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Trainer Issues Again.....VENT

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  • Trainer Issues Again.....VENT

    Well, just when I thought I found the right trainer.Not that I will be leaving him, but I just want some opinions.
    It started out all nicey nice, he tells me I am effective but need some position work, and that I am very lucky to have such a talented horse. I agree with him on those things. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img] We have had "OK" lessons so far...mostly Dream plodding along on a loose rein and me working on my leg. And finally my leg has gotten a LOT better. For a month or so we worked on that, and also little cross rails, back and forth, working on Dream..so he gets to the fences on his own, without me having to hold him together(he is hot). This is very productive and worth while I think...Dream after two weeks finally gets it, and so do I.
    But now...I asked him if we could work on my dressage test. He says yeah...we never did. So I have a horse trial coming up and haven't worked on it at all.(big surprise) This is not all that has happened.....

    He has been saying things for the last three weeks that just hit me wrong! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_redface.gif[/img] First he says that I am a low intermiediate rider - Im not upset, but I do ask him why he says that.He says that he has a "system", so I ask no more. But inside I am really thinking - does this guy no what he is doing? I would call myself a low intermiediate rider in postition, but I have a very good feel, and timing for my horse, and can get the best of him without my heel practicaly dragging on the ground. I have a feeling that you all are going to flame me on saying this, but I really do feel I am a good intermiediate rider. Definitly not advanced by any means, but a very rock steady intermiediate rider. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

    He also showed me some pictures of some "intermiediate eventing pics" - they looked like training to me. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img] He shows me how his leg and angles looked "wonderful" in the pictures, and how wide the jumps were, and how I needed to aspire to ride like him. I am not a person that can take that sort of critisisim(sp?), I need direct comments, not going through one person to get to me. I swear the jumps were no more than 3ft, and 3ft wide. AND...his leg slipped back in the pictures, all of them... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_redface.gif[/img] I just don't know if he is really this "great" trainer. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif[/img]

    There has been other things said. I really don't know why Im typing this, I just needed to get it out. Also update....

    Dream keeps pulling shoes...and now that I am in high school and busy he will be getting guled on shoes for 6 months so his feet can grow out without any riding. It might be better for both of us...I feel like I am losing interest a little...and I have been a horse lover and rider forever...it is scary. But maybe some time apart will be better....plus homework is taking over. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif[/img]

    **~~Andrea and Dreamer~~**
    A short saying often contains much wisdom.
    - Sophocles (c. 450 B.C.E.) (IHFLC-Founder)

    [This message was edited by *In Your Dreams* on Aug. 24, 2002 at 11:26 PM.]
    Drea
  • Original Poster

    #2
    Well, just when I thought I found the right trainer.Not that I will be leaving him, but I just want some opinions.
    It started out all nicey nice, he tells me I am effective but need some position work, and that I am very lucky to have such a talented horse. I agree with him on those things. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img] We have had "OK" lessons so far...mostly Dream plodding along on a loose rein and me working on my leg. And finally my leg has gotten a LOT better. For a month or so we worked on that, and also little cross rails, back and forth, working on Dream..so he gets to the fences on his own, without me having to hold him together(he is hot). This is very productive and worth while I think...Dream after two weeks finally gets it, and so do I.
    But now...I asked him if we could work on my dressage test. He says yeah...we never did. So I have a horse trial coming up and haven't worked on it at all.(big surprise) This is not all that has happened.....

    He has been saying things for the last three weeks that just hit me wrong! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_redface.gif[/img] First he says that I am a low intermiediate rider - Im not upset, but I do ask him why he says that.He says that he has a "system", so I ask no more. But inside I am really thinking - does this guy no what he is doing? I would call myself a low intermiediate rider in postition, but I have a very good feel, and timing for my horse, and can get the best of him without my heel practicaly dragging on the ground. I have a feeling that you all are going to flame me on saying this, but I really do feel I am a good intermiediate rider. Definitly not advanced by any means, but a very rock steady intermiediate rider. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

    He also showed me some pictures of some "intermiediate eventing pics" - they looked like training to me. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img] He shows me how his leg and angles looked "wonderful" in the pictures, and how wide the jumps were, and how I needed to aspire to ride like him. I am not a person that can take that sort of critisisim(sp?), I need direct comments, not going through one person to get to me. I swear the jumps were no more than 3ft, and 3ft wide. AND...his leg slipped back in the pictures, all of them... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_redface.gif[/img] I just don't know if he is really this "great" trainer. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif[/img]

    There has been other things said. I really don't know why Im typing this, I just needed to get it out. Also update....

