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Lesson ideas for the very, very, very timid adult rider?

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  • #21
    She needs some help that you probably can't give her. She needs to see a therapist for relaxation techniques and to help her get over her fear. It sounds like this is way too much for you to try and overcome in lessons. Is she like this in all aspects of her life or only during riding?

    It is admirable of you to try and help her through this, but she may have to add a mental health professional to the equation-especially if she can find one with any riding experience.

    Comment


    • #22
      As an instructor, I can relate. I have had my share of very timid riders (from children to adults). My own daughter let's her mind get the best of her at times which freezes her mind up just b/c the horse farted in the wrong direction. You get the picture.

      Patience does help but it also helps to push the envelope and "make them" work through the fear. It could be too that she is afraid of her horse. As good as he is, he had tried some tricks on her and as irrational as it may sound to her that he "won't" do anything her mind may be saying he will. Speed, as in moving from a walk to a trot or trot to a canter can be very scary for people.

      Honestly I have had clients who when I put them on another horse they relax. I usually put my most scared clients on my two steady, steady, steady eddies-my 18.3 hand Clydesdale and/or a 16.2 hand older appendix we have. Surprisingly they are not afraid of the height of the horses but "speed".


      My clients do not move to the trot until they learn walk, steer and stop, this includes change of direction, over poles, around cones you name it. Then we move to walk, trot 3 strides, walk, Trot 3 strides,walk, Repeat, repeat, repeat. I tell them we are going to work on transitions.

      One student, a child, did have a terrible accident prior to coming to me. She would nearly throw up once on the horse but kept insisting she wanted to ride. It took us 2 years and we finally got her to trot and then canter on a horse (she was a WTer prior to the accident). She now rides bareback, WTC, is going over crossrails etc. on her new large pony. Transformed. It took a lot of patience.

      Not all of us have balls of steel when it comes to riding and just like any other skill learning one had to work through the fear of "what may/could happen" to move forward. Keep up working with her but don't coddle her.

      Comment


      • #23
        Before the fear can be "fixed" you need to know where it came from and what triggers it. Not just the horse moves faster but is it the ground moving faster the feel of the horse etc? break it down into the tiniest things possible. I also suggest video taping and having an unmounted lesson watching herself ride the horse. That can be a real eye opener for her.

        I also had a student who was very much like this with no real reason for being scared. Finally I got tired of babying her and told her to suck it up and deal with it and just DO WHAT YOU ARE TOLD. Turns out thats all she needed and did very well after that. Sometimes you just have to be rough and blunt.
        Proud Mama of a BOY rider

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        • #24
          Have you asked this woman why she even wants to ride? I'd be interested in hearing her answer since she is so afraid. It doesn't sound like she finds it very enjoyable - more like some kind of self-imposed torture. Perhaps if she articulates what she does like you can discover a way to get past her mental blocks.

          I also agree with VCT that it may be time for some tough love. Giving her a no holds barred, this is what we're going to do and YES YOU CAN DO IT pep talk might be just the thing. Well, if she can do it of course.

          As for the yanking on the mouth - when we were kids, our old instructor but a bit in a kids mouth once and "rode" her around the ring - she never pulled on pony's mouth again! Maybe having this lady put a pencil in her mouth and pull back on the sides to give her an idea of how much her panicky pulling is hurting her kind boy will get the point across?

          I also think having her watch someone else ride the saint will be good for her as would having someone else in the lessons with her. Never underestimate the power of peer pressure.

          Good luck with this one. But I still want to know whatever possessed this woman to buy a horse in the first place!

          Comment


          • #25
            How blunt are you being with her?

            I'd be honest. Screaming has no place anywhere near a frightened horse. She needs to buck up and fake some confidence for her horse's sake- she's the only thing he has as a "lead mare" or whatever you want to call it, and if she makes everything seem scary she's going to make him a basket case.

            Maybe practice falling?

