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Bush wins as Kerry concedes

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  • #241
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Love My TB Consent:
    And what exactly is attacking each other accomplishing? As of yesterday (which was your chance to vote) this election is out of your hands. Why fight over something that you can't change? Are you guys really accomplishing anything other then creating tension? Talking of why one person voted one way or another, the election is OVER. No matter if you persuade someone to like Bush or Kerry it's not like it's gonna change the fact that Bush won (believe it or not, there are not enough ballots left to count for Kerry to win, whoever made that argument). <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


    I agree with this, because this has become a fight and not a discussion.

    This past summer, I re-read "American Scripture" and I can't tell you the author, publishing house or ISBN as I loaned my copy out but I am sure anyone with a wee bit of drive could easily find it on the web.

    Written by a woman, it is IMO the finest historical analysis of the founding documents of this country.

    Re-reading her analysis and then reading the documents themselves, reknewed my understanding of the philosophical framework which created the context of the political ideas of the Founding Fathers (and Founding Mothers) (and the book Founding Mothers is also another very good read).

    The crafting and writing of our American Scripture took place frequently between near-riot conditions among the budding US citizenry.

    By the way, the title American Scripture in no way reflects a bias based on Scripture as it is commonly understood, the writings from the Bible.

    I suggest it to everyone to read. Especially the discussion regarding what a Democratic Republic is as opposed to a Democratic Populist government. Also for the reasons behind the development of the balance of powers and also to help understand the events of today and keep the events of the day in perspective.

    This election I think was a triumph in getting people engaged in the process. It would be an even bigger accomplishment if it prompted each and everyone of us to become engaged in the process every year on a local and state level. With some of the thoughtful minds present on this board, imagine the difference we could make if we chose to make it an important item on our endless lists...

    Really recommend that book to everyone. There are no pictures and there &lt;are&gt; over forty pages of footnotes, but it IS a VERY engaging read and the author is a wonderful writer!

    June
    \"The world\'s greatest achievements often happen on the edge of chaos\"

    Comment

    • #242
      It's getting cold, there is a draft coming on.
      The virtual "woodshed" seems the only remedy for willful fools .

      Comment

      • #243
        <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Blinky:
        Thank you ESG! MY sentiments exactly. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

        In loving memory of Laura Jahnke.
        A life lived by example, done too soon.
        www.caringbridge.org/page/laurajahnke/

        Comment

        • #244
          Joanne - point being that 51% - a majority - is historic in that it didn't happen with clinton - it didn't happen with bush the first time.

          Two things that interest me about the eleciton numbers, and I'm sure there's an answer there:
          1. Bush had the highest number of votes for him, ever. Yes, this is because of turnout. There was a three million difference - is this the second highest number of votes for?

          2. One number I'd be really, really interested in seeing - and I'm not a number person so I don't know if it can be done:, I heard on the radio that this was the largest winning margin in modern history (since when, who knows). That's logical, since it was the highest turnout. But where would it stand proportionately - is it the largest only because it as the most turnout, or would it have still been impressive in numbers from votes years ago?

          Comment

          • #245
            <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Boston Chicken:
            LMH - I hope you'll reconsider posting about why you chose Bush. While I feel very strongly about a woman's right to choose, I feel equally as strongly about having a right to state your beliefs without bias and without retribution.

            I would never begrudge you your opinion - even if our opinions are polar opposites! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

            I didn't say they were my reasons...LOL...I also didn't say they weren't! I am just saying those topics are so hot---and many times agreement with that side causes fighting words.

            Comment

            • #246
              <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joanne:
              It's getting cold, there is a draft coming on. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


              Uuuuuughhhh. That again?
              model citizen, zero discipline

              Comment

              • #247
                <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Cindeye:
                There is a very good chance that up to 4 Supreme Court justices will be appointed during the next 4 years...Renquist among the 4. If you were Bush, would you be recommending appointment for someone who furthers your religious conservatism or someone who has a history of supporting women's rights including choice?