    Dream keeps pulling shoes...and now that I am in high school and busy he will be getting guled on shoes for 6 months so his feet can grow out without any riding. It might be better for both of us...I feel like I am losing interest a little...and I have been a horse lover and rider forever...it is scary. But maybe some time apart will be better....plus homework is taking over. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif[/img]

    **~~Andrea and Dreamer~~**
    A short saying often contains much wisdom.
    - Sophocles (c. 450 B.C.E.) (IHFLC-Founder)

    [This message was edited by *In Your Dreams* on Aug. 24, 2002 at 11:26 PM.]
    Drea

    Comment

    • Original Poster

      #3
      Remember how I said that my trainer thought my horse was "wonderfully talented", and he also said "definitly a intermiediate-maybe advanced eventing...or JR Hunter". Well....we went out for my lesson and saw that Dream was lame....all of a sudden his whole attitude changed. Almost like split personalities. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_redface.gif[/img] We go back to the barn and he says "that horse is dead lame" - well..he probably has an abcess....nothing too bad. Dream is known for horrible feet. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif[/img] But he now has nothing to say except negative things. He can tell how much I love my horse, and after I give Dream a hug and send him off to eat hay he says ...."you know Andrea, don't marry your horse. I say - "what does the mean [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img] <what I was doing) he says "dont get so attached you cant sell him" oh my gosh--he did not just say that - so I say "too late"...I mean ....if my family got in a bad situation sure....but not over an abcess. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif[/img] He says "you should sell him and get a horse that wont be lame...so you can go places"......rrrrrr....can you say contradiction! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_redface.gif[/img]

      **~~Andrea and Dreamer~~**
      A short saying often contains much wisdom.
      - Sophocles (c. 450 B.C.E.) (IHFLC-Founder)
      Drea

      Comment


      • #4
        that you just simply don't want to learn because you think you know everything.

        How on Earth did you deduce that your horse went from Advanced potential to "sell him" because he was lame?

        Instead of bashing him here, regarding his position, why don't you use your "knowledge" and ask questions, when he points out his perfection, like, "why is your leg slipping back so far? I've always understood ..."

        A question - was the leg slippage at an up bank, by chance? Because you do know, of course, that often the leg slips back in this scenario. Right?

        I think you should take a break from riding for six months too. Think about what you really want to do with this.

        Robby

        You may be only one person in the world, but you may also be the world to one person.
        When blood is the beverage of choice, the sharpest fangs feed first.

        Comment


        • #5
          If I were you, this is what I would do... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]

          First of all, I'd get rid of the trainer. He may be everything that he says he is, and he may be an awesome, knowledgeable teacher -- or he may not. But it doesn't sound like you are happy with him, and that is what is, flat out, what is the most important thing! And about his comments, don't let them get to you. Dream is lame because his feet need to grow out, he'll get better. He has before. I've got faith in that horse...I loff him almost a much as you do.

          And I know you brought this up over IM, but I'll tell ya again...YES, he is a talented horse with tons of potential, but NO, you are not wasting it. He is your horse, you bought him for a purpose. To train, to learn, to ride, to compete, to be a friend. And hes doing exactly that! He could be an awesome A circuit hunter, but hes not. Maybe one day -- but for now, he's yours. And you love him. Enough said. Try not to think about that, Andrea. He's still young [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

          So for now, I think you should concentrate on your schoolwork. Try to get out to the barn at least once a week and groom Dream. Feed him treats, cuddle and smooch on him or teach him a trick. It will make you feel soooo much better. And for the next 6 months, try not to think about the where your going...but about keeping you and Dream happy. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

          "So take your lessons hard and stay with them..." --Pete Yorn

          Comment


          • #6
            Nevermind [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img] Let me just say I completely agree with everyone else!!!!

