What kind of barn dog would suit my needs?

[Lazy Palomino Hunter]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RegentLion:
Lazy Palomino

I don't mind grooming. Have you had either type of dog? I don't know much about either. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I haven't personally had either breed. However, I worked at a vet clinic for several years, as well as a boarding kennel for several. I'm a psychology/business undergrad student right now, with intentions of going to grad school to get my PhD in animal behavior with an emphasis on clinical work with dogs.

Of the two breeds I mentioned, Bouviers would be the more laid back. However, they are BIG, and lets just say, if someone broke into your house, odds are a well bred Bouvier would make them very, very sorry. They are very smart. I would compare their coat to that of a schnauzer. I don't personally find they particularly attractive, but thats JMHO. haha.

They are herding dogs, so you would likely have to teach them not to herd the horses. I wouldn't consider them one of the higher drive herding dogs, though, and if you trained an ACD not to herd, you wouldn't have any problems with a Bouvier.

Kuvasz' are sort of similar to Great Pyrs. They are BIG, white, and have tons of hair. They shed a LOT. In their "natural state" they protect sheep. Farmers will put them out with the sheep as puppies, and raise them sort of as a sheep I guess. They will protect the sheep from pretty much everything. They make great guard dogs.

[Aggie4Bar]

I'm a German Shepherd person through and through, so of course, I'd recommend a GSD.

I think Seeker (late GSD ) liked to play with my mind sometimes. I'd be all relaxed and unconcerned about anything when he'd suddenly sit bolt upright, ears swiveling, nose twitching on full alert. Usually, he'd "pose" for a minute like that and then sprawl back out. Sometimes though, he'd jump to his feet and start pacing, coming over to check on me at intervals before returning to his prowl. That always creeped me out. He'd have me totally convinced there was someone/something lurking just out of my sight and hearing. There never was anything there, but you couldn't convince me or my imagination of that.

[Pocket Pony]

I have two dogs - a Weimaraner and a Rhodesian Ridgeback (maybe a mix or maybe just a small female without the ridge, we're not sure she was a pound pup). The RR is by far the better guard dog. It is her purpose in life to be Defender of the Universe. She gets on fine with the horses, and I've seen her keep watch over them. She'd plop herself by a tree in the vicinity of where they were, and she'd sit and look around and Do Her Job (we now have electric tape fence up and she's gotten stung by it a couple times so doesn't venture out that far anymore). Same goes for me and Mr. PP if we're working outside. She's always nearby, on alert, and watching over us. She's got a loud bark, and is good at keeping critters away from the house (deer, skunks, racoons, coyotes). At the same time, she is very friendly and gets along with other dogs (except Dalmatians for some reason) and is great with kids.

The weim also has a loud bark, and keeps watch over the house, but I think she's a big chicken at heart.

Mr. PP and I are confident that if anything or anyone were to threaten us, Kenya (the RR) would fight to her death to save us. She's the best dog in the whole world and when she goes, I'm getting another RR for sure.

And you can't beat the fact that they are also called "African Lion Hounds"!

[lizathenag]

as an aside.
I read recently that the reason the sheep protecting dogs are white is so that the shepherd can shoot the wolf and not the dog!

[Cinnamon Girl]

I concur with cosmos mom. You will not be dissapointed with an Anatolian Sheperd. Unlike other large breeds they have a long life expectancy, averaging 14-16 years. They are extremely intelligent, loving, gentle animals and very protective.

http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/anatolianshepherd.htm

[Sing Mia Song]

To the OP:

What us your previous experience with dogs? Will this dog be strictly outdoors, or will it come in at night?

Anatolians have a bit of an aggressive streak in them, and I wouldn't recommend them for anyone not very experienced with dogs. They are also very "one-person" dogs, so if your husband isn't going to be around much, an Anatolian (or Maremma, or any of those big guard-type dogs) might not bond with him enough to consider him one of the pack.

Irish Wolfhounds, Scottish Deerhounds and Great Danes tend to be gentle giants. They may not have the cojones to deal with panthers and coyotes. They are VERY prone to bloat. They also have short lifespans (considered "geriatric" at age 6, usually don't make it past 8, might (if you're very lucky) live to be 10).

From what you've said so far, I'd go with a German Shepherd. Do your homework, though, and buy from a breeder that does OFA or Penn Hip certification--and they should be certified "Good" or "Excellent."

[ponyriderTwo]

Keep in mind that whatever dog and breed you choose, you must train the dog to become what you want it to be. You start with the basic characteristics, and then you create the wellmannered dog that doesn't chase livestock, etc.

As far as the gentle giants listed below... they are big dogs, and in their goofy youth, can be incredibly destructive. I had a good laugh at what a friend's deerhound did in a moment of play, picking up and carrying off large lawn ornaments! And this is a wellmannered dog, welltrained, used for a kids' program...