            After you've berated her, help her replace her negative self-talk with positive self-talk. For example, if she's saying in her mind "don't spook, don't spook" she will have visuals of him spooking in an endless loop. After a spook ask her "did you fall? Did you lose a stirrup? No? Then you can handle this." Have her visualize him being his solid self, and her managing any slight variation calmly and capably.

            (I got that from Jane Savoie, the master of confidence building. It really works!).
            Last edited by Ambrey; Jan. 27, 2009, 11:20 AM. Reason: solid and sold don't really have similar meanings in this context...

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            • #26
              Get her to read some sports psychology books. There was one for riders called " " The Power to Win". It uses visualization. Pretty good book.

              http://www.amazon.com/Power-Win-Achi.../dp/1592283950

              Will she let you lead her, and have her do things like drop ger stirrups, touch her toes, touch horse's ears, lean back and touch his rump? How bout at the halt doing that. What about having her sit on him bareback and you lead him at the walk.

              Comment


              • #27
                (when she finally breaks the code and bails on riding, call me. I want that horse).

                Seriously, many good suggestions; just keep plugging away AND talking about it with her. I can relate to her issues, as I have some fear things of my own. What helps me is seeing situations when the worse doesn't happen, when, in fact, nothing bad happens, and then just replaying those things in my mind when I start to get worried. I have to learn to trust the horse--which can be difficult for someone who doesn't yet know horses well enough to know that they can be trusted. So, verbalizing and summarizing specific examples of why trust is reasonable. And then, when you see the tiniest glimmer of progress, make sure that you notice and call it to her attention, even make a small fuss over her and the horse, so that she can see progress, no matter how small. Before you start something that might cause the anxiety to go up, talk it through; all of the possible outcomes, and talk about why the good ones are so much more likely than the bad ones. Do what you can to make sure she understands how horses work, so that she can see that her fears are hers, not her horse's.

                Tell her to consider a therapist to talk about her anxiety and fear.

                And good luck--
                "One person's cowboy is another person's blooming idiot" -- katarine

                Spay and neuter. Please.

                Comment


                • #28
                  Another thing....

                  You could just ASK her if she wants you to play good cop or bad cop.

                  I mean, she says she wants to ride. She says she wants to TRAIL ride. She is paying you to teach her but she isn't listening and doing what you ask.

                  So you could flat out ask her....

                  Do you WANT me to just push you through this stuff? I won't ask you to do anything that will jeopardize your safety, but if you want me to play bad cop, I'm going to be on your case and DEMAND that you do what I tell you to.

                  OR, I can play "good cop" and try to help you work through this from a more intellectual stand point.

                  You CAN ride this horse. The horse is a good horse. I will do my best to help you reach your goal of being able to go out and trail ride confidently.

                  Thing is, you already can do the action--ie: you CAN ride this horse. But you are choosing not to do it because fear seems to be overwhelming you.

                  So. Your choice. You want me to push or you want me to pull?
                  A good horseman doesn't have to tell anyone...the horse already knows.

                  Might be a reason, never an excuse...

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    Originally posted by monstrpony View Post
                    (when she finally breaks the code and bails on riding, call me. I want that horse).
                    It's a perfect illustration, though, for the "solid horses don't stay that way with anxious riders" theory.

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      I'm thinking maybe some of her lack of confidence may come from physical issues--maybe she isn't strong enough or balanced enough to be comfortable. I would suggest some weight training at a gym and maybe some Yoga.

                      Also, you might have her practice "dismounts" from something other than a horse. For example, off bales of hay of varying heights, off barrels, etc. Maybe just falling down from a standing position into a sand arena.

                      Does she dismount without stirrups? This might help her feel a little more secure.

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        Epona, you need a carrot.

                        Seriously, you say this lady wants to trail ride, but based on your description, she lacks the requisite skills to do so. (My students ... brave kids, granted! ... don't trail ride until they can canter with a degree of control in the ring.) Her attempts to leap ahead to that activity before she is mentally or physically ready are just exacerbating her problems.