            ----->*Belen*<-----
            Proud Stalker of Reiners, Cutters, any hot cowboy with a cute horse [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]
            Proud Member (Cult-like follower?) of the AQHA Clique / Founder of the Plain Bay TB Clique!
            If riding were all bright lights, big arenas and blue ribbons, I would have quit a long time ago." -George Morris

            [This message was edited by RandomTexasHunter on Aug. 22, 2002 at 12:15 AM.]

            [This message was edited by RandomTexasHunter on Aug. 22, 2002 at 05:43 PM.]

            [This message was edited by RandomTexasHunter on Aug. 22, 2002 at 05:56 PM.]

            Comment


            • #7
              the best trainers are your worst friend.

              They do things that PISS YOU OFF beyond beleif, but learn from them what you can.

              I have come to the conclusion that *most*(not all) male trainers are somewhat cocky... it's the male ego. But they know sooo much. I am sure your trainer is trying to help you! Take a clinic with most males, and they will somehow make you feel like dirt.

              I used to think of myself as atleast an intermediate rider too... then i switched trainers and felt like a beginner all over again! (but it's a women tho) SHe has even said things that bother me... even referred to me as a novice once... but then the next day says i need a horse that can go prelim... but i understand, i am learning... and someday i will be the trainer [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]

              From my guess you are in college- how long have you been riding for? It takes YEARS to become a good accomplished rider. And Its the trainers that make you feel like crap soemtimes that i think makes you a better rider... It makes you stronger, and not soo... annoyed by other peoples comments when you hear them. It makes you want to work harder, to prove them wrong. Perhaps the "don't marry your horse" thing has to do with personal experiences... from either selling his horse or from dealign w/ other peopel who have had to sell their horses...

              you can never really know what he is thinking unless he says it to you... and sometimes, they are brutally honest and DO tell you! Now i guess he hasn't been working with the horse for VERY long, and his opinion will probably change a million more times. Don't be so offended by his thoughts... He is probably thinking you want to go to the moon, and realizes your horse won't be the one to take you to the Olympics (b/c that is his thought on what the moon is).

              be optomistic... and just learn to deal with his multiple personalities, then learn from him.
              Use him for what he's good for, then move on...

              each trainer has a plateau they can take you too until they can't teach you anymore... learn what you can. that's my opinion!
              ~laura~
              "Do you care, or don’t you care? Because if you do care, you better speak up now or take what you get."
              — Denny Emerson www.savethe3day.org
              **proud member of the trakehNERD group**

              Comment


              • #8
                The very fact that you posted "Trainer Issues Again" alerted me to the fact that you have had problems in the past. Please don't be your own worst enemy by wearing a chip on your shoulder and tuning out what he is really means. At your age it is natural to be overly sensitive sometimes and you need to recognize this if it is indeed what is happening. (I am still trying to overcome it and I'm old enough to..wellll...) You know how horses mind's shut down when the "flight reflex" sets in? That is what happens when some humans get emotional. You interpret what is said the wrong way.

                Way back in grade school I realized that the toughest teachers, the ones that the students dreaded, were the ones that you usually learned the most from. Next lesson try going in with a different set of ears.

                I may not be explaining this in the best way possible, but at least I cared enough to try.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I wish my trainer would critize me more...I can go for lessons without her saying more than "get her deeper/rounder". Then there are the ones where I feel like crawling into a ditch to die. I live for those lessons, so I can "show her up" and prove to her that I can do just about anything she asks of me.
                  bombs away is your punishment/pulverize the eiffel towers/who criticize your government

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Didn't you say that you wanted another horse? But you said that you were losing interest here??? [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif[/img] [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif[/img] I don't get it. It seems like you have some MAJOR issues both with communication with your trainer. I know we all have issues once in a while with your trainer, but if you are questioning their credability then I would say go elsewhere!! I have questioned trainers in the past, but not of me saying 'oh I know more', it was more out of the question of their contradiction. For example I had a trainer telling me to put my hands up one week, and down the next. Well 11 yr old me was TOTALLY confused and didn't know what to make of the situation so I asked, and she simply told me that she was wrong the week b/4 and having ridden my pony in the inbetween time she realized so.(it was a new pony, we were all trying to get accustomed) however my point is in this business you have to be like a sponge and take in everything you can. I personally LOVE to learn as much as possible, and never question(unless I can really be POSITIVE that they ar totally off) unless I know that it is putting me/my horses in any danger.

