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trainer fees in boarding barn, messy situation

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  • #81
    Originally posted by Clair2014 View Post
    I wasn't going to comment again but I tend to 'gently' disagree with the statement that training is not a necessary service. In some cases, it probably is not but in many cases it really, really is. Many people are much safer with their horses if they have a good professional working with them regularly and that makes the general barn environment much safer as well. If a barn doesn’t offer a trainer than it seems like a good business move for the facility to allow boarders to use trainers of their choice and not penalize them heavily for doing so. I say that because by doing so the barn will offer a safer environment in general and will look more attractive to people already working with a trainer. Whether or not the facility charges a fee for trainers is at their discretion but it should still be viewed as a necessary service and respected as such.

    Maybe it’s because I’m a trainer and see the worst of what’s out there but so many people buy inappropriate horses that are poorly trained and horribly behaved. This is just dangerous for the entire barn environment. No one wants to ride in the arena or on the trails with these people. It is my opinion that people should be encouraged to have professional help and learn to handle their horses properly – for everyone’s safety – not discouraged though hefty fees and statements about training not being necessary. The savvy barn owners I know seem to recognize this. Just my two cents…for whatever it’s worth!
    I don't think the answer is so cut and dry.

    I agree that savvy barn owners understand this but then again savvy barn owners can general spot good training.

    We all know there are some trainers who are pretty scary and who barns would be better off.
    Auventera Two:Some women would eat their own offspring if they had some dipping sauce.
    Serious Leigh: it sounds like her drama llama should be an old schoolmaster by now.

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    • #82
      Originally posted by RockinHorse View Post
      We all know there are some trainers who are pretty scary and who barns would be better off.
      True, indeed! It was just the generalization that training wasn't a necessary service that rubbed me the wrong way. Lets face it; there are some pretty shady farriers, saddle fitters, chiropractors, and acupuncturists out there too. The horse business...sigh.

      Sounds like the $20 per month fee the OP's barn owner settled on is a decent arrangement though. Hopefully the dust will settle over there!

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      • #83
        Originally posted by whimsycat View Post
        thanks for the insight

        The $15 per lesson fee, i get it. Was just wondering what was the going rate out there, especially among facilities that don't have trainers at them. My main issue with it, was the sudden and immediate way that they put the fee in place.
        That has since been modified to $20 per month per student that the trainer has, which i feel is much more reasonable.
        However, trainer has since been told not to come back (again, actually "training privileges have been revoked" lol) and that her meeting with the BO and BM was cancelled (day of) because of "recent event" (one of her students moving their horse that day). Even though the trainer had nothing to do with the move.

        Trainer has since decided to say F U and attempt to teach at least a couple of her students at the next door neighbor's arena if that works out. And wave whenever she sees the BO.

        Yeah. Well.

        There is a larger point here, OP, that several posters have alluded to. Where do you want your horse-universe energy to go? If you enjoy barn/BO drama, you are in the perfect situation. (And trainer-drama as well.)

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        • Original Poster

          #84
          just an update to the madness. the latest is that the BO has now stated he will kick out any boarder that chooses to ride in the neighbor's arena....lol....whether they are taking a lesson or not.

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          • #85
            As has been stated many times. His barn, his rules. Crazy or not.

            If the boarders do not like it they can move.
            I support equine meat processing as an option for those who choose to use it.

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            • #86
              Originally posted by whimsycat View Post
              just an update to the madness. the latest is that the BO has now stated he will kick out any boarder that chooses to ride in the neighbor's arena....lol....whether they are taking a lesson or not.
              For a professional, you really do love the drama .

              I don't know any of the players or where this barn is. The BO may very well be bat crap crazy or maybe he is just trying to weed out pot stirrers. From what I have read, it could go either way.
              Auventera Two:Some women would eat their own offspring if they had some dipping sauce.
              Serious Leigh: it sounds like her drama llama should be an old schoolmaster by now.

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              • #87
                Don't think its a boarding barns responsibility to provide anything but board as outlined in the contract unless they want to and it makes sense financially as with any business.

                I have been in several very well run boarding barns without training services. I can assure you everybody was suitably mounted and safe. No trainer services where I have been the last 4 years either and none needed. Been in other barns with trainer services but unless barn requires taking lessons/training as a condition of boarding? You still have stupid people making stupid horse choices operating without any training at all, often refusing any offers of help.
                It's not up to a boarding barn owner to fix that long standing situation...other then kicking out the dangerous ones. No requirement they provide it and that's as it should be.

