• Welcome to the Chronicle Forums.
    Please complete your profile. The forums and the rest of www.chronofhorse.com has single sign-in, so your log in information for one will automatically work for the other. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed here are the views of the individual and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of The Chronicle of the Horse.

Announcement

Collapse

Forum rules and no-advertising policy

As a participant on this forum, it is your responsibility to know and follow our rules. Please read this message in its entirety.

Board Rules

1. You’re responsible for what you say.
As outlined in Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, The Chronicle of the Horse and its affiliates, as well Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd., the developers of vBulletin, are not legally responsible for statements made in the forums.

This is a public forum viewed by a wide spectrum of people, so please be mindful of what you say and who might be reading it—details of personal disputes are likely better handled privately. While posters are legally responsible for their statements, the moderators may in their discretion remove or edit posts that violate these rules. Users have the ability to modify or delete their own messages after posting, but administrators generally will not delete posts, threads or accounts upon request.

Outright inflammatory, vulgar, harassing, malicious or otherwise inappropriate statements and criminal charges unsubstantiated by a reputable news source or legal documentation will not be tolerated and will be dealt with at the discretion of the moderators.

2. Conversations in horse-related forums should be horse-related.
The forums are a wonderful source of information and support for members of the horse community. While it’s understandably tempting to share information or search for input on other topics upon which members might have a similar level of knowledge, members must maintain the focus on horses.

3. Keep conversations productive, on topic and civil.
Discussion and disagreement are inevitable and encouraged; personal insults, diatribes and sniping comments are unproductive and unacceptable. Whether a subject is light-hearted or serious, keep posts focused on the current topic and of general interest to other participants of that thread. Utilize the private message feature or personal email where appropriate to address side topics or personal issues not related to the topic at large.

4. No advertising in the discussion forums.
Posts in the discussion forums directly or indirectly advertising horses, jobs, items or services for sale or wanted will be removed at the discretion of the moderators. Use of the private messaging feature or email addresses obtained through users’ profiles for unsolicited advertising is not permitted.

Company representatives may participate in discussions and answer questions about their products or services, or suggest their products on recent threads if they fulfill the criteria of a query. False "testimonials" provided by company affiliates posing as general consumers are not appropriate, and self-promotion of sales, ad campaigns, etc. through the discussion forums is not allowed.

Paid advertising is available on our classifieds site and through the purchase of banner ads. The tightly monitored Giveaways forum permits free listings of genuinely free horses and items available or wanted (on a limited basis). Items offered for trade are not allowed.

Advertising Policy Specifics
When in doubt of whether something you want to post constitutes advertising, please contact a moderator privately in advance for further clarification. Refer to the following points for general guidelines:

Horses – Only general discussion about the buying, leasing, selling and pricing of horses is permitted. If the post contains, or links to, the type of specific information typically found in a sales or wanted ad, and it’s related to a horse for sale, regardless of who’s selling it, it doesn’t belong in the discussion forums.

Stallions – Board members may ask for suggestions on breeding stallion recommendations. Stallion owners may reply to such queries by suggesting their own stallions, only if their horse fits the specific criteria of the original poster. Excessive promotion of a stallion by its owner or related parties is not permitted and will be addressed at the discretion of the moderators.

Services – Members may use the forums to ask for general recommendations of trainers, barns, shippers, farriers, etc., and other members may answer those requests by suggesting themselves or their company, if their services fulfill the specific criteria of the original post. Members may not solicit other members for business if it is not in response to a direct, genuine query.

Products – While members may ask for general opinions and suggestions on equipment, trailers, trucks, etc., they may not list the specific attributes for which they are in the market, as such posts serve as wanted ads.

Event Announcements – Members may post one notification of an upcoming event that may be of interest to fellow members, if the original poster does not benefit financially from the event. Such threads may not be “bumped” excessively. Premium members may post their own notices in the Event Announcements forum.

Charities/Rescues – Announcements for charitable or fundraising events can only be made for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organizations. Special exceptions may be made, at the moderators’ discretion and direction, for board-related events or fundraising activities in extraordinary circumstances.

Occasional posts regarding horses available for adoption through IRS-registered horse rescue or placement programs are permitted in the appropriate forums, but these threads may be limited at the discretion of the moderators. Individuals may not advertise or make announcements for horses in need of rescue, placement or adoption unless the horse is available through a recognized rescue or placement agency or government-run entity or the thread fits the criteria for and is located in the Giveaways forum.

