Euthanizing Healthy Horses - What do you think?

[mayhew]

"Euthanize" is only really "euthanize" if it actually ends suffering. Otherwise, it's killing for convenience. If you wish to do this to your horse, I do not deny that you should have the right to do so. I will not, however, prostrate myself at your feet in admiration .

Who asked you to?

[greysandbays]

You don't see the difference between having the vet come out and put him down in his own pasture, and trucking him three days to be held in a feedlot for a few weeks before killing him in a process never intended for horses?

Not really. The worst possible scenario with the vet and the best possible scenario with the truck just about balance each other out.

[Zevida]

I think that killing a healthy animal for convenience is a terrible, immoral thing to do. I believe that every possible effort should be made to allow the horse to live out a happy and healthy life.

My mom gave my first horse to a semi-retirement home when I outgrew her when we were both 14. We kept in touch and she was doing great. Six years later, the woman called and said that the mare was not doing well and she was going to have her put down. I drove a few hours to the farm to say my goodbyes to find a bright-eyed and busy-tailed mare who ran around the pasture with the vim and vigor of a three-year-old. A week later, I came back and got her and found out in a circumspect way that the owner really just wanted to free up a stall in her barn for a fancy new horse.

Four years later the mare is still going strong, healthy and happy baby-sitting weanlings and yearlings at her forever-retirement home.

There are extreme circumstances and so I will not say that it is never okay to euthanize a healthy horse. But I believe that in most cases when any healthy animal is euthanized, it is purely for human convenience and has nothing to do whatsoever with the animal. People should take responsibility for caring for the animals they breed or own - they shouldn't dump them for slaughter or kill them when they become a nuisance.

I also do not believe it is okay to say "oh, they would suffer a worse fate of abuse/neglect/slaughter." One wrong does not negate another wrong. None of those should be options. I refuse to compromise my morals and endores something that is immoral (unnecessary death) because I am afraid of something else that is immoral. We must strive to live in that perfect world, or we will never get closer to it being a reality.

[Lildunhorse]

FWIW, I could only bring myself to put a healthy horse down if it was dangerous. I do worry, however, about what would happen to my horses if I was unable to care for them. There's a good chance that the majority of my horses will outlive me...then I have to trust that my executor will do the best he can to find them a safe place.

[Tiger Horse]

I don't know what the answer is - euthanizing a healthy horse really disturbs me - as does the whole slaughter issue. However, there needs to be some kind of process for unwanted horses. If transport and slaughter could be done in a humane manner I would almost prefer that - horses lead such useful lives - why shouldn't they be useful in death? I know we don't eat horse meat, but others do . . . and if euthanized the bodies are mostly useless, or so I believe - what about the effects on our landfills and water systems??

[mayhew]

Zevida, you've spent the time and money to see that your horse is happy and healthy to old age, and that is great. But what about those people who don't?

[3fatponies]

But I believe that in most cases when any healthy animal is euthanized, it is purely for human convenience and has nothing to do whatsoever with the animal. People should take responsibility for caring for the animals they breed or own - they shouldn't dump them for slaughter or kill them when they become a nuisance.

I also do not believe it is okay to say "oh, they would suffer a worse fate of abuse/neglect/slaughter." One wrong does not negate another wrong. None of those should be options. I refuse to compromise my morals and endores something that is immoral (unnecessary death) because I am afraid of something else that is immoral. We must strive to live in that perfect world, or we will never get closer to it being a reality.

I agree, but the fact is, most people will not go without for a horse they don't want. If they can't find someone else willing to carry the burden within their timeframe, they just want the problem "solved." Believe me, if I thought I could browbeat (or just beat ) people into providing for a horse's retirement, I would.

[MSP]

Did not read all the post but.. I think to say it is ok to euthanize a healthy useable horse just because you don’t want it any more is wrong. I think horses with issues like unsoundness or pain are a different issue. Horses that need training or retraining should not be euthanized IMO either. Send them off for training and sell them.

I have a dog that I got from a local vet that was brought in to him to be euthanized and he refused and got the woman to give the dog up. Look at my Buddy's picture and tell me this dog could not have found a good home!

