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When slaughter is banned;

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  • Thats the biggest reason I'm against the bill just passed. It does nothing to help the problem or the problems that will come up. Doesn't even address them in anyway.

    IMO its much like when blacks were freed from slavery. They got freedom and then what? It may have been great they were free but no thought was ever given to how they would handle it. No thought was given to the future here either with banning slaughter.

    My guess is the Senate won't pass anything unless some problems are addressed first. They know it will go to court otherwise and one thing politicians do not like is a new law they just passed getting thrown out of court.
    Quality doesn\'t cost it pays.

    Comment


    • The quote by Gandhi is brilliant.

      To County- Re the idea that the eating of flesh from animals that died in fear and pain - It IS a medical fact that those emotions cause many biochemical changes in the body (of all mammals) including the release of various neurohormones etc. It is a fact that the body stops processing of biochemicals, hormones, drugs etc upon death. Questions remain as to how these things are dealt with in the ingestor's body but we learn more about neurochemical actions all the time and research is finding that hormones and neurochemicals have a huge impact on our physical and mental health.

      Look at statistics on cancer rates in nations that have a high per capita consumption of flesh. Makes you wonder, doesn't it?

      Some cultures, in which killing and eating of flesh is considered anathema, have believed for a thousand years (long before medical proof was available) that ingesting these "emotions" will upset the meridians and damage your chi.

      Question to County - What auctions in the US have you been to where horses are selling for $300,000 (short of one of the Fasig Tipton sales)? And do you breed horses that sell through F-T? The only horses I know besides TB bloodstock that goes for that sort of price is ALWAYS private sales.

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      • I'm thinking most of the horses granted freedom due to the anti-slaughter bill will move to Houston and demand that FEMA give them housing.

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        • I don't disagree at all about the eating thing, same thing applies with all livestock.

          What sales? The NCHA sales in TX. every Dec. The guy who played Captain Kirk on star trek I beleive holds the record for high selling brood mare there was I beleive $360,000 two years ago he bought another for $310,000 at the same sale.
          Quality doesn\'t cost it pays.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by county View Post
            So if thats the way to look at it why not coime out and say so rather then there jobs that change hands all the time? If you don't care about peoples jobs that doesn't mean they don't. And illegal aliens do americans jobs. Who hires them?
            I never said I did or didn't care about their jobs, and I know nothing about the turnover rate. I just don't think it is any sort of justification to keep slaughterhouses open.

            I don't consider my job security to be anyone's responsibility other than my own. The skills I had two years ago are not marketable today. If I did not continuously re-educate myself to keep pace with technology, I would lhave to find some other line of work.

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            • Well the way I read it the poster more or less said " who cares about the jobs some of them quit after a short time anyway " I can tell you first hand lots of people in slaughter housdes care about their jobs very much. No differant then anyone one else that has any other job.
              Quality doesn\'t cost it pays.

              Comment


              • sigh

                Originally posted by Equibrit View Post
                At the risk of starting a fist fight - I would be more inclined to support responsible and humane laws for the transport and slaughter of animals. What the carcass is eventually used for is immaterial. In my view, an outright ban is pretty irresponsible.
                well, you are way behind the times because both anti and pro horse lovers have worked hard on this for many, many years.

                the more recent laws are vague and probably unenforceable; and the slaughterhouses and their suppliers don't care.

                i would be for humane slaughter if it is possible but the slaughterhouses and suppliers have demonstrated repeatedly that it is not.

                therefore, a ban.

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                • If its impossable then should all slaughter be banned?
                  Quality doesn\'t cost it pays.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by ProzacPuppy View Post
                    I'm thinking most of the horses granted freedom due to the anti-slaughter bill will move to Houston and demand that FEMA give them housing.
                    LMAO

                    And they'll get to live in trailer parks... full of Featherlite, Brenderup, and Sundowner trailers. <envisions a whole neighborhood of horse trailers lined up, pink flamingos in the yard, an old carriage up on blocks with no wheels>
                    Veterinarians for Equine Welfare

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                    • nope i was referencing horses only. i thought that was what this thread was about-horse slaughter on a horse forum. i am unaware of any present pending legislation to ban the slughter of cows, pigs, or chickens.

                      others have pointed out the difference between cattle and horse slaughter, transport of of same, method of killing, etc. and this point has been argued to death repeatedly.

                      my point is that i was on the fence about this issue and have watched it develop over the years, have read the regs, and i am convinced that the regs aren't/can't be followed/enforced and all the yapping about improving conditions has gotten nowhere. the industry itself doesn't care, and it has plenty of horse lovers who are willing apologists, which means they nedd spend none of their profits on p.r., improving conditions, or making demands on their suppliers in regard to shipping conditions. (and they are laughing at all of you, and thnking you for their profits.)

                      i'm not thrilled with commercial cattle slaughter either(although it apparently has improved in some respects) but my present concern is horses.