5. Do not post copyrighted photographs unless you have purchased that photo and have permission to do so.

6. Respect other members.
As members are often passionate about their beliefs and intentions can easily be misinterpreted in this type of environment, try to explore or resolve the inevitable disagreements that arise in the course of threads calmly and rationally.

If you see a post that you feel violates the rules of the board, please click the “alert” button (exclamation point inside of a triangle) in the bottom left corner of the post, which will alert ONLY the moderators to the post in question. They will then take whatever action, or no action, as deemed appropriate for the situation at their discretion. Do not air grievances regarding other posters or the moderators in the discussion forums.

Please be advised that adding another user to your “Ignore” list via your User Control Panel can be a useful tactic, which blocks posts and private messages by members whose commentary you’d rather avoid reading.

7. We have the right to reproduce statements made in the forums.
The Chronicle of the Horse may copy, quote, link to or otherwise reproduce posts, or portions of posts, in print or online for advertising or editorial purposes, if attributed to their original authors, and by posting in this forum, you hereby grant to The Chronicle of the Horse a perpetual, non-exclusive license under copyright and other rights, to do so.

8. We reserve the right to enforce and amend the rules.
The moderators may delete, edit, move or close any post or thread at any time, or refrain from doing any of the foregoing, in their discretion, and may suspend or revoke a user’s membership privileges at any time to maintain adherence to the rules and the general spirit of the forum. These rules may be amended at any time to address the current needs of the board.

Please see our full Terms of Service and Privacy Policy for more information.

Thanks for being a part of the COTH forums!

(Revised 1/26/16)
See more
See less

Tennessee horse owners BE AWARE - lawmakers considering horse slaughter plant!

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Tennessee horse owners BE AWARE - lawmakers considering horse slaughter plant!

    I am sure there are a few who may support this, but if you DON'T, and are a tn resident, you may want to investigate..if it gets passed HERE, it could become a trend elsewhere...

    I have my firesuit on also...



    "NASHVILLE - With cooperation from the state Department of Agriculture, some state legislators are tentatively seeking ways to process horse meat in Tennessee, either for consumption by humans in other nations or animals in zoos.

    Up for discussion in the House Agriculture Committee on Tuesday was a proposal (HB1428) that sponsor Rep. Frank Niceley, R-Strawberry Plains, said could be the first step toward slaughter and processing of horse meat in Tennessee.

    The bill, as revised by an amendment adopted by the committee, calls for the state Department of Agriculture to promulgate rules and regulations for licensing and inspection of "equine slaughter and processing facilities."

    The measure also declares that anyone who files a lawsuit against establishing a horse processing plant in the state must post a bond with the court equal to 20 percent of the cost of building the plant. If the bond is not filed, the bill calls for automatic dismissal of the lawsuit. If the lawsuit proceeds and the plaintiff loses, the bond is forfeited.

    Niceley said the provision is modeled after a Montana law and is intended to show that the state is "a friendly environment for horse processing" by easing fears that "some fringe radical animal-rights group" will try to stop the building of a facility.

    The hope, he said, is that such legislation will help lure a foreign-owned company into locating a horse processing facility in the state, then exporting the meat to countries where horse meat is regularly consumed. Federal law prohibits processing horse meat for sale in the United States.

    "This is a first step toward dealing with the problem of the unwanted horse," he said.

    Rep. John Litz, D-Morristown, raised the possibility of having a facility in Tennessee that would process horse meat for sale to zoos. He said that zoos in Tennessee are currently importing horse meat from Canada for consumption by carnivores such as lions, tigers and wolves.

    Jimmy Hopper, director of regulatory services for the Department of Agriculture, told the committee that federal law would prohibit processing of horses in a plant that also processes cattle or hogs for human consumption.

    But he said that, if the facility is solely dedicated to horse processing, it might be legal - at least if the meat were distributed only to zoos within the state. In response to requests from committee members, Hopper said he would research the matter further and report back to the panel next week."

  • #2
    Bumping this up... Do you mind if I ask where the story came from?
    "The standard you walk by is the standard you accept."--Lt. Gen. David Morrison, Austalian Army Chief

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by War Admiral View Post
      Bumping this up... Do you mind if I ask where the story came from?
      I read about it some time ago on the Knoxville tv station web sites...
      Production Acres,Pro A Welsh Cobs
      I am one of the last 210,000 remaining full time farmers in America.We feed the others.