                <span class="ev_code_PURPLE">I'm not Bush. But if I were, of course I'd attempt to people the Supreme Court with those whose beliefs match mine. It's executive privilege, after all. </span>

                I'm extremely worried that Roe v. Wade could be overturned. To say nothing of Mr. Bush's threats to propose a constitutional amendment that would ban same-sex marriage. Again, wasn't this nation founded to prevent discrimination and persecution of individuals who do not conform to someone's idea of "the norm?" <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                <span class="ev_code_PURPLE">RvW will be overturned when the President AND the House AND the Senate all agree to overturn a Constitutional amendment. As has been stated before, Bush (or any President, for that matter), is ONE man who doesn't have the power to do this autonomously. Again, getting both houses of Congress to agree on ANYTHING would be akin to an act of God, and since all those boys like their nice cushy jobs, I doubt they'd be willing to offend the majority of their constituency. That's why I'm not particularly worried. I think Mussolini will hand out ice skates in hell before it comes to pass. </span>
                In loving memory of Laura Jahnke.
                A life lived by example, done too soon.
                www.caringbridge.org/page/laurajahnke/

                Comment

                • #248
                  <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joanne:
                  It's getting cold, there is a draft coming on. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                  God, I hope so.
                  In loving memory of Laura Jahnke.
                  A life lived by example, done too soon.
                  www.caringbridge.org/page/laurajahnke/

                  Comment

                  • #249
                    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LMH:
                    I didn't say they were my reasons...LOL...I also didn't say they weren't! I am just saying those topics are so hot---and many times agreement with that side causes fighting words. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                    Whoops - sorry. Just trying to be inclusive
                    *Faune D'Helby*

                    Comment

                    • #250
                      Jester- Amen to your uggghhh.

                      Comment

                      • #251
                        To follow up on the reasons for Bush-I would never try to entertain an intelligent discussion on a topic so complicated on an internet BB-it is just to hard and you need a warm body discussion at best...even then I bet tempers will fly! LOL.

                        It still comes down to the majority of the voting public chose Bush over Kerry for whatever reason...honestly it doesn't matter NOW-it's done...bemoan, rejoice...whichever you choose...

                        As far as complaining-I guess now would be a good time to get involved in politics and make a change if you aren't happy with the results (whoever you may be--not directed at anyone).

                        Comment

                        • #252
                          Booooooooooooo! Hiss Hiss

                          I am deeply saddened by this.

                          Bush is talking right now in his acceptance speech about how the economy has recovered. That is interesting, I have yet to see it and do not think I will for at least 4 years.

                          I am Very depressed right now.
                          God forbid that I should go to any Heaven in which there are no horses.
                          ~R. Graham

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                          • #253
                            Umm ESG,

                            There is no constitutional amendment regarding abortion in the US.

                            The next guy appointed to the Supremes will take Roe v. Wade out and Bush will have made abortions illegal.
                            See those flying monkeys? They work for me.

                            Comment

                            • #254
                              <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Boston Chicken:
                              <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by LMH:
                              I didn't say they were my reasons...LOL...I also didn't say they weren't! I am just saying those topics are so hot---and many times agreement with that side causes fighting words. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                              Whoops - sorry. Just trying to be inclusive <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                              No problem-I thought actually after I posted that might appear like MY position as opposed to just tossing some issues out there...

                              Comment

                              • #255
                                To those who ask why some people are now considering leaving the country, consider that it's because they have no desire to live in a religious fundamentalist dictatorship.

                                If Bush's win had been offset and balanced by a democratic congress, I could have stomached another 4 years of this hell.

                                Unfortunately, we now have extreme right wing, one party control of all branches of government. There are no longer any checks and balances. Instead, there's a rubberstamp for whatever simple-minded, wrongheaded and stupid thing this greedy, power-addicted, war mongering administration decides to do.

                                Without a mandate, or even an honest win, Bush had no problem ramming his demented, reality-detached ideology down our throats, to the enrichment of his already obscenely wealthy friends, and the further impoverishment of, oh, people LIKE ME.

                                That leaves absolutely no reason to believe that he will reach out to the roughly 50% of the population who abhor him and everything he stands for, and who disagree with just about every single decision he (or rather Cheney and Wolfowitz) has made.

                                And yes, as has already been pointed out, the huge debt that he has proved so adept at piling up does belong to China. I honestly don't want to be around here when they start calling in that debt!

                                Oh, and the reason I'm planning an exit long term, aside from the above, is that while everybody has been obsessed with bubble-wrapping their lives to protect them from karma kickback and osama (so please tell me exactly why did Bush let him get away, not to mention Allawi, whom he had a perfect chance to get before the war, which opportunity he deliberately chose not to follow because he didn't want to lose his excuse to avenge his daddy's death threat?), some honestly frightening reports have been coming out of the science world.