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                      • My concern is animals I don't place one species over another. And since its not against the rules here to talk about other animals I do.
                        Quality doesn\'t cost it pays.

                        Comment


                        • County- Stupid Question here- What does NCHA stand for? I did know that William Shatner was heavily into horses and certainly has the money. Just clueless about what type/sport sales this is.

                          MayS- I can see it now. Probably will also have problems alot of "non-slaughter refugees" lining up and trying to get free trailers.

                          Comment


                          • sure

                            i guess it is just fine to talk about other animals here-i don't have a problem with that.

                            i understand where you are coming from as a cattleman who respects his animals. but i do see horses as different from cows, although i am a grandaughter and great grandaughter and for some generations back descendant of dairy farmers.

                            i wish for humane treatment for all animals but my focus and effort now is on horses.

                            Comment


                            • NCHA stands for National Cutting Horse association. In the stock horse world as a rule Cutting horses are very high selling compared to the rest.
                              Quality doesn\'t cost it pays.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by county View Post
                                So if thats the way to look at it why not coime out and say so rather then there jobs that change hands all the time? If you don't care about peoples jobs that doesn't mean they don't. And illegal aliens do americans jobs. Who hires them?
                                The Ford Motor Company just announced that it is contemplating on shutting down two plants in the Louisville, KY area, leaving thousands of workers without a job.
                                And you expect government to worry about 200 slaughterhouse workers?

                                ************************
                                \"Horses lend us the wings we lack\"

                                Comment


                                • I don't see where I said I expect anything. But do you think those slaughter house workers are concerned any less then the ones at Ford?
                                  Quality doesn\'t cost it pays.

                                  Comment


                                  • Some people will never take responsibility - they will neglect horses that need care or take their problems to the monthly sale. So what happens to the horses with severe problems at the local sale (previously the killer sale), when they bring a "no bid"? Are 90,000 horses per year going to be absorbed by the people who previously couldn't afford them?

                                    I have never posted on a slaughter thread before. I think that all the time, money, and emotions could have been better spent finding ways to transport and new technology to slaughter in a manner acceptable to the caring horsemen (the crazies will never find anything acceptable), then finding a way to instill enough penalties to guarantee it would be implemented.

                                    Same money, time - better outcome for the horses.
                                    Comprehensive Equestrian Site Planning and Facility Design
                                    www.lynnlongplanninganddesign.com

                                    Comment


                                    • Thanks county. I didn't realize that cutting horses sold for those prices but then again I originally was shocked at the number of h/j selling for $200,000+. Previous experience had only been with the TB bloodstock sales where six and seven figures seems to occur more frequently than you'd think (Thank you Sheik Mohammed).

                                      It is sad thought that within Texas we can have horses selling for $300,000 at the same time many horses are bringing less than .25 a pound. And that is not meant as a cut to ANYONE- just sad.

                                      I myself own an OTTB that was going to auction (and "was deranged") and a mid five figure Holsteiner. Personal opinion is that the "not right mentally" and physically a "little banged up" OTTB is worth 1000 times the WB. WB has talent and breeding. OTTB has heart and integrity. Priceless. Very very sad that so many horses like him end up throw aways worth pennies on the pound.

                                      While I am a vegan and I don't believe in killing another living thing (except fire ants and my boss) I agree that there needs to be a method of dealing with unwanted horses in a humane method. Vets have said that the captive bolt is humane if done properly but horses by nature and conformation are not good candidates for this method. Any short duration tranq that could be feed administered? I still think there needs to be some sort of "equine humane society" cull and promote adoption but as my husband keeps pointing out- you are talking about close to 100,000,000 lbs of unwanted flesh to dispose of if you do not slaughter for overseas markets.

                                      I also discussed incinerating carcasses (as they do for smaller pets) but he pointed out that the temp to completely dispose of something as big as a horse would be unfeasible.

                                      He's a pain in the a** to argue with.

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                                      • gaaahhh!

                                        "I think that all the time, money, and emotions could have been better spent finding ways to transport and new technology to slaughter in a manner acceptable to the caring horsemen"

                                        it's been DONE! so much effort has already gone into this to NO avail. if you'd been reading these threads and reading articles about this you'd know that people on both sides of this issue have already expended quite a bit of effort in this direction. for YEARS.

                                        the slaughter industry does NOT care.

                                        Comment


                                        • Originally posted by bjrudq View Post
                                          "I think that all the time, money, and emotions could have been better spent finding ways to transport and new technology to slaughter in a manner acceptable to the caring horsemen"

                                          it's been DONE! so much effort has already gone into this to NO avail. if you'd been reading these threads and reading articles about this you'd know that people on both sides of this issue have already expended quite a bit of effort in this direction. for YEARS.

                                          the slaughter industry does NOT care.

                                          That's the problem. If it interferes with the bottom line, forget about it.
                                          Every mighty oak was once a nut that stood its ground.

                                          Proud Closet Canterer! Member Riders with Fibromyalgia clique.

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