      Comment


      • #4
        watch for unintended consequences.

        I read a story yesterday about how pig factory farming got to be so profitable: by not only slaughtering the pigs but breeding them and raising them for their meat and keeping them alive all the way through slaughtering.

        managing so many pigs in a such a small area has created nightmares for many communities. not only the inhumane way the pigs are treated from birth to death but the millions of gallons of waste from the bodies, the pig sh!t, the urine. it's so unhealthy that they have to feed them antibiotics their whole lives to get them big enough to slaughter. try to imagine the pollution and the damage to the local environment including the waterways the air, etc. people are dying!

        the fact that "swine flu" became our latest pandemic and the existence of these factory farms may not be a coincidence....

        can you imagine horses "produced" and "harvested" in this way? scary. this bill could create just that sort of situation - just follow the money.

        Comment


        • #5
          Wow, this is interesting news that slipped under my radar. I was also curious where the article came from, so I googled:

          http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2009/ap...at-processing/
          Don't fall for a girl who fell for a horse just to be number two in her world... ~EFO

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by webmistress32 View Post
            the fact that "swine flu" became our latest pandemic and the existence of these factory farms may not be a coincidence....
            Tsk, tsk, such misinformation. Let's not let the truth get in the way of good old fashioned hysteria, eh? Here's the real info on our so-called "swine flu 2009":

            The 2009 flu outbreak in humans that is widely known as "swine flu" technically is not swine flu. It is due to a new strain of influenza A virus subtype H1N1 that derives from one strain of human influenza, one strain of avian influenza, and two separate strains of swine influenza. The origins of this new strain are unknown, and the World Organization for Animal Health (OIE) reports that this strain has not been isolated in swine.It passes with apparent ease from human to human, an ability attributed to an as-yet unidentified mutation.
            Homeopathy claims water can cure you since it once held medicine. That's like saying you can get sustenance from an empty plate because it once held food.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by arabhorse2 View Post
              Tsk, tsk, such misinformation. Let's not let the truth get in the way of good old fashioned hysteria, eh? Here's the real info on our so-called "swine flu 2009":
              I was just about to say the same thing...But Paris is okay- cuz she doesn't eat swine

              Comment


              • #8
                Y'know Gloriginger, I always think the human race can't possibly get any stupider, and I'm always proven wrong. The true ignorance of people is just astounding.

                I've often wondered how we've become the dominant species on the planet. Just watch Jerry Springer or Maury Povich once or twice, and you'll start wondering too!

                Back to topic. As far as a slaughter plant in Tennessee; at least the horses who would go to slaughter anyway, wouldn't have to travel as far. Plus, the plant would be subject to U.S. rules and regs, which the Canada and Mexico plants aren't.
                Homeopathy claims water can cure you since it once held medicine. That's like saying you can get sustenance from an empty plate because it once held food.

                Comment


                • #9
                  THE POINT I was making in any case was the idea of factory farming ala Pigs and Aviary being applied to horses.

                  Your reference to the Swine Flu info (Wikipedia) goes on to say, BTW:

                  "The new strain is an apparent reassortment of four strains of influenza A virus subtype H1N1.[57] Analysis at the United States Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) identified the four component strains as one endemic in humans, one endemic in birds, and two endemic in pigs (swine).[57] One swine strain was widespread in the United States, the other in Eurasia.[57]"

                  (paragraph 3 on the Wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_swine_flu_outbreak)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by arabhorse2 View Post
                    Y'know Gloriginger, I always think the human race can't possibly get any stupider, and I'm always proven wrong. The true ignorance of people is just astounding.

                    I've often wondered how we've become the dominant species on the planet. Just watch Jerry Springer or Maury Povich once or twice, and you'll start wondering too!

                    Back to topic. As far as a slaughter plant in Tennessee; at least the horses who would go to slaughter anyway, wouldn't have to travel as far. Plus, the plant would be subject to U.S. rules and regs, which the Canada and Mexico plants aren't.
                    I am inclined to think the banning of slaughter in the US has only led to horses being trucked thousands of miles to be slaughtered. Is it in Britain they have a law that animals can only be shipped a certain distance to slaughter? It's not like if you ban slaughter nobody kills horses anymore. As we have seen. I'd rather they have local "knackers", and call in Temple Grandin to help with more humane design, than ship the poor creatures to Mexico or Canada.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by webmistress32 View Post
                      watch for unintended consequences.