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Sing Mia Song:
To the OP:


Irish Wolfhounds, Scottish Deerhounds and Great Danes tend to be gentle giants.
QUOTE]

[AngelCat]

A Livestock Guardian Dog sounds perfect for you! Check out lgd.org and read up on all the breeds.

I adopted my Kuvasz from a Great Pyrenees rescue. She is doing GREAT -- she has already woken me up when my horses were acting strangely (lying down outside my door) after they'd gotten into the grain. She has two barks -- a normal one and an "oh-my-gosh-there's-something-out-there-come-quick!" Her fur is very thick but I don't think she sheds any more than my border/chow mix.

Kuvaszok do NOT need frequent grooming -- they are designed to spend lots of time away from humans, with their flock. They, as with all the other LGDs, are very independent and intelligent dogs. They will make their OWN decisions and are NOT ideal pets for someone that needs an "easy" dog.

In general, LGDs bark a lot at night, but can be trained just like any other dog in that respect (in my experience). The one thing I haven't figured out how to train out of them is their tendency to wander -- you must have a VERY secure fence, since their nature is to expand their territory and patrol it. They don't run away, they just sort of wander off.

I haven't had any predators enter my pasture, but anyone that the dog doesn't know well won't go in there without one of her humans present. LGD's bark first as a warning, then they bluff charge, then they attack. Since mine is still a puppy (well, 11 months, BIG puppy), I'm spending a lot of time training her to know who's who...all of my neighbors have stated that she has improved immensely.

Plus, she's a big fluffy goofball who looks like a polar bear when she's flattened out on the ground, and frequently takes naps upside-down with all four legs in the air. I love her to death and wouldn't hesitate to get another LGD -- if I had room!

Oh, and they're NOT housedogs...I know people that keep them inside, but for heaven's sake, let them do what they were bred to do!

And (can you tell I love my puppy?) they are GREAT with kittens! I think mine thinks the kittles are part of her flock.

AND she digs up and kills moles. What more can you ask for?? Oh...but she does dig ginormous holes sometimes.

[Aggie4Bar]

If your barn dog is also going to be a house dog, I'd advise against getting a GP. My BO has one, and while I adore his big, fluffy, sweet self, he's disgusting. All he has to do is walk by, and snot/slobber strings appear on adacent objects and people. No surface is sacred. He looked at me one day and a hip-to-knee dog snot slick appeared on my leg. I'm not sure how he does it, but he's quite talented in that regard. Although this is more training than pedigree, his size allows him to be the world's worst counter surfer. Out of reach for most dogs is still eye-level for a GP. I don't know if it's just him or the breed, but there appears to be a real independent streak (translation: not the easiest dog to train) in there, too.

Oh, and another thing... many of the other breeds listed are sight hounds. You can certainly train them not to chase, but if you want a dog to hang around and protect you, you may find yourself a bit frustrated.

[situpandride]

I have several dogs that do different things. My aussie is a good guard dog, he's not much of a herder but does herd, not obsessively however,he doesn't roam, i can put him out with the goats and he doesn't drive them nuts, he is very smart and loyal Although he is well behaved and a gentle soul i do think he's the dog most likely to attack if i was threatened.
I think he would die for us and his animals.

[Amchara]

My friend's house hold has an Anatolian. Since she knows me, she gets excited when ever she sees me. I think that if someone is around them as there growing up, they'll be pretty good about them. She was very insticntually protective, being very protective at 6 months old, barking, growling, etc.

[In The Gate]

My family has an australian shepard, and he is VERY loyal, and without a doubt would protect our family if we were truly being threatened. Even at 13.5, deaf, and harldy able to walk I still believe he would try to protect us.

He is an excellent watchdog; he never seemed to sleep deeply and always let us know when something was there -- but never seriously threatened anyone who wasn't threatening us. (He'd follow the gardners, staying 2' away barking his head off). The couple times my mom has been threatened, he has barked, growled and snarled -- and would have done more if they didn't back off.

Despite his protective nature, he is great with kids (they can do ANYTHING to him) and good with other animals so long as they aren't aggressive.

I can't say enough good things about the breed, they really are wonderful animals.

[Lazy Palomino Hunter]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by RegentLion:
I love our ACD. She is 2 yrs old and VERY red. She doesn't have papers, was bred by a friend. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ok, here would be my advice to you. WHATEVER breed you get, please go through a reputable breeder. While your ACD is a fantastic dog, with the big/guardian breeds, you are really pushing your luck getting them through a backyard breeder.