                    *Wonder*

                    "What made her great destroyed her"
                    -Member of the Thoroughbred Clique-
                    *Wonder*

                    \"What made her great destroyed her\"

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Deep breath.

                      I don't know who you train with, so I can't comment on whether the trainer knows his stuff or not.


                      Warning: The next part may be offensive:


                      From previous posts you are a trainer jumper. When things get tough or you are not told what you want to hear, you bail. Always stating the trainer did this or didn't do that.

                      There are plenty of VERY good trainers in your area. Some you have already tried and disregarded for one reason or another.

                      IMO, you need to get with a knowledgeable trainer and STAY with that trainer. Swallow your ego. Adapt a beginner type attitude and soak up every bit of knowledge that a trainer has to offer like a sponge. Be willing to take the negatives along with the positives.

                      If I remember correctly, you are 13. Your parents support your horse endevors. How LUCKY you are!!!! You have EVERY opportunity to be everything you want to be. Don't throw it away because you don't always agree with what an authority figure has to say. BUCK UP.

                      Also if I remember correctly, your horse is only five years old. A youngster. It will be years before your horse is able to go advanced.

                      Find and stick with a trainer who has the experinece to do horse trials and eventing. Yours and your horses safety depends on that.

                      I would be happy to talk with you about different trainers in your area. You are more than welcome to e-mail me at any time. If you are ever in the Fuquay area, drop me a line, I would be more than happy to meet and talk with you.

                      Also, why can't you ride with the glue-on shoes? My horse, right now, has glue-ons. He's getting worked just as normal. Is it because of the abcess? If so, you may want to wait until the abcess clears before putting on glue-ons. In the application of glue-ons the glue gets very hot. The glue also covers a large portion of the underside of the hoof. The glue may close the abcess opening so that the abcess will not drain properly. You could end up with a bigger problem. Double check with your vet, but I would be very leary of putting glue-ons on a horse with a cooking abcess.

                      But with a normal glue-on situation, you can and probably should ride your horse. This will increase the circulation in the hoof to promote more hoof growth.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        have a wall full of ribbons to back up the claim you should be riding like him?
                        more hay, less grain

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          On the Eventing Board, we've been round and round with you on trainers. You live in an area where most riders would give their eye teeth to train. Inexperienced in your area, Southern Pines, means the trainer has only competed at Rolex once, and was successful at that.

                          Now maybe it's Aunt Esther's purse talking, but is anybody good enough for you? I think before you reply, you should make a solemn promise to yourself, your horse, and us, that you won't come back with any news until it's good news. Your whining quotient is up.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            After riding for some 20 years, and teaching lessons.... I'd still consider myself an intermediate rider. Don't worry too much about that... Heck, look at what they consider Novice and Training in eventing - it ain't exactly a "beginner's" endeavor.

                            Anyhow, take some time off, maybe try some new trainers on their lesson horses (a GREAT way to improve is to ride a bunch of different horses).

                            The witchy witch witch of south central NC.
                            The witchy witch witch of south central NC.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bigdreamer:


                              From my guess you are in college- how long have you been riding for?

                              ~laura~<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
                              [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]
                              http://community.webshots.com/user/cotswoldjr
                              http://temp.hillcresttrainingnet.off...m/default.aspx
                              [url]
                              Starman Babies

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                OK. I'm ready.

                                No I'm not.

                                breathing... breathing...

                                OK.

                                A word of caution to the other posters here: PLEASE go read the threads on the eventing forum before telling this girl to go find a new trainer. PLEASE. You all are entitled to your opinions just as much as I am, but in MY opinion, the LAST thing this girl needs is to leave her trainer.