                      I read a story yesterday about how pig factory farming got to be so profitable: by not only slaughtering the pigs but breeding them and raising them for their meat and keeping them alive all the way through slaughtering.

                      managing so many pigs in a such a small area has created nightmares for many communities. not only the inhumane way the pigs are treated from birth to death but the millions of gallons of waste from the bodies, the pig sh!t, the urine. it's so unhealthy that they have to feed them antibiotics their whole lives to get them big enough to slaughter. try to imagine the pollution and the damage to the local environment including the waterways the air, etc. people are dying!

                      Be careful!! This version of swine production is NOT the norm!!!! We have constant discussions about it in class here (a big state ag school) and I KNOW that probably 95% of swine production farms are not run this way. I have good friends down here who are in the family business, my school owns one or two, and I just spent an entire semester studying them..... I wouldn't go around touting what you see on the news, mostly because the media on shows the bad, never the good. The good is boring, but the bad is extremely enticing and puts all kinds of people in an uproar.

                      As far as the slaughter plant goes, I say let them. We have way too many unwanted horses in the US right now, and sending them to Mexico and Canada is somewhat dangerous. If it were in the US, there would be USDA regulations and inspections -- it wouldn't be a free for all.

                      It's still legal to slaughter and consume horses in every state in the US except California and Illinois. If there's a demand, why not? There are people starving all over the world, and we (as a country) don't have anywhere to put these animals....I certainly can't afford another one, can you?
                      Last edited by randomequine; Apr. 30, 2009, 11:53 AM. Reason: Spelling Error
                      To be loved by a horse should fill us with awe, for we hath not deserved it.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by twofatponies View Post
                        I am inclined to think the banning of slaughter in the US has only led to horses being trucked thousands of miles to be slaughtered.
                        Slaughter in the US is not banned.
                        The 3 US plants closed.

                        If the law to ban slaughter went into effect, shipping to slaughter [either in the US or export] would also become illegal.

                        Horse shippers [for whatever purpose] are still held to US regulations while on US soil. I don't think it's right to say that the location of the destination is determining the actions of participants along the entire process. REgulations in theUS for the handling and care of these animals still exist, so if they are being abused within that process and under those regulations... what does that tell us?

                        In the end regulations are only as good as the enforcement put behind them. Just plopping a plant in the US because of supposed better regulations doesn't do much if those regulations are ignored like they have been for so long.
                        The argument that the ban will be ineffective because of lack of enforcement also supports the idea that enforcement of regulations governing slaughter here would be equally ineffective. If we can enforce regulations at a plant [or several] in every state... how is it we can't enforce regulations at several border crossings [that number less than the number of states, I am certain]?
                        Yo/Yousolong April 23rd, 1985- April 15th, 2014

                        http://notesfromadogwalker.com/2012/...m-a-sanctuary/

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          just saying: I read the TN proposal and it does seem to encourage a "factory farm" type of operation for horses.

                          I don't have a position on slaughtering per se but factory farming will be the death of us all, no matter what species we are talking about.
                          Last edited by webmistress32; Apr. 30, 2009, 12:00 PM. Reason: typo

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by randomequine View Post

                            It's still legal to slaughter and consume horses in every state in the US except California and Illinois.
                            not to mention Texas... off the top off my head
                            Yo/Yousolong April 23rd, 1985- April 15th, 2014

                            http://notesfromadogwalker.com/2012/...m-a-sanctuary/

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I agree with you on most points Angela Freda but I do have to say I would much rather have a plant in the US than have horses trucked to Mexico. Canada I don't think is much different from us, but with Mexico if it does have regulations they are not enforced. I have known a couple who worked in a slaughter plant there before coming to the US and they said it was horrific. They worked in a plant up in Texas (I believe it was beef) and said it was night and day. So I think that is a big difference.

                              The argument I've always heard about policing the shipment of horses outside the US for slaughter is that the listed buyer in Mexico doesn't have to be a slaughterhouse, they can say it is someone else to get around the regulations. I don't know how valid of a concern that is, though, as I don't know what is involved in exporting horses. It's just what I've heard. It sounds like you don't believe that is going to happen, though. Can you tell me why not? (not trolling, I'm honestly curious)
                              Last edited by CosMonster; Apr. 30, 2009, 12:08 PM. Reason: left off a couple of sentences
                              exploring the relationship between horse and human

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Originally posted by twofatponies View Post
                                I am inclined to think the banning of slaughter in the US has only led to horses being trucked thousands of miles to be slaughtered. Is it in Britain they have a law that animals can only be shipped a certain distance to slaughter? It's not like if you ban slaughter nobody kills horses anymore. As we have seen. I'd rather they have local "knackers", and call in Temple Grandin to help with more humane design, than ship the poor creatures to Mexico or Canada.

