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Need dog to protect against coyotes.

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  • #21
    welcome to our world!

    My rich neighbor has those european white long haired guard dogs and all they do is bark at the coyotes. Don't chase em. I have a 60# dog who USED to chase and bark at them until they ganged up on him. Now he whines and avoids them. english springer spaniel. I say forget the dogs. You don't know how many of those you're seeing aren't coydogs anyway. And they'll get bolder as they learn your farm, your habits, your pets. If you're surrounded by woods; give in to it and learn to live with them.
    And take shots every chance you can. At least they might run away from humans instead of standing there on the hillside watching you tack up so they can follow you & the dog on a trailride.......!!!
    I don't think dogs work. Gunshots DO discourage them from coming close some. But you aren't up all night when they are most active.


    • #22
      Originally posted by MES
      Do the donkeys actually kill the coyotees or just chase them off?
      Do you have to give them shots and trim their hoofs like horses?
      If the donkey catches the coyote, it will kill it. Sometimes they won't put the effort into chasing them... just snakey head and "clear out!" message. But if the dog/coyote ticks off the donkey, it may not survive the mistake. My granddad always had working dogs, so someone gave him another who turned out to be a livestock chaser rather than worker. He penned her up until he could re-home her, but she got out and harassed mama jenny... who promptly killed her. Donks can be quite merciless, and they don't really beat around the bush about it.

      And yes, they require similar care to horses. Trimming hooves may take on a whole new meaning though.
      "I did know once, only I've sort of forgotten." - Winnie the Pooh


      • #23
        As everyone said, they require similar care to horses- although they do define easy keepers. A dog who is out 24/7 would need different food, etc, than the other hooved animals. That is why I said donkeys are easier. Not because they require less care. It's that they require the same care as the animals you already have in the barn.

        The dog would need to be out 24/7. No question. The coyotes hunt mostly at night and are occassionally out during the day. So, you couldn't be of the mindset that the dog would be in the barn all day and the house at night. The dog would be useless then.

        Also, make sure the barn is well lit. We use mercury vapor lights. Coyotes are less inclined to hunt in bright light. I have also heard that Llamas are good, although I have no personal experience with llamas. They scare me just a little bit. I dont know why.


        • #24
          I have a great pry and several of my friends do as well. They are THE best dogs EVER! Mine is only 5 months and not with the herd, but in a few acres around the house. My girlfriends GP keeps their coyotes away!

          Sometimes you have to put your foot down to get a leg up!


          • #25
            Trimming hooves may take on a whole new meaning though.
            We adopted our donkey through BLM Adopt a Wild Horse or Burro Prgram 20+ years ago. He was TOTALLY wild. You need to get a good farrier who is patient and FIRM. You can't sweet talk a donkey. Our old farrier "sacked" our donkey. Say what you will about that idea, but the donkey stood like a perfect gentleman on crossties for every trim and vet visit since. You can also run clippers on him. Fine with blankets. All this from a donkey who had never seen humans before coming to us. So, they can be trained as long as you have a stronger stubborn streak than the donkey.


            • #26
              I'd agree with the donkey or llama. A good LGD is going to be a waiting period, because frankly, pepole don't generally rehome working LGDs and finding one nearby, with no health problems, who is working with horses WELL already will be tough. Almost ALL donkeys and many llamas will protect their 'herd' naturally.

              Donkeys are almost pony-like as far as keepers go. Yes, they need hooves trimmed, but they're SUPER-easy keepers as far as diet goes and they seem to be pretty tough foot-wise- trimmings, yes, but no regular shoes, and frankly, it seems like their feet just stay in shape better than horses- my neighbors' donkeys are on a 8 week schedule and are not overgrown at all, although some of that is probably from wearing down in our hilly, fairly rocky pasture. They're also the ONLY farm in the neighborhood that has had NO losses to predation this spring. I've got a farm collie who is essentially an LGD and even I've lost chickens.


              • #27
                I'd advise against getting a dog purely for coyote protection. Dogs need social contact and shouldn't be outside 24/7, and if your dog comes in at night the coyotes will quickly attune to that schedule. Not fair to a dog - a pack animal - to deprive it of family contact just to keep the coyotes away.