[SuperSTB]

Well- I can't honestly see too many sound horses being euthanized for convenience. A sound horse (mind and body) still has some value on the market and therefore I find it hard pressed for an owner not to attempt to sell and getting some $. There are also many rescues that would gladly take a sound horse so they may adopt out and raise money for their general purposes.

So while I *would* take issue with someone putting down a sound horse- I also would give the owner the benefit of the doubt for a horse that may have problems.

I hope people realize the stress horses take when going through sales and travelling from lot to lot. It's not a straight shot from the home barn to the plant. It's common that a horse may go through multiple sales and lots before reaching the end- hence the hides coming off the belt with more than one 'butt sticker'. I find it ironic that some people worry about feeding schedules, hay and grain quality, and colic while they own the horse but think it's okay to send him on the journey to the kill plant where the horse will certainly not get any grain, little rest, and a chance at hay if lucky for certainly more than 24 hrs.

[3fatponies]

I think to say it is ok to euthanize a healthy useable horse just because you don’t want it any more is wrong. I think horses with issues like unsoundness or pain are a different issue. Horses that need training or retraining should not be euthanized IMO either. Send them off for training and sell them.

I am not saying you are wrong for feeling that, but what's the answer? For the person who says they can't afford training, or board, or care and cannot find an immediate buyer--what are their options? Not being confrontational, but the issue of who is going to take these horses is a valid one. I've been spanked on this board more than once for telling people they are selfish for passing along their problems, but my concern is valid: where are all these horses to go? I don't believe there are enough homes for them, but I hope I am wrong....

[cowgirljenn]

Well- I can't honestly see too many sound horses being euthanized for convenience. A sound horse (mind and body) still has some value on the market and therefore I find it hard pressed for an owner not to attempt to sell and getting some $. There are also many rescues that would gladly take a sound horse so they may adopt out and raise money for their general purposes.

In some parts of the country, people are having a tough time -giving- horses away, let alone selling them. I know when our rescue still took in donated horses (we now work primarily with l aw enforcement on neglect cases), we had several horses who were in good shape come to us after the owners tried for months to sell or even give them away. So while it isn't common, it isn't unheard of either..

[Critters Everywhere]

In some parts of the country, people are having a tough time -giving- horses away, let alone selling them. I know when our rescue still took in donated horses (we now work primarily with l aw enforcement on neglect cases), we had several horses who were in good shape come to us after the owners tried for months to sell or even give them away. So while it isn't common, it isn't unheard of either..

I agree. I know of an 18 year old 16+h registered gelding right now that does a beautiful solid second level dressage test, will pack almost anyone around a cross-country course, totally sound, has nevery spooked or bucked in his life and is gorgeous to boot. Owners have been trying to find him a good home for months with no luck. He's totally free, the new owners just have to commit to continuing to ride him dressage because he loves it & supplying basic joint supplements. No takers. And he's just the most recent.

If it's sellable in the $7,500-12,000 range, there's ton of demand. Other than that, you literally can't give them away around here. And with the hay shortage, people don't have a lot of options left.

And then there's issues like my mare Zarah. She's pasture sound, but not rideable. I can afford to keep her...finances are not the issue. The issue is that this is a horse who really, really needs daily human attention. Without it, she becomes severely depressed. It's almost impossible to find a pasture mate that doesn't beat her up. I can't find anyone who wants to just fuss over her without being able to ride. I don't have time to spend more than a few minutes a day with her. After watching her depression increase steadily for several years now, I wish I would have put her down when it first became clear that she would never be rideable again. It would have been better for both of us. I don't expect Zarah will be with us next summer; when a chow-hound horse becomes so depressed that they ignore their grain I believe they're ready. I'll will no doubt feel guilty & my vet talked me out of putting her down once already. But I know my horse & if I can't find anyone to give her attention (not even take her to their property; she can stay with me; they just need to pet her & love on her), I'll be euthanizing her this fall.

