A dog attacked my horses- Update

[Jasmine]

None at all! I'm thicker skulled...uh, I mean skinned....than most!

[June]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Catalina:
I just called Animal Control so the incident is on the record. They said that since there are no injuries yet, that that is all I could do. I want to give the owners a chance to fix the problem, but I am concerned because the husband's attitude was so blase: 'He's just a puppy'. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Searching for a constructive solution for you here...have you considered contacting &lt;your&gt; homeowner's insurance company, since you filed the report with AC? Likely, &lt;they&gt; can contact your neighbors' insurance company who will likely visit with your neighbor and help encourage them to take steps to "lower risk" regarding their management of this dog. Homeowner insurance companies can be compelling, and their policy premiums reflect as much. Comes down to money. If neighbor loves the dog, they will do the right thing to protect the dog and their checkbook. Just a thought.
June


June - I just fixed the formatting on this so we could read your GREAT idea easily! -W.

[This message was edited by Weatherford on Mar. 26, 2003 at 04:49 PM.]

[LaurieB]

Czar, I too have had dogs neutered when they were older. It's a good idea at any age as it reduces the risk of several diseases.

[wanderlust]

Czar, I think it is time for you to execute a dognapping (no pun intended). Whether you neuter and return, or whether the dog "ran away" and never comes back, something needs to be done.

If a dog was endagering my horses, I would shoot it in a heartbeat. Of course, my comfort level extends to bb/pellet guns and not much further (I am quite capable of handling other firearms, just don't like doing it). I would like to think that the sting of one of those would be a huge deterrent to a dog.

If a dog had killed another pet or livestock, that dog is as good as dead. Sorry if it sounds cold, but no dog is worth the vet bills and potential lawsuits.

Another thing they may want to consider is a shock collar. They seem to resolve nasty behavior quite quickly.

Hawaii- how on earth you can draw a correlation between a bucking horse and an attacking dog is quite beyond me.

[Hawaii]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SquishTheBunny:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> It's the irresponsibility of the owners not the dog that are the problem here. I believe as others that his behavior can be modified, I don't believe it will be, if the humans involved would be give the dog the love they profess for it, the love it deserves there would be no problem.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well said

Well Said! Catalina, tell the owners that you DEMAND a solution. Killing should be the last resort. In my opinion if NOTHING else can be done then euthanasia is the right thing to do, but only if every other attempt to remove the dog from the home, failure to obedience train it, failure for them to properly secure the dog etc. fails.

I feel horrible for you as well as the dog owners, Im sure their intent on owning this dog was not to hurt your horses. I dont think it is right of you however to make them feel it is their obligation to kill their dog, because it isnt. It is in your best concern to protect your horses the best you can, just as it is in the dog owners best concern to protect their dog. I do NOT condone owning an aggressive animal, but by the sounds of it, this dog isnt "aggressive" and could be worked on through obedience.


Good luck with the situation.

Everyone sing now!!

R-E-S-P-E-C-T that is what my horsie needs!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[Brookes]

Catalina, I must say to be as careful as you can, I am the victim of a dog attack while riding my horse, one broken back later (mine!) and a punctured hock (his). I can no longer ride on a constant basis due to the pain that my injury caused, the long term effect, nerve damage and severe arthritis, I now only get to plod along at the walk until my physical therapist thinks it's ok for me to try trotting.

This was a small dog that just flipped out apparently. It had never attacked before, or so I was told and believed them. This attack cost them (and still is) over $75,000 in medical bills and therapy for me and my horse. Whenever I am on horseback and I see a dog I freeze up!

Take whatever precautions you must but don't ever turn your back on this dog, puppy or otherwise, Keep a long lunge whip handy when you are riding just in case you have to grab something if he shows up again, get good at it and nail the little sucker.

I don't want to get flamed, I love dogs, have dogs, but was injured so badly that I have had to sell both my horses because I just couldn't ride without extreme pain. I am finally starting to try riding again, 10 minutes every other day at the walk! That's all I am allowed. I may get better and be able to ride, and well maybe not.