                                Uhuh. Agree. If there's any correlation to pigs, factory farming and what we are currently doing with our unwanted horses, it's the "not in my backyard" attitude of shipping them out to Mexico and Canada.

                                Don't know this for fact, but a couple of the reports are noting that it's a US owned pig farm close to the epicenter of where this seems to have started in Mexico.

                                Unintended consequences, of course.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by CosMonster View Post

                                  The argument I've always heard about policing the shipment of horses outside the US for slaughter is that the listed buyer in Mexico doesn't have to be a slaughterhouse, they can say it is someone else to get around the regulations. I don't know how valid of a concern that is, though, as I don't know what is involved in exporting horses. It's just what I've heard.
                                  I see that as a tripping point also.
                                  But the ban regulations would then mean that they would have to supply health records and other pricey documentation, vaccinations, etc as well as pay sales tax on the animal. The idea being that the slim profit margin of horse slaughter would get slimmer.
                                  Right now horses shipping to slaughter do not need any documentation, because they are for slaughter, traveling on a 'sealed truck' .

                                  The other bonus I would see is that documentation and verification of that at borders could mean that a missing, reported stolen horse might be found at the border, rather then his/her pelt being found at the plant too late.

                                  I'm not naive. I don't think the ban would STOP horses shipping across boarders. But it certainly would not mean 140,000 would ship, and less is better in my book.
                                  Yo/Yousolong April 23rd, 1985- April 15th, 2014

                                  http://notesfromadogwalker.com/2012/...m-a-sanctuary/

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    I think MX plants, for the most part, aren't that different or worse than US ones. MOST US horses going there are going to plants owned by export companies, so everything has to be done according to EU regulations, same as it was in the US.

                                    I'm sure there are abuses, and some slaughterhouses that are not exporting and thus do not have the same rules (the videos of horses being knived, for instance).

                                    I know a lot of folks don't like the AAEP, but when they visited new plants in MX, they reported a restraint system that was actually better than what was used in the US.
                                    "smile a lot can let us ride happy,it is good thing"

                                    My CANTER blog.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by webmistress32 View Post
                                      just saying: I read the TN proposal and it does seem to encourage a "factory farm" type of operation for horses.

                                      I don't have a position on slaughtering per se but factory farming will be the death of us all, no matter what species we are talking about.
                                      I didn't get that at all...I thought they were just talking about a processing plant.

                                      I don't think it's likely because with the availability of cheap horses in this country it is much cheaper to pick them up, feed them up, then slaughter them rather than breeding and raising them which is time and money intensive. There also isn't the same demand for horse meat as there is for other factory-farmed animals like cows, pigs, and chicken. I don't see it being more profitable to do it that way. Maybe if we quit breeding so many surplus horses that would be a concern, but as it is I doubt it. Besides, there is already a strong sentiment against horse slaughter and against factory farming. I think the public outcry would be immense if they tried to combine the two.
                                      exploring the relationship between horse and human

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by caffeinated View Post
                                        I think MX plants, for the most part, aren't that different or worse than US ones. MOST US horses going there are going to plants owned by export companies, so everything has to be done according to EU regulations, same as it was in the US.

                                        I'm sure there are abuses, and some slaughterhouses that are not exporting and thus do not have the same rules (the videos of horses being knived, for instance).

                                        I know a lot of folks don't like the AAEP, but when they visited new plants in MX, they reported a restraint system that was actually better than what was used in the US.
                                        That's interesting, thanks. I actually knew that there were different rules for export in beef cattle at least, but I didn't make the connection to horses for some reason. I'm sick and doped up on nyquil, maybe that's why. It makes sense though. My acquaintances may have worked at one that wasn't for export, I don't know.

                                        Can you provide links to an article about the AAEP thing? I googled but couldn't find anything (I'm horrible at google, though). I'd like to read about that.

                                        And thanks, Angela. That makes a lot of sense.
                                        exploring the relationship between horse and human

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        X