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Hackamores vs. bits - "kinder"??

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  • Hackamores vs. bits - "kinder"??

    I have not ridden in a hackamore (not since I was a kid on a lesson pony, and I don't remember much about it). But the hackamores I have seen in person and in stores seem like they would be just as "harsh" as a bit - either they have curb-like effects under the jaw, or they have very strong noseband components, or both. I have heard some people say they like to ride in a hackamore because...well, because they think a bit is kind of cruel or harsh? or want to give the horse a break from metal in its mouth?

    Now I also have known one acquaintance at a previous barn who used a hackamore because it was MORE effective than a bit (i.e. a little went a long way because of the strong pressure on the nose).

    I guess I'm mostly just not sure what to think - are hackamores "milder" than bits? or just different? Harsher? Or, like bits, does it really depend on the hand holding the reins?

  • #2
    I don't think hackamores are kinder. I think it depends on the hand holding the reins. I use an English jumping hackamore with a leather curb strap(and pad the noseband with a halter fleece) on my TB mare, and have for about 3.5 years.The reason I went to a hackamore was that she really seemed to hate a bit in her mouth. She has a fairly small dainty head and I think snaffle bits were just too much in her small shallow mouth. The one bit she will tolerate is a Happy Mouth mullen bit. Shortly after I started using the hackamore, she did something (can't even remember what any more) that was irritating me and I gave a sharp tug on the reins. I was shocked at how much reaction I got.

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    • #3
      I think hackamores can be extremely severe, especially since a good percentage of people who want to use them are beginner types who think it's kinder than putting "cold hard steel" in the horse's mouth. More than once I've put someones hand/arm in a mechanical hackamore and pulled (I do the same thing with curb bits) - they're always surprised at how much it hurts.

      While I don't have any reservations about using a double bridle or a curb bit alone, I won't use a hackamore on any of my horses. I haven't been educated in their use enough to feel comfortable using one.

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      • #4
        This is just about an either/or thing - depends on the conformation of the horse's mouth and the rider's hands. There is no 'rule' that says what you MUST use unless show rules dictate, otherwise, what every suits horse and rider. Example of what suits the horse - ole Wall Kicker raced most of his career in a Dr Bristol which is normally used on horses that grab on too much and he couldnt pull the skin off a pudding, you couldnt even FEEL his mouth. Well, his mouth is so shallow and his tongue so thick, I threw the Bristol on him and after one round of the track, I had 'steering' and could feel his mouth because he actually held that bit as it didn't poke the roof of his mouth or pinch that fat old tongue. If I could have found a Crescendo bit, would have used that as it is curved and has a wide flat nouthpiece
        Founder of the Dyslexic Clique. Dyslexics of the world - UNTIE!!

        Member: Incredible Invisbles

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        • #5
          Is a hackamore, I assume a bosal type, not mechanical hackamore, or bit kinder is not the right question.

          The hands behind reins are the ones that can be rough or kind.

          Here is more on the hackamore:

          http://www.elvaquero.com/The%20Hackamore.htm

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          • #6
            I've always wondered about this myself. Decades ago someone put me on a horse for the first time and tacked it up with a hackamore, presumably because she felt I would do a number on the poor horse's mouth with a bit. (And that was for sure right.)

            Since the pressure is a function of mechanical leverage, it would seem to me that one could simply engineer a hackamore so that the pressure was not linear (directly proportional to the applied force), but rather graded such that it would take a lot of displacement to increase the pressure much and but once past a certain point eventually the displacement required for really jacking up the pressure would be very modest. (Seems to me this is how it works on 'variable-ratio' power steering in cars.)

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            • Original Poster

              #7
              I guess there's some range of what is considered a hackamore. When I was a kid (english-style riding school) it was that fleece noseband with short shanks and a curb strap. Then there's the classic vaquero type, the bosal style. Then there's the "mechanical"(?) hackamores, and various "problem solvers" (one I saw had a metal plate in the curb area and a knotted noseband...).

              Vaquero style aside, is the general idea that if the horse "doesn't like a bit" (flips its head, I assume?) the nose pressure is a more effective means of control?

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              • #8
                The bosal is an important step in training Western horses as the step between a snaffle and curb. Mechanical hackamores, I do not like in most circumstances as with rough hands they can be as harsh, if not harsher than many bits. That said, at one barn where I used to ride, we had one horse who had terrible scars on his tongue-it was obviously partially severed (we think someone tied it down with wire-ugh!) and so he was much happier and better behaved in a mechanical hackamore.

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                • #9
                  There are also English-style "hackamores" (I think that name should be applied ONLY to the bosal type myself), that are simply a stiffened noseband, no leverage at all, only nose pressure. Also, they way that type of "hackamore" is position does not cut off the air.

                  The real "bite" of a bosal is on the jawbones, where the skin is quite thin, plus nose pressure. I really don't like the leverage mechanical hacks, though as someone mentioned, the old style with a a padded nose band, SHORT "curb" and a leather curb strap probably isn't that severe, compared to the ones with chains, plates and humongous cheeks. Still just like a bit, it depends on the hands/technique of the rider. However, a caveat should be that some people can be quite rough with them, thinking that they are automatically milder just because there's nothing in the horse's mouth. I'd rather not control my horse by cutting off his air, myself........

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                  • #10
                    It really depends on WHAT bit or WHICH hackamore you're referring to. There are SO many bitless setups out there, that have a huge range in harshness.

                    Is a snaffle bit properly fitted gentler than a long-shanked mechanical hackamore? Most likely, yes.

                    How about a huge cathedral ported curb bit compared to a sidepull? Surely the sidepull is gentler.

                    But also, "gentle" is kind of subjective to a horse's preferences as well. My mare prefers a long-shanked mech hack to ANY bit, even though it is generally "harsher". Some horses just plain go better sans a bit, and some don't. There's just way too many variables to make one general assumption.
                    Tell a Gelding. Ask a Stallion. Discuss it with a Mare... Pray if it's a Pony!

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Sandy M View Post
                      There are also English-style "hackamores" (I think that name should be applied ONLY to the bosal type myself), that are simply a stiffened noseband, no leverage at all, only nose pressure. Also, they way that type of "hackamore" is position does not cut off the air.

                      The real "bite" of a bosal is on the jawbones, where the skin is quite thin, plus nose pressure. I really don't like the leverage mechanical hacks, though as someone mentioned, the old style with a a padded nose band, SHORT "curb" and a leather curb strap probably isn't that severe, compared to the ones with chains, plates and humongous cheeks. Still just like a bit, it depends on the hands/technique of the rider. However, a caveat should be that some people can be quite rough with them, thinking that they are automatically milder just because there's nothing in the horse's mouth. I'd rather not control my horse by cutting off his air, myself........

                      If the hack is cutting off air, it's not fitted correctly. That is NOT how they are intended to be used.
                      Tell a Gelding. Ask a Stallion. Discuss it with a Mare... Pray if it's a Pony!

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