                        So you need to put the kibosh on trail rides. Explain to her that because of her nerves, she is not building up the requisite tools necessary to safely mosey the trails. The trail is the place to expect the unexpected. The horse may trot, or canter, or even spook! If she cannot deal with these things with a degree of confidence, she isn't ready. You will no longer take her on trails until she meets these milestones (then you explain what the milestones are).

                        Then you put her in a program. I've used variations with myself when I get fearful, and have successfully helped two very, very frightened adult riders move forward. (One is now eventing, crazy thing!)

                        It starts with mounting. Is there any fear here? Can she mount without fear if the horse is a little closer or further away from the block than idea? Can she mount from both sides? Can she mount if the horse takes a walk step or two? If the answer to any of these is "no," this is your starting point.

                        Once mounting -- including being able to swing up without fear when you lead the horse forward a few steps at walk -- is so boring she wants to cry, then you begin work at the halt only. All the exercises you might do on a longe, do at the halt with you by the horse. Even if she is so scared she is crying, she has to at least try at this point. She needs to push through at this very, very basic and safe level to build confidence to proceed further. Have her do around-the-world, bend and touch her toes, wave her arms and legs around ... all those exercises you can do to improve balance and body awareness and control. Then take away the saddle and do the whole thing over again.

                        Now, this is the thing: Not only do you have to just bulldog through her fear at this point, you also DO NOT MOVE AHEAD. You stay here. For a looonnnggg time. Until she is bored witless. Until any tears are of boredom. Until she has begged you through at least three lessons to please, please, please do a little walk.

                        Then you start over at the walk, with you walking beside the horse. And you do all those exercises again until they are boring. Extremely boring. Then you take the saddle away and do them again. Then you move away from the horse and do them on the longe at the walk. Again, until she is BEGGING to do more.

                        By the time she is able to trot on the longe and do some exercises, you will probably find that her confidence has increased 100-fold and it is much easier to work through fits of nerves because she has built up the tools to do so -- both mental and physical.

                        It may take a very long time. You may get bored. She may get frustrated. Stick it out. Have a very clear and detailed plan, written down, with milestones for moving to the next phase highlighted. Include a list of arena skills necessary for safe trailriding and check those off as she becomes consistent with each one.

                        When you do hit the trails for the first time, make it equally simple. You will walk on foot and lead her for a short distance, giving her exercises to do that she has already been doing in the arena (no stirrups, no hands, touch your toes, touch the horses ears, etc.) Make it short, no more than 10 minutes. Less if you think her nerves will explode. Rinse, repeat, again until she is PLEADING for more challenges. Make sure your arena work continues to build her balance, control and confidence.

                        Ths sounds dreadfully tedious and it is, in a way. It's also guaranteed. If you take the time and build carefully, the most timid of riders can become, if not actually bold, at least confident enough to meet realistic goals.

                        Another thing that can help is that if you have ever been fearful and can share that with her, or have another adult who has worked through fear issues talk with her so she knows she is not alone, that it's a fixable problem, but that she must WORK through it, which is going to mean feeling the fear but doing the riding exercises you give her anyway.
                        Equinox Equine Massage

                        In the depth of winter, I finally learned that there was in me invincible summer.
                        -Albert Camus

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                        • #32
                          Originally posted by BabyGreen View Post
                          Also, you might have her practice "dismounts" from something other than a horse. For example, off bales of hay of varying heights, off barrels, etc. Maybe just falling down from a standing position into a sand arena.
                          Fabulous idea! Maybe I should try that!

                          I still have a huge fear of falling (I've yet to have that "other shoe drop" since a bad fall in 2007- I passed the "first spook" and finally passed the "first bolt" but haven't gotten the "first fall" over with yet!) and it's such a weight to carry.

                          eta: coloredhorse, what a fabulous program!