Be careful, also put a spray bottle with vinegar near by, use the squirt setting if he shows up and nail him right in the face, that will stop him in his tracks!

I will never trust another dog near me when I ride as long as I live, I can understand completely why people would shoot an animal harrassing their horses, it's a law in Sonoma County, shoot first and ask questions later.

Good luck Catalina and keep some goodies on hand in case you need to deter this dog again.

Lions and Tigers and Bears, oh my!!

[Hawaii]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bgoosewood:
Well, no one wants to be called a _YUPPIE_!! I know some woman who refers to her dog as her "dogter"........and she is definitely not a yuppie, more like a freak.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Excuse me, I'm one of those "freaks" then. You don't know what the heck I went thru. My dog is like my child. I lost a freak'n baby, I couldn't seem to get out of the depression I was in...the Lord bless me with my Maggie and that was the ONLY thing that help me deal with it. For someone to pass judgement on others by making comments ike yuppie and freak is uncalled for. My dog is problably better behaved and loved than most of your children.

I still think that if a horse will intentionally buck or kick it should be killed immediately...it's the same darn thing as what has happened here with the dog because the freak'n dog doesn't know better than to chase the horse.

Something else, from this point forward, if I ever see a stray horse on MY property I will shoot first. Heck it could be a stud that would attack my mares.

[GatoGordo]

I agree with what EqTrainer, Farmdad, katarine, etc., had to say. Think of it this way: it might come down to choosing between the two animals. Would you rather have your horse, or a dog whose owners have not bothered to control it? If each animal's life is equally precious (something I disagree with), then you should take into consideration both the life and limb of your horses AND your pocketbook -- it sounds like we are talking about tens of thousands of dollars of horseflesh, if you take into account market value and $$$ for training, breeding, etc. That does not consider the emotional stake you have in your horses, and the physical and psychological therapy needed to recover from an attack.

IMO, too many people try to make excuses and avoid responsibility. Whether or not the people meant it, or the dog meant it, you or your horses may be suffering for years I don't care that the dog is *only* a year old, I help train a dog who is now almost a year, and he has known the command "come" since he was 12 weeks old. If you are not skilled enough to train a dog as a subordinate member of your household, volunteer at the shelter, train yourself until you are ready to own a dog. If you have not done so and are not prepared and committed to do so, starting the instant the dog walks in your door, you have no business owning a potentially lethal dog, one that is the size of a small person. JMO.

[June]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by June:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Catalina:
I just called Animal Control so the incident is on the record. They said that since there are no injuries yet, that that is all I could do. I want to give the owners a chance to fix the problem, but I am concerned because the husband's attitude was so blase: 'He's just a puppy'. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Goodness, W., we appreciate that; it looks MUCH better, thank you !

Searching for a constructive solution for you here...have you considered contacting &lt;your&gt; homeowner's insurance company, since you filed the report with AC? Likely, &lt;they&gt; can contact your neighbors' insurance company who will likely visit with your neighbor and help encourage them to take steps to "lower risk" regarding their management of this dog. Homeowner insurance companies can be compelling, and their policy premiums reflect as much. Comes down to money. If neighbor loves the dog, they will do the right thing to protect the dog and their checkbook. Just a thought.
June


June - I just fixed the formatting on this so we could read your GREAT idea easily! -W.

[This message was edited by Weatherford on Mar. 26, 2003 at 04:49 PM.]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[FionaJ]

I think you also have to add in the costs of the 'what if' senario as well which are lawyer fees and court costs if/when the dog causes damage to your horse. You will be out of the expenses initially, but if you try to recover damages the lawyer/court costs will add up, and the reality is most people don't do what is right and make restitution from the get go. If these folks are not willing to make the situation right at the present and have the attitude that it is not their problem--and that is how I am reading/perceiving it--then I doubt if they will fork out big money for compensation.

[lilblackhorse]

wow, coming late to this party as usual. I am sorry about what happened. I am sure that you are so stressed on a daily basis wondering if this dog is going to get loose again.

In Oregon there have been several big cases about dogs who were put on death row for chasing livestock. In our state, any farmer has the right to kill a dog who is chasing their livestock.

