My family were sharecroppers, little more than slaves themselves. People tend to forget that it was the Africans who sold each other into slavery in the first place. No one ever mentions that freed black slaves would sometimes then go buy slaves and be slaveholders themselves. But if I mention that, I'm racist. Give me a break! There is such a double standard and it's ridiculous.

My racist coworker is absent today, I thought I'd have a day when I didn't have to hear a bunch of malarky about "cultures" that people spread around without firsthand knowledge.

My husband is half Mexican. His father's family is HUGE. I do have firsthand knowledge of the difference in cultures.

[harvestmoon]

Great post, Parysa!

[Aggie4Bar]

Thank you, Parysa.

And I think it's pretty clear from Post #1 that this character is a little machista who needs to learn that that behaviour is not acceptable in this culture.

[katarine]

It's important to have a sense of cultural differences, so we can at least try to stay out of trouble.

When I worked a summer in Yellowstone, and many of my dorm residents were from a Navajo reservation, I was explicitly told by HR not to be put off if they wouldn't meet my gaze- to look someone in the eye, steadily, is a challenge in their culture. So, I worked to avoid making them uncomfortable.

In my travels to Mexico I've found that a steady gaze and once-over is the norm...the guys will openly stare at the women passing by...not being used to that, it was unnerving until I learned to just tune it out.

Anyway- yeah so he thinks you're into him, because you oh so briefly let him into your world. Time to freeze that action, sister. I would definitely tell the BO, and the SO. This is NOT COOL...because who are you to decide he's not going to go any further in his pursuit?

[Jaegermonster]

I was thinking of it, except this guy knows very little English and Mr. H2
doesn't know Spanish.

But, I guess a fist and getting run over by a pickup truck is a pretty universal symbol

Little creepy guy is probably 5'2 and 130lbs. Mr. H2 is 6'1 and about 275lbs.
And he said he'd kill him if he ever touched me, that is why I never told him that creepy guy kissed me on the cheek.

I think men of all languages understand each other when it comes down to the beat down. I wholly believe they will communicate just fine and your DH will get his point across that you "don't mess with another dog's meat" (as my DH says every so now and then when he gets his macho on hahahha)