                                No need for you religious fanatics who don't believe in science to be concerned. If we really are entering runaway global warming, you can blame the ever-worsening droughts and wildfires in the west and floods elsewhere on gays and abortionists bringing your god's wrath on all our heads.

                                I, however, will continue to believe that it's due largely to greedy, power-addicted headcases like Bush and Cheney.

                                Scientists have said the last century's wars were fought over oil. This century's wars will be fought over water. One reason I chose my current location was because my gut told me there would be water here. My next location will be based on where I can live with some degree of peace, if there is such a place left after Bush and co. are done with the world.

                                Comment

                                • #256
                                  <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by nhwr:
                                  Umm ESG,

                                  There is no constitutional amendment regarding abortion in the US.

                                  The next guy appointed to the Supremes will take Roe v. Wade out and Bush will have made abortions illegal. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                  As I said before, I'll worry about it when it becomes imminent. If bin Laden and his ilk have their way, we won't ever have to worry about that or anything else again, so guess which issue I picked my candidate on?
                                  In loving memory of Laura Jahnke.
                                  A life lived by example, done too soon.
                                  www.caringbridge.org/page/laurajahnke/

                                  Comment

                                  • #257
                                    A draft coming on? Heaven forbid the mass public get drafted. The LAST thing the governement and the people in this country need are a bunch of latte drinking, keyboard typing, out of shape, i-pod using IM-ing couch potatoes with authority figure issues, an inflated sense of entitlement, a lack of responsiblity and an extremely poor work ethic. Believe you me...we don't want nor need them. The service has changed drastically since ye olden days. Our technology actually makes it easier and more effective to fight wars without an excess of human bodies. Which was planned and funded that way for a reason...the baby boomer lazy generation was growing up and frankly...we were too scared to send them anywhere with a gun. Putting money into the country's protection was first and foremost pre-Clinton for a reason.
                                    Plus...geez...heaven forbid any entitled citizen should fight for everything they enjoy without working for it.
                                    The "draft" scare was a mostly internet line of manure....thus proving the statement in an earlier post saying that people get erroneous info off a medium that also has Bonzai Kittens being believed and from sources that could be a stoned college kid or a spider monkey. Besides...the intial hullabaloo about the returning draft was started by a Democratic Senator with a bone to pick. WHo even admitted he knew there was no way in Hades it would pass or even get consideration...he was hoping it would bring media attention of a completely flase, made up and ridiculous "bill" to undermine the GOP party.
                                    PLEASE folks...read with comprehension and stop the mass hysteria. And don't rely on the internet for actual "news."
                                    You jump in the saddle,
                                    Hold onto the bridle!
                                    Jump in the line!
                                    ...Belefonte

                                    Comment

                                    • #258
                                      well have fun worrying about it because that is about all you'll be able to do.

                                      <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> As I said before, I'll worry about it when it becomes imminent <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                      You don't get it. bin Laden is a non issue now. He is pinned down in Pakistan. All the bad guys have moved to Iraq. They like it a lot better there. There is a power vacuum and resources from oil. They are just getting started.
                                      See those flying monkeys? They work for me.

                                      Comment

                                      • #259
                                        <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Simkie:
                                        <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Lianne:
                                        *cough* *cough* um... Canadian gal chiming in here.

                                        I think you guys you should come up and live with us. We don't live in fear, we don't lock our doors when we're home, we don't have to pay a cent when we go to the emergency room, we have no issues with gay men or gay women, they can do as they please and we welcome all races regardless of religion or background.

                                        Yes, it's cold, but you have to make concessions on life if you want to live in such a wonderful, open-minded, harmonious place.

                                        Look me up if you do decide to come! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                        Awesome, Lianne. It may take me a few years, though. I just bought a house, and am in school. Will your offer still stand in, say, 2008?

                                        <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

                                        Hmmm, shall we plan a graduation party in Toronto I'm hoping to be out of school and working by 2006 though (we'll have to wait and see if it actually happens). Right now I'm thinking grad school may not happen- oh well.
                                        ~ hunt_jump ~

                                        http://home.cfl.rr.com/huntjump

                                        Comment

                                        • #260
                                          "The next guy appointed to the Supremes will take Roe v. Wade out and Bush will have made abortions illegal."

                                          nhwr, are you psychic? If so, I have many BURNING questions to ask you, like: Will I move my horse up to Training level next year successfully? Or will it be a disaster?

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