No, I wouldn't want to kill a dog either, but I sure as hell would have a gun sitting by my door and I would use it if I saw the dog again on my property. I would send these people a letter and have them sign for it, so you have a record. You need to tell them that the dog is not to be on your property and explicitly write out all the particulars of what they will be liable for if their dog comes on your farm and injures/damages your horses.

I am all for giving animals a chance, but the fact this is a big dog capable by it's size of taking out a horse, then I become more hardened. Dogs need to be leashed or until voice control, period. I am sick of having my dogs attacked as I walk them on leashes and having some stupid blonde say "oh, sparky is OK, don't mind him". I booted sparky's ass five feet in the air when he attacked my dog who was wearing a gentle leader and couldn't bit her precious sparky the way it needed to be.

Owners do their animals a disservice by not training them, and keeping them in a kennel or in a fenced yard.Cover all your bases, practice target shooting, and write the letter so you have all this documented. I hope you don't have to use any of those, but in case it does happen you will be prepared. The dog owners sound like idiots.

Elippses Users Clique........
Co-Founder Occularly Challenged Equine Support Group

[MyShadeOfPink]

Just wante dot say one thing.. tell them to hotwire/fence their own darned yard.. why should you have to pay to keep YOUR property protected from THEIR dog

::Jennie::
"Nothing of me is original. I am the combined effort of everybody I've ever known."-Invisible Monsters

[wanderlust]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hawaii:

Excuse me, I'm one of those "freaks" then. You don't know what the heck I went thru. My dog is like my child. I lost a freak'n baby, I couldn't seem to get out of the depression I was in...the Lord bless me with my Maggie and that was the ONLY thing that help me deal with it. For someone to pass judgement on others by making comments ike yuppie and freak is uncalled for. My dog is problably better behaved and loved than most of your children.

I still think that if a horse will intentionally buck or kick it should be killed immediately...it's the same darn thing as what has happened here with the dog because the freak'n dog doesn't know better than to chase the horse.

Something else, from this point forward, if I ever see a stray horse on MY property I will shoot first. Heck it could be a stud that would attack my mares.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

hmmm... don't want us to pass judgement on you. But by claiming that your dog is better behaved and loved than most COTH member's children, haven't you just passed judgement on the lot of us?

I don't understand why you are taking this scenario as a personal attack, when it is obvious that your perfectly-mannered dog would never end up in a situation where it chased livestock. This has nothing to do with you and your perfect dog. It has everything to do with a woman who fears for the safety of her animals and child because of an undisciplined dog. How would you feel if a rogue dog came after your Maggie with the intention of hurting/killing her?

And the correlation between a bucking horse and a viciously attacking dog who is out for blood or a kill? Please.

[JackieBlue]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> And the correlation between a bucking horse and a viciously attacking dog who is out for blood or a kill? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I may be missing something here, but...where's the viciously attacking dog?
I'm confused as to how to how this story has grown from a dog chasing horses - no one hurt - to a blood thirsty cur looking to make a kill.

[mcmIV]

Yea Jackie - I agree.... lots of dogs chase horses. Doesn't mean they will tear them limb to limb given the chance.

Disturbing line of thought here.... Dog's owners *have* to do something, ie: build a permenent enclosure, but as we know it, I'm not sure this story indicates a blood thirsty wild animal out to kill horses and children. :P

martha

Proud member of the * Hoof Fetish Clique *

**Give a person a fish and you feed them for a day; teach that person to use the Internet and they won't bother you for weeks. **

[Tiramit]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mcmIV:
Yea Jackie - I agree.... lots of dogs chase horses. Doesn't mean they will tear them limb to limb given the chance. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

"Chasing" and "putting a jaw around a foal's legs" are two TOTALLY different things. I can't imagine a situation where it's ok for a large dog to think of a foal as a giant squeaky toy.

This wasn't an errant mutt gleefully running around horses enjoying the fresh air. This dog DID put his LARGE AND POWERFUL jaws around Catalina's horses legs and after having been pulled off for trying it the first time, he went after the babies. Regardless if blood was drawn, a mastiff vs. a foal is hardly a fair fight!