                I just wonder about OPs latest update on crazy BO. She must enjoy the drama and sharing it. I also wonder if there is more to the story other then as relayed by OP and fans/house guests? No matter how flat the pancake there are two sides. Same with the trainer dispute, only getting one side as shared by the trainer.

                If it's that bad, why keep telling horror stories and paying for it? What are we supposed to do? I suppose we are enabling in a way. I care about my horses and would have had them out of there at the first hint of crazy. But others may find appearance and location of barns more important then what goes on, and that's their choice. Just don't complain to me, I once moved to an ASB training barn due to a crazy situation. There always someplace if you really want/need to leave.
                When opportunity knocks it's wearing overalls and looks like work.

                The horse world. Two people. Three opinions.

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                • #88
                  A boarding barn owner owes absolutely zero to outside trainers who wish to teach train at that facility. As a boarding barn owner, I can tell you it is not cost neutral to have outside instructors coming in to teach. It makes the ring busier for other people for sure--would you rather ride in the same ring as someone having a lesson or someone schooling on their own? Also, it takes a reasonable amount of time/effort to get the paperwork done--releases signed, rules/barn policies reviewed, and insurance paperwork organized. I also have to coordinate ring maintenance/grooming around lesson times, and also help clients coordinate lesson times so there aren't conflicts. In addition, some instructors are really excellent, but every once in a while an instructor requires some supervision/intervention--for example getting on a client horse without a helmet, setting up a jumping exercise that is not safe, or other unprofessional behavior that requires me to step in.

                  I'm not the BO in question, but it definitely IS a privilege for outside instructors to be allowed on my property to carry out their business activities using the benefit of my crazy expensive arena and my expensive jumps that are maintained by my expensive staff using my expensive equipment.

                  The only reason I mention this is to help give a less experienced instructor reading this a little bit of perspective. OP, perhaps your situation was untenable due to a personality conflict between you and a difficult BO, but for your future endeavors, you might do well to consider how much a BO might have invested in their facility and to make sure that from the start you express your appreciation for being allowed to use a nice facility that you didn't have to pay for, even if you are asked to pay a nominal fee to do so.

                  Comment


                  • #89
                    In my area, barns tend to fall into one of two categories. The first is a boarding barn run by a pro, where either outside coaches are not allowed (and lessons with the pro are mandatory), or use of an outside coach is assessed a fee. In the latter case, bringing in an outside coach actually costs the in-house pro doubly: firstly in lost lesson revenue for that student, and secondly in opportunity cost, as they themselves cannot teach a lesson in the ring concurrently. IMO, assessing a fee in this scenario is completely reasonable, and exists as a disincentive to use outside pros.

                    The second type of barn we generally have in this area is a straight boarding barn, generally multi-discipline, where outside vets, farriers, coaches, and other professionals are allowed. IMO, it makes no sense to charge a ring fee in this scenario. The boarder is already paying to use the facilities and equipment. The privilege to take lessons with an outside pro (and there is no alternative - if the BO were teaching, this barn gets bumped into the first category above) is included in base board. In this scenario, the BO is not charging the pro for the use of the facilities, they're charging the boarder, as is evidenced by the overwhelming prevalence of boarders, not coaches, ponying up the $$ for the charge.

                    To the point of vets, farriers, saddle fitters etc. being excluded from facilities fees because they are essential services while coaches are not, I think omitting coaches is an arbitrary exclusion, and not a beneficial one. In my own experience, I can't think of a single professional who has been more influential to my education as a horseperson than my coach, and I think it would be a shame to consider someone who is contributing so much to boarders' educations as 'non-essential'.

                    However, the above is my opinion in general, and is not particularly germane to the OP's scenario. As many others have stated, this is the BO's circus, and if he wishes to burn it to the ground - figuratively speaking, of course - that is his prerogative. It sounds like he's already well on his way.

                    My guess, as someone who has clutched the gunwales of a similar sinking ship, is that the OP is hoping enough of her fellow boarders vote with their feet/$$ that the BO learns the moral of the story, cleans up his act, and she gets to benefit from the area's best facility under the ownership of a BO on the landing side of a CTJ moment. OP, it never turns out that way, sadly. Good luck.
                    The plural of anecdote is not data

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