[caffeinated]

A couple of years ago I would have said that it's a horrible thing to put down a healthy horse. But now, seeing how hard it is to find good homes for even giveaways, I've had to change my opinion.

A person I know sent a horse out on free lease- he'd been a dear member of the family, but was older and with lots of horses to feed, finding another place for him was just to everyone's benefit. He'd get attention, while saving the owner a little money for a while, and also freeing up time for her to work with her other horses. Even after checking out the leaser, and doing everything right, the horse came back way underweight and looking awful. And it's not the first time. Another friend did something similar and the horse came back in HORRIBLE shape, the person who took him saying that he couldn't catch the horse or get his halter on. It's hard. And finding another home for a horse just isn't always a guarantee of the horse's well being.

Should these owners have just kept the horses? Maybe.

Should they not have bought other horses to ride, instead keeping ONLY the older ones and waiting for things to get bad enough for euthanasia before purchasing younger models? Maybe.

But even if those bases are covered, there are always situations that come up... nothing in life is guaranteed- the stable income and mutual fund you have one day can turn into unemployment and a market crash the next. And in the event of something like that... well do you just hope for the best for your horse? Or do you put him down?

After seeing how these horses came back, I can't honestly say I wouldn't consider putting a horse down if I was in a bad situation. Technically, yes, it would be "killing for convenience." And that part feels bad... but after seeing how giveaways even to reputable people can turn out... *sigh*

[carolprudm]

She wanted to make an appointment to let both girls cross the bridge on a good day. The vet refused. He believes if she would spend the money on treatment they can both be kept comfortable and pasture sound for a couple more years. She's now called two more clinics and has yet been able to find vet who will help her.

IMHO that is wrong in so many ways. Two horses with no chance of improving, a stressed financial situation and an owner being force to find someone who can properly shoot her beloved horses because a vet refuses to help her give them a peaceful end.

Where's the mounting block? This short chick needs off her soapbox now.

If she is in a farm area try a large animal farm vet rather than equine vet. They then to be a bit more grounded in economic reality. Ot a local foxhunt might take them.

[Spoilsport]

If you can think up a law to enact to give people a freakin' heart or a sense of responsibility, you are more creative then I am. In the meantime...we need to continue to put good procedures in place for cleaning up the messes left by bad pet owners.

Well said!

But you DO admit that keeping him/euthanizing him makes you feel morally superior to somebody who would send him for slaughter, though, right?

This question wasn't directed to me, but I'll answer it. In a world where everything is relative, you bet I believe euthanizing a horse is "morally superior" to sending him to slaughter.

[summerhorse]

A sound healthy sane horse isn't going to be hard to place. I highly doubt any of those would be put down for convenience. I don't blame a vet for not doing that either. BUT an older horse who needs joint supplements isn't really "sound" and anything with "strings attached" is going to be a harder sell. (for example) many of the riders who ride 2nd level will be beyond that older horse and need one younger and sounder. And if I take a horse he's mine, I'm not doing dressage if I don't like it because the owner thinks the horse likes it. Whose to say the horse wouldn't be JUST as happy getting lots of attention and getting to trail ride every day? As long as I give him the medicine to keep him comfy I'm riding him however I want.

Even the older horses who have some soundness issues have value if they are packers. there are MANY people who want a nice dead broke horse and don't mind going that extra mile for supplements if they can catch the horse, get on and just go ride without fear of being dumped or run off with.

SO if the horse cannot be placed then it is probably not rideable, has mental issues or has soundness issues. If the owner truly cannot afford the horse and it does have such issues then I'd rather see them put down because such a horse is on a really slippery slope sold down the road. A dangerous horse should be put down period. There are too many nice horses out there to risk people's or animal's lives on keeping one that is dangerous (and there some out there who are just born with screws loose, I know one!). No vet would not put down such a horse that I know of. In fact since he's the one who probably risks his life to treat him he'd probably be relieved to! The farrier might help for free!