                My mom has six dogs and two llamas, and between them they have totally resolved her coyote problem! Can't really say which is more effective, but at least the donkey/llama solution means an animal that thinks of the barn as home and has it's herd - the horses, in this case - right there with it. A dog would not be so content.

                If you want a dog for companionship and love, the side benefit may be that he/she can chase off predators for you. I wouldn't aim for that as its sole purpose in life, though!
                My ears hear a symphony of two mules, trains, and rain. The best is always yet to come, that's what they explained to me. —Bob Dylan

                Fenway Bartholomule ♥ Arrietty G. Teaspoon Brays Of Our Lives


                • #28
                  we had a huge german-shepherd sized coyote, probably a coydog, sneaking around our neighborhood. Ate all the cats and some of the smaller dogs (up to 50 pounders) before people realized what was going on and starting keeping their pets carefully locked up. Dogs on chains would just be eaten on the spot, it was horrible. My 170-pound great dane would chase it, but it managed to eat our cats even with the huge dog on patrol. So I'd say dogs are not a solution to coyotes. Someone finally laid poison baits for the beast and it took the bait.


                  • #29
                    So envious...

                    Originally posted by daytimedrama
                    Oh Oh we had two dogs as coyote chasers. One is part chow, the other sadly passed away but he was a cheseapake bay/rott. My trainer just got a new dog who will grow up to be a coyote chaser.......A Black Mouth Cur. This puppy is the best!!!! www.americanblackmouthcur.com

                    They are good at chasing htem away, but be warned the females will try and lure the dog up to the den where they will attack as a pack.

                    You got one of them Old Yeller dogs (many people think that Old Yeller was a lab, sut he was a Blackmouth Cur Dog). This is one of my favorite breeds, how did you come to find one? They are pretty rare.


                    • #30
                      Originally posted by Cinnamon Girl
                      You got one of them Old Yeller dogs (many people think that Old Yeller was a lab, sut he was a Blackmouth Cur Dog). This is one of my favorite breeds, how did you come to find one? They are pretty rare.
                      Nope not me, my trainer. She kept doing searches on good barn dogs, and good dogs with kids and she came across the BlackMouth Cur. The puppy is so good!! Already houstrained himself, great with a 3yrold and 18monthold children. The puppy fell asleep on the vet table getting examined. She found that website talked to the guy and the puppy flew out to CA two weeks ago!! (very reasonably priced too!) I really want one too, I'm going to try and talk my parents into a third dog.


                      • #31
                        Get a dog.... or better two

                        This is very true........ the best for coyote deterent are the Anatolian shepherds but be ware they are VERY good watch dogs and you may have to put them up in the day time if you have strangers in and out of your place. They are very protective of the animals and people they live with and trake their job seriously. They use them in Afica to protect sheep and goats from the lions so they aren't too put off by a coyote. Also they have a thicker winter coat and can be outside alot and don't mind it at all. They pretty much protect whatever they are raised with.

                        Originally posted by SGray
                        Livestock Guardian Dogs will WIN - it's what they do - it's what they've been bred to do for hundreds of years
                        "A little less chit-chat a little more pitter-pat"


                        • #32
                          If you get a Great Pyrenees, you need to get 2. They run better in a pack. One will be the lead dog and the follower will be your attack dog. They are a nocturnal breed and will not interact with people so much. Great guard dogs, but are very territorial. Burmese Mountain Dogs & English Sheepdogs are also great. I would recommend a GP though...even though most of the ones I meet are very aggressive.
                          Let go & enjoy the ride!!!!



                          • #33
                            Holy Sh!t, you're in PA????? While reading your post, I'm thinking to myself, "Oh, those poor people in the west...".

                            Can I ask where in PA you are located? I'm in NE PA, and we have a fox or two around here, with the very occassional report of a bear or coyote sighting 50 miles from us, but never an attack.


                            • #34
                              Get a small donkey!

                              My retired mare adopted a mini donkey at the last boarding facility we were at. The donkey moved with us to our new property.

                              He is sweet, scared due to the cowboys who flipped him and tied up his legs, but very sweet. Except to any canine type. He rolls my man's boxer when she doesn't watch her back!

                              That donkey can spot a dog a mile away. He slowly sneaks up on it, and then bee-lines for it and runs right over top of it.