                                Andrea: Here is what you need to do. Obviously, you are too talented and smart to ride with anyone. You need to leave all these bozo know-nothings behind and go open up your own business. Of course, you may want to wait on the business until after you win that Gold medal in the 2004 Olympics that I'm sure you'll win.

                                breathing ... breathing...

                                OK, I'm sorry for the sarcasm. You are only 13. But really, stop wasting EVERYONE's time. You are a trainer-jumper. You have an ego the size of Texas, and you think you know everything. Stop it. You are 13. I don't care if you've been riding since your were in utero... you STILL HAVE A TON TO LEARN. Not the least of which is how to function AS A STUDENT!

                                This trainer sounds like a capable guy, who took the time to pull out pictures, NOT to show you how great he is, but to show you what a good leg SHOULD look like. You're insulted because he called you a "low-intermediate" get over it. It sounds to me like that is accurate. Not to mention, "Intermediate" level eventing is WAY over your head right now... so maybe THAT is why he's calling you a low intermediate.

                                The fact that you've been working on your leg position, on a loose rein, and haven't practiced your dressage test tells me VOLUMES. It says to me: you have basic position problems that need to be fixed before you can do SQUAT. It tells me you and your horse are not ready to work "in a frame" because of those problems. Given that, it is not surprising at all that you haven't worked on your dressage test. By the way Andrea, most event riders hardly EVER work on their dressage tests. They work on DRESSAGE. The test is secondary.

                                I second Robby's idea about taking time off to think about what you want. You claim to have these lofty goals about competing... let me tell you one thing of which I am certain: With your current approach you are headed NO WHERE! Absolutely no meaningful progress whatsoever. You REALLY want to be a competitive star? Well guess what kiddo, it takes years of dedication and instruction. You seem willing to do neither.
                                Good luck. I'm done.

                                Half of Riding is 30% mental ... no wonder there are so many bad riders [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img]

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  I can sympathize with you there. It seems like I never practice my dressage test before an event, or if I do, it's one quick run through at the end of my last lesson, once my horse is already tired and.... you get the picture. BUT, the reason we never get around to riding through the whole test is because there's always some bigger issue to work on (getting him straight, getting him even between the aids, etc).
                                  What I do now is ride through my dressage test once or twice on my own (you don't want to ride it a million times anyways; you don't want a horse who anticipates everything and falls behind your leg) to get a feel for the transitions or movements that are tough for us. In my lessons, I'll casually work in those movements as my trainer and I are working on the bigger stuff: Throw in a 10-meter circle here and there, leg yield in the warm up, make a canter-trot-canter transition in roughly the same space I'll do it during the test. I'm still workign on the bigger picture, but invariably, if I do something wrong practicing one of those movements, I'll get advice on how to fix it, too (ie: Quit pulling him around the circle-or-balance him before the downward transition, get a good trot, and then canter; don't rush).
                                  Try it. It works.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Andrea,

                                    In a nutshell, unless you change your attitude, you aren't going anywhere. Sorry if this sounds harsh, but I've read your other posts, and it's clear that you have a lot of trouble taking instruction and accepting constructive criticism. Learning to ride is hard work. You either embrace and accept that fact or take up an activity that's easier. It's that simple. Jerking trainers around is NOT the way to go.

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                                    • #19
                                      But I will throw this in for what it's worth.

                                      Trainer hoppers (and barn hoppers, too, for that matter) get a reputation as such. This is such a small community. And yes, even w/o the internet, people do talk to each other. If you continue in this vein, pretty soon no one will take you on as a client.
                                      'Computers are useless. They can only give you answers.'
                                      - Pablo Picasso

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                                      • #20
                                        I'm going to avoid an opinion on your attitude and abilities, because I haven't been following your past posts, nor seen you in person. BUT I will address practicing your dressage test. IF you are more of an intermediate rider and you have been practicing all of the moves required in your tests (on a daily basis as part of the training of yourself and your horse), you should be quite able to go into the ring and put your test together on the day of the show.

                                        JMHO

                                        It's all about ME, ME, ME!!! (The only signature worthy of a real DQ.)
                                        "And I'm thinking you weren't burdened with an overabundance of schooling." - Capt Reynolds "Firefly"

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