[Ponio]

Now, I have to say before I begin, I am not an aggressive person. I love animals and hate to see anyone in pain or be killed unecessarily. However, if anyone or anything threatened one of my animals I would do what it took to make sure it NEVER happened again.

Just yesterday the neighbor's dog caught my chicken. This is a chicken who comes when she is called and loves to be held and pet. When I saw the dog with my Adrianne in his mouth I was ready to kill him. I chased him, barefoot and in my pajamas, from my doorstep, down my driveway, down the road and into the woods. Had I caught him he would not be alive now because for the first time in my life I felt the urge to KILL. Adrianne is still alive, though she has several bald spots, is missing some key flying feathers and now has a limp.

Disclaimer: I know nothing about firearms, etc. so disregard everything I am about to say.
I went to the barn today and one of the trainers was telling me about some pepper stuff you can get to go in your gun that kind of "burns" the dog. He said that if you shot a paper plate it would look like you had poked it with a ton of little pins. He said it doesn't really "hurt" the dog, as in leave any lasting injuries, but it gets the point across...So if you have any knowledge of guns and stuff maybe that would get the point across if it happened again. For me however, I need the satisfaction of breaking that stupid basset hound's neck with my own hands! (Lucky for him the neighbors are moving in a few days...)

The bber previously known as 5mgn...

"The sweetest of all sounds is praise." --Xenophon

[Ponio]

I'm sorry. I've just reread my post it it make sme come across as a bit blood thirsty...I'm really not. I was just expressing how I felt at the time.

The bber previously known as 5mgn...

"The sweetest of all sounds is praise." --Xenophon

[SBT]

Citronella spray works WONDERS. When I worked at the kennel, one of the boarders was a male English bulldog who had a "thing" for people's feet...or anything else that came near those steel-trap jaws of his. He would get you by the foot and wouldn't let go. The head vet's solution was to use the special Citronella spray.

Honestly, I thought it was a joke. But when that dog went for my feet again, I sprayed him in the face and he stopped INSTANTLY. Licked his lips, made an "Icky" face, and proceeded to come out of his run and walk with me like a gentleman. After a week of Citronella in the face every time he made a dive for someone's shoes, the behavior stopped. The only drawback is that you have to be close enough to the dog to be able to spray its face. Still, it's better than trying to grab the dog!

If you can shoot, but don't want to kill, PAINTBALL GUNS are another option. They come in high-powered versions for about $200, are relatively light and easy for anyone to shoot (you can even get infra-red scopes for them), and the balls hurt like a SOB!!! I'm talking serious welts here.

Since I for one am very frightened by a loaded gun in the house, I very much prefer the paintball or Citronella spray option.

~Sara
*Member of the Dirt Divers 78th Airborne Unit, ATH Squadron*
*T-Minus 3 Weeks Until My Beval Devon Arrives!*

[vali]

My sister and husband have a good friend and neighbor that had a pit bull. The friend had a 2 year old child. They were caring for the pit bull and had the dog for about six months, and by all accounts it was well-behaved and got along well with the family. One day, for whatever reason, the dog snapped and attacked the child, and his mother, who tried to save him. The son was killed, and the mother seriously injured. Some dogs, and some breeds, do have a greater predisposition to this sort of violence. I'm currently dealing with issues with my neighbors and their Staffordshire terrier (the breed the pit bull is derived from). It's only gotten onto our property once and chased our cat up a tree, but it likes to bark at the horses and has barked aggressively at my husband. I don't think the fencing is adequate, although so far it's only gotten over here once in six months when the gate was left open. The neighbor's agreed to put up new fencing, but so far have not. The only consolation is that apparently the dog has developed severe hip displasia, which I'd hate to wish on any animal, but it seems to be limiting it's desire to move around much. I really hope they get a Golden retriever next time, especially since they have three kids ages 3 and under. Don't get me wrong, I like dogs and take care of my other neighbor's dogs frequently, but they need training and attention, and some breeds just aren't for amateurs. I grew up in Montana, and the motto there was also shoot up and shovel, especially for an aggressive dog.