                              Our donkey gets no ferrier services. Half a tube of wormer when worming and shots.

                              : )

                              We also have a big dog (an Akita) he plays with the cows and jumps in the water trough. He did catch a chicken yesturday and was very proud. But I don't think he would whoop up on a Yotee.
                              Horses are amazing athletes and make no mistake -- they are the stars of the show!


                              • #35
                                Mules will work well too. Saw one stomp a coyote to death once. We have a Karelian Bear Dog (bred to hunt Elk)on our ranch and he does a good job of alerting when they are near, and keeping them at bay, which is what he was bred to do. Usually they are so close they wake me up. I keep a .45 near as well, and am not afraid to use it.
                                To get in the winners' circle you must first get into the gate


                                • Original Poster

                                  C5rose, I’m in Central PA. Used to be you would never see a coyote. The only wild one I’d ever seen up until last night was a dead one in our upper fields. I knew they were around, and the locals say they see them, but they are (were) very elusive.

                                  Last January, I had my first experience with them around my barn. It scared me a lot. DH didn’t even believe me that they were there. I only heard them, never saw them. My neighbor went up on our fields and saw the pack. THEN DH believed me!

                                  Last night! WOW! Right in the pasture by the house. Making a beeline for the barn. Barn kitty has to sleep in the bathroom until we can bring down the population a little. Poor kitty. Poor pony, too.

                                  I think I’ll get a GP and the donkey. I found a GP breeder in Freeburg, which mapquest says is about 1.5 hours away. Puppy is too expensive to afford two. Maybe they will give me a discount on a second pup.

                                  If anyone can recommend a PA breeder, please let me know. And if someone has a donkey they want to unload, I’m looking! DD wants a dog so bad and it would be nice to have a breed that can go from the house (for loving) to the barn (on patrol).


                                  • #37
                                    I think I’ll get a GP and the donkey. I found a GP breeder in Freeburg, which mapquest says is about 1.5 hours away. Puppy is too expensive to afford two. Maybe they will give me a discount on a second pup.
                                    Just don't let them co-exist. The donkey will chase the dog too.


                                    • #38
                                      If you get a guardian dog, do your homework first. They are not easy dogs. GPs are known for needing (and taking) a huge territory -- not related to your property.

                                      Here's an interesting article




                                      • #39
                                        I have a friend who has sheep and goats and chickens, and lots of dogs. She still has a coyote problem, but they leave her livestock alone. Just too much prey to bother with larger animals. Chickens and ducks are easy and yummy as are cats and possibly small dogs.

                                        We have had good luck with our fencing being the first line of defense. If it can keep our dogs in, then it keeps coyotes out.

                                        Same friend has a Caucasus Shepard, from Southern Russia region (black sea). It was imported by someone with a stud dog to raise "personal protection dogs" (and lots of dough, I'm sure). These are huge, furry LPDs raised with flocks. The dog patrols the fenceline and chases the coyotes she sees, and is intimidating as hell, but not mean.

                                        My concern is that a dog, if you get a puppy, must not be a pet, but a working dog, requiring little human contact and some training. I would be so afraid of becoming attached and it getting hurt. I like the donkey idea, if your concerned about your horses getting hurt. Although, I've never heard of coyotes harming horses or cattle. I've seen coyotes in with my neighbor's horses, and they don't even seem to notice one another...
                                        Proud member of the "Don't rush to kill wildlife" clique!


                                        • #40
                                          I should rent out my two horses. They stomp to death *anything* canine that comes in their paddock. But let a wild turkey in there and they're all . Go figure.
                                          For coyotes I'd also recommend either laying out musk as a deterent or if seriously wanting canines as property protection, be prepared for being able to handle and train protection dogs. They're not normally pet-like as in a lap dog, follow you around and go for car rides type dog. If you have big looking coyotes...probably coydogs. And then it's better to have a dog team instead of a single dog. Dogs with a high pack mentality are the best for wildlife protection, but those types aren't known to be good around livestock. Herd dogs are usually very good at protection, yet work best when handled and kept as herd protectors and not house dogs. Out with the herd from puppyhood to form the protection bond.
                                          You jump in the saddle,
                                          Hold onto the bridle!
                                          Jump in the line!