IMO a horse that is in pain 24/7 is NOT pasture sound. She's not any kind of sound. She's suffering. She's marking time. How much is too much depends entirely on the horse. But if an animal is suffering and there is no way to relieve it then I have no problem putting that one down even if it is otherwise healthy. I don't know of any vets who would not do that either, any that do are not doing what is best for the animals. Or just dislike putting them down.

unless a vet openly denounces slaughter I would find their refusal to euthanize ANY horse somewhat hypocritical. because most of the slaughter bound horses are healthy and sound.

So eliminating all that we are down to the mostly healthy, mostly sound but older and just not used any more horses, probably in their late teens or 20s or more. While it is not the best thing to do I would not object to them being put down provided a real effort was made to place them somewhere. But at that age and questionable level/length of usefulness they are better off put down then sold down the road to just anyone and sometimes nobody DOES want them. But putting in a real effort means real work! personally I dread the day when I am FORCED to put down the horse but I understand that everyone is just not like me.

[Ghazzu]

Sad but true, euthanasia is often the least of all evils that can befall a horse.

AAEP as an organization is in the pocket of AQHA, .

That is one of the more remarkably inaccurate statements I've seen here recently.

[Queen Latisha]

You're more than welcome to take on my 8 y/o gelding then, should I become financially unable to care for him.

However, do NOT try to ride him, stay out of his way or he will run you over, don't get in between him and his pasture mate, and be sure to stay away from his hooves when he rears up while you're leading him.

This horse has had training, and never been abused. He's not right in the head, period. I'd rather euthanize him than sell him.

If you think that makes me feel saintly, then you're sadly mistaken. Emotionally distraught is closer to the truth.

In this case, I agree the horse should be euthanized. He's dangerous and will only end up in a bad situation, if you elect to get rid of him.

[jenarby]

Not really. The worst possible scenario with the vet and the best possible scenario with the truck just about balance each other out.

Seriously....are you KIDDING?

You don't think any horse would feel more at ease being at home, with people he knows,a kind hand and a little needle prick rather than....on a semi with probably 40 other horses crammed in, terrified, hungry and having no idea what was going on? And that's before ever reaching a plant?

The problem I'm seeing is more with the racing industry (well, I'm involved in it so it's where I see it the most anyway). There are just so many that are sent to killer sales....what happens once slaughter is banned? Do you actually think people will start humanely euthanizing the unwanteds? Or will they be dumped in some field somewhere to fend for themselves?

Personally I would want to see the owners to put their horses down. Take some responsibility rather than squeeking out the last hundred dollars on the horse that they can get.

I'm so tired of running around in a panic trying to find homes for these horses. Meanwhile the trainer or owner taps their fingertips on the table and says, "you have three days or he goes on the truck...." har-dee-har-har.

So yes, in my opinion putting a horse down humanely would be okay if all other options have been exhausted.

That's my opinion and I'm stickin' to it.

[Caiman]

been there...

She wanted to make an appointment to let both girls cross the bridge on a good day. The vet refused. He believes if she would spend the money on treatment they can both be kept comfortable and pasture sound for a couple more years. She's now called two more clinics and has yet been able to find vet who will help her

I've had a similar problem - on multiple occasions.

One, a seriously crippled gelding that we'd taken in decided he'd had enough and went down in his paddock. The vet refused to euthanize and instead tried to push an expensive multi-year treatment program. (The horse had been examined by 2 world-class vets - before we moved to the middle of nowhere - and we all agreed against attempting treatment) We finally got the boy up and luckily (yeah, a crazy statement) he soon colicked and the vet was willing to euthanize at that point.

The incident that most likely set the stage for the first one was a foal that was born deformed and very sick. We requested euthanasia and the (same) vet refused, demanding to pursue expensive treatments. We agreed and the foal lived - w/ highly questionable quality of life - for a year before a catostrophic injury resulting from his deformities forced him to be euthanized. Of course, the vet was unwilling to perform the euthanasia b/c it was the weekend, so we had to shoot him. Not fun.

Unfortunately, vets can make more $ treating horses than they can euthanizing them. Certainly, I think it's the minority of vets that view things this way, but if I can't get a horse that really needs it euthanized, I would hate to try to get a healthy horse put down!