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            Sounds like a woman at our barn who had a bad experience riding her daughter:s too big, too strong horse, shattered her limited confidence. She bought a small kind Arab and was still paralyzed by everything. My trainer had several talks with her about the dangers of riding when she was so scared. Just when my trainer was getting ready to stop any lessons, the rider started taking some Xanax. Miracle cure, she actually now takes the mare outside the ring and canters her on the grass! She never got out of the trot before prior to the Xanax and that terrified her and all of us watching. It was a train wreck waiting to happen, My trainer has 30 plus years of dealing with all level of horses and riders, unfortunately no exercise will overcome paralyzing fear, apprehension, yes. Drugs are not the answer for everything but in this case it was truly a godsend and amazing. The woman now enjoys her horse and riding and we can all breath easier. Good Luck!

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              Originally posted by eponacowgirl View Post
                              She took lessons for a year and a half and then bought this guy. She continued in lessons (crappy lesson barn) until she moved to my barn about four months ago. She really wants to trail ride. Thats it. She religiously takes 1-2 lessons a week with me. We try to work in the arena one day, then take it out to the trail the next.
                              The major part of the attraction for her with the horse seems to be the bond with the horse, rather than riding as a sport. I mean, she bought a horse pretty soon after starting lessons, which to me says she really wanted her very own horse rather than even the nicest schoolie, and her goal is trail riding, which is typically pursued alone with the horse and non-competitive. So she should be very open to an approach that stresses how she can understand her horse and build their relationship. She may not be getting the connection between riding correctly/well and communicating fully with her guy.

                              Originally posted by eponacowgirl View Post
                              My problem is that she is SO scared of EVERYTHING.... I'm running out of things to try to desensitize her to... I'm just trying to prepare her for anything she might encounter on the trail so she'll be prepared to handle it...
                              Maybe she's just not ready for that stage? I know it's frustrating, but everyone gets to a base comfort level at different rates, and it sounds like she's just not there yet. I don't mean confidence, I mean comfort - as in, she's able to focus and be calm even when trying something new and scary. Confidence comes last for us more timid souls. If she's unable to focus and relax in the ring, she shouldn't be outside the ring. And I think trying Valium or a similar anti-anxiety drug would be interesting. I resist the idea of psychiatric medication normally, but from what I've read, people have had good results using anti-anxiety medication temporarily, as part of the learning process - drug reduces anxiety, which allows student to relax more and have some good experiences, good experiences lead to student being able to relax more without the drug.

                              Originally posted by SUECLOUDY View Post
                              We must all remember that hoisting our bodies up on a 1,000 pound animal takes a lot of courage especially when we know that no horse is completely "Bomb Proof" and they all have brains that can be totally irrational at times such as a bunny rabbit being a horse eating monster.
                              I like this. As a very nervous and inexperienced rider, it helped a lot when I read up on horse behavior and psychology. Riding is a dangerous sport and I think it can boost a timid rider's morale if they recognize that their fears (which are not shared by the 7-year-olds they see jumping 3' ) are not groundless, just slightly out of control.

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                Woud she consider some NLP? (NeuroLinguistic Programming? )
                                Your student has some serious "old records" that are getting in the way of her goals.

                                Okay-okay. Having outed myself into woowoo-land. I'm stonefaced serious that this is an approach that could provide significant breakthrough from fear for her. NLP is a very powerful tool. Frankly, much of the great advice already posted has a foot firmly in NLP-light.

                                Full disclosure: yes, back when dinos roamed I did do some work for the VP to the helicoptor-flying, giant-jawed King of infomercial himself-Tony Robbins. That said, I'm far from suggesting she run off to Pago-Pago to walk on coals--there are a few of the older tapes that are exceptionally good. If I haven't loaned them out or lost them forever in the attic, I'm happy to pass them on for you & your student.

                                Also/Alternately From an instructor standpoint, a clinician, Leigh Shambo used to use my place (and some of my horses) for equine-assisted therapy addressing PTSD and fear of riding/horses in general. She appeared have a great rapport and make good progress with her groups. I bet you could Google her...and I'm sure she'd would be happy to talk technique, and mental/physical exercises with you.

                                Those who are writing that she's got no business on or near a horse...May you continue to be blessed with a life free from debilitating anxiety and irrational worry that robs you of a treasured goal and dream.
                                I'd bet there is no-one more frustrated with the situation than the OP's student herself.