Pretty much any large breed (with a few exceptions) is going to be prone to joint problems. You are looking for a breeder who does OFA or PennHip certifications on the hips/elbows, whatever. Be sure to reasearch your chosen breed very carefully; see if they are prone to eye problems, skin problems, allergies, etc. Ask whatever breeders you are looking at how they eliminate these things from their stock (i.e. what tests they have done, merely claiming the dog is "healthy" isn't enough).

A poorly bred guardian dog is a very dangerous time bomb. Look for a breeder who has working stock, or stock that has done something noteworthy (Schutzhund competitions, obedience competitions, anything). If you were looking at one of the rarer breeds (or even a GSD), AKC registration isn't paramount, but excellent pedigree records are.

As an aside, the reason why I wouldn't necessarily reccomend a GSD to the OP is that she might have a harder time teaching it not to herd her horses.

And to AngelCat: while you might not think that your Kuvasz requires a lot of grooming compared to your Chow mix , they require much more than, say, your average ACD or Great Dane.

[2Traks]

I loff, loff, loff my Rottweiler, Duke. As you can tell, he really loves to be with people. He's my first Rott and I'll never own another breed. He was a roadside rescue as a 10 month old (or so.) He was badly starved and in need of TLC. He's good at the barn though his need to be next to me at all times irritates my young horse. He has an absolutely ferocious bark and knows that he is allowed to raise hell when someone steps on the property. I WANT people to know that there is a big a*s dog guarding the house. He will, however, immediately stop the moment you ask him to. He's really smart and got his AKC Good Citizenship certificate after only a few training sessions. He also gets along perfectly with my Min Pin (12 lbs.,) the two cats, and the bird. He loves people and the neighborhood kids are always stopping over to as if Duke can come out and play. They know he'll fetch and do tricks all day long if they want him to.

Because he's so laid back I used to joke that if push came to shove I wasn't sure if he'd be protective of me, but one night I was out walking him late and a guy started walking towards us. Duke is normally very laid back about new people and just tends to ingore them. That night, though, he went absolutely berserk when the guy got near us -- snarling, barking, crouched down with the hair on his neck standing up. I thought, well hot damn, guess he is protective after all. His overall temperment is very much in line with the other Rotts that I've known. He's also a shadow dog. He has to be right with me all the time. If I get up from the couch and walk to the tv, he'll get up and walk with me. When I take a shower he parks himself right in front of the door.

I also second the Rhodesian Ridgebacks. They are fabulous dogs. I've known a few of them and without fail they have been loyal, friendly, well behaved, and very protective of their owners. They would be my second choice as a breed to own.

[khorsem]

Rhodesian's were bred to be lion hunters, I believe. And they're great, loyal, wonderful dogs.

[Ridgetop Ghost]

Yep--I was going to suggest a Rhodesian too--both for the lion problem and the guarding issue. Wonderful dogs. They are used quite successfully in Africa to protect farms from restless "natives" and lions or other prey animals.

I would also consider a GSD, as already discussed, although not a personal favorite of mine (kinda scared of them and can't deal with all that HAIR).

Have you thought of an Akita? I know they are good guard dogs and have the fur to deal with the cold--personally, I'm terrified of them, but I have friends who own and love them.

My personal choice would be a dobie, but your cold winters would make it a poor choice.... unless you got him/her a doggie parka and some snow booties.

[Cinnamon Girl]

OP: Might a suggest you look at this:

http://www.cheetah.org/?nd=46

[eponacelt]

I wouldn't recommend a wolfhound (though I've ALWAYS wanted one myself) because they are sight hounds. They aren't going to necessarily stick around. They chase what they see in the prey department, so you need to be careful with them. Also, invisible fence doesn't always keep them in.

German Shepherds are an excellent choice if you want a guard dog who can be a pet.

One thing to consider with the livestock guarding breeds is that they were not bred to live with people. They were bred to live with livestock, so they can (occassionally) be problems and its not always easy to train them to guard livestock. When done right, I've never heard of people being disappointed. When done wrong, people hate the situation.

Just food for thought...

Have you considered and Airedale Terrier?

[Racetb*Aefvue Farm*Biziz Ltd.]

We have a Maremmo Abruzzi..too weird and protective..but I've always had BRIARDS too. The best!!! "Hearts wrapped in fur". Here's my Sophie allowing the fawn to "nurse" ..She loves everybody, but watches out for me and every creature here at the farm.

[wendy]

well, I think if choose your line carefully, your Great Dane will be perfect; better yet, get two. They were bred to be guard dogs and to hunt wild boar. Many lines retain powerful guarding instincts; my big black boy is a perfect example, very protective of me when strange men or dogs are near. They tend to stay near you, are fairly easy to train, and even a cougar, bear, or weird neighbor would hesitate to attack a dog that size. And yet your great dane is so unlikely to bite anyone.