                                Kudos to you ECG for assisting and for looking for additional options for your student.

                                Best Wishes for a successful resolution.

                                Cheers,
                                Rev
                                To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it. - GK Chesterton

                                Comment


                                • #36
                                  Do you have a hefty pony at the barn? Maybe putting her on a haffie or fjord who is small yet sturdy would help. I mean really, when you have less distance to fall, how scary can it be? Do you have a driving barn in the area that you and her could go to together. I can have riding anxiety about new horses, but had a BLAST driving ponies. You get to develop soft hands and enjoy the horses without the fear of falling off. There's a feeling of less vulnerability and more control I guess. Maybe a fun afternoon for the two of you to go out together and drive some horses.

                                  I had a student once react the way you describe here. She was riding an old steady eddie and wanted to "show me something." I was a substitute instructor, and she went into a two point and cantered. I was like "That's nice. Now sit up, sit back and ask him to walk." Well, her lower leg slipped back and she was unbalanced. She just froze and started screaming. I stayed calm and kept telling her to sit up, put her leg down and he would stop. No go. She tensed up, kept squeezing and the horse kept going. I tried to grab the horse, but no luck. She eventally fell off. When she did I looked at her and said "You know what would have kept you from falling off?" She said "No." I simply told her "Next time, you listen." It ended that conversation. I wasn't going to make it a big deal about her falling off. It happens. I think that's a mistake a lot of trainers make. Don't get all dramatic about the falls, react to them appropriately. If the rider isn't hurt, blow it off and move on. I got on to show this rider that the horse does infact listen, and I made her walk the rest of the lesson, working on balance. Next lesson was all no stirrup. I don't think she ever uttered the words "Let me show you..." again.

                                  Comment


                                  • #37
                                    The non-woo-woo term for reprogramming our self-talk into a more positive form, accepted as a part of the most well-proven form of therapy there is, is "cognitive behavioral therapy."

                                    Cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT) is a form of psychotherapy used to treat depression, anxiety disorders and other problems such as anger, fears, procrastination as well as improve confidence and relationships. It involves recognizing distorted or negative thinking and learning to replace it with more realistic, positive thoughts or beliefs.
                                    http://www.athealth.com/consumer/disorders/CBT.html

                                    Absolutely not woowoo unless you think all therapy is woowoo

                                    Comment


                                    • #38
                                      Not woo-woo at all....and that's what I was kind of getting at in my first post.

                                      (Anxiety and Phobia Workbook anyone? Good book!)

                                      But....I'm not convinced it's the role of the riding instructor to delve into this without some direction from the client.

                                      You can certainly help walk through the Q&A type stuff to overcome the worst case thinking...but it's probably a bigger picture issue that the student either A) already knows about but isn't managing very well or B) isn't aware of and that awareness probably shouldn't come from an equine professional.

                                      But anyway....

                                      Just some thoughts. I don't think it's woo-woo at all...it's just that it may be kind of overstepping the boundaries (and taking on far too much responsibility) for a non-psych professional to delve too far into.
                                      A good horseman doesn't have to tell anyone...the horse already knows.

                                      Might be a reason, never an excuse...

                                      Comment


                                      • #39
                                        I disagree, I think sports psychology is within the purview of the riding instructor.

                                        I think all of the best instructors use it!

                                        Comment


                                        • #40
                                          Thanks for that info, Ambrey!
                                          I've seen people make some startling (and long-term) changes with "NLP". It makes sense that there's a sciencey-science CBT, for the basic tenants informing it.
                                          BRoo, I wasn't suggesting that ECG take on a primary role in leading her student through this approach--more that the Student might look into it as an option for herself.
                                          Although...(again, speaking from the woo-woo lexicon) there are certainly "interruption"s and triggers that the two of them could potentially use together successfully.

                                          Rev
                                          Last edited by Rev; Jan. 27, 2009, 12:11 PM. Reason: Posts from BR & Ambrey whilst writing..;)
                                          To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it. - GK Chesterton

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