A New Equestrian Center in Delaplane, Virginia?

[vahunter]

Permanent covenants for trails do not work. I have 1st hand experience from a previous *rural* property I owned. When the non-horse people move in, they do not maintain the trails & they do not want you riding on their property. The only way to enforce the covenants is to take them to court. This requires time & money..and causes stress & bad relations. That's why I live in Delaplane where there are no covenants & there are people who love animals, farming & open space.

[carolprudm]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by J Swan:&lt;SNIP&gt;How about someone else? Any other residents want an uber rich exclusive "equestrian" community raping their land, driving up their taxes and ruining their lifestyle? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
It would probably be better than the subdivisions they are building here in Spoty.

[JSwan]

Spotsylvania residents need to lean on their Board if they oppose such development.

I don't think it's an "either or" proposition. The area mentioned by the OP is not in a service district and is zoned RA. If this "community" is not built - townhouses won't be either.

But in any event the result is the same. The land is gone.

"Exclusive" means "to exclude".

This complex would be nothing more than a bunch of noveau riche pretending to be the Kennedy's. Makes me sick.

[sidesaddle]

This thread begs the question, "What kind of person would air a business idea on an internet bulletin board prior to having done any research on the rules and regulations of the locality with regard to zoning and land use issues?"

Obviously these two "partners" are not people with any kind of business expertise.

Maybe this is a joke of some sort...

The silverlining is that Delaplane residents and interested others can consider this a wake-up call. Something should be done now to protect Delaplane from random people moving in and buying land with the ultimate goal of making money by compromising the qualities of the area (which for many people is why they bought land in Delaplane in the first place).

I'd hate for Delaplane to have developement/change shoved down their throats like Middleburg.

[Luie's Person]

Just to add to the dissent: I cringe whenever people mention Frying Pan Park. Personally I think the place/the structures a travesty. And it's located in one of the country's most affluent counties. NOT a promo piece for "Virginia is for horses" or whatever the &*% slogan is.

I live in Fairfax County, which is already WAY beyond Loudon in terms of what has happened with land use policy. Being relatively new to VA (lived here 5 years) I opine it's the craziest state I've ever lived in. I say this as a past land use planner (in NE), and later RE developer (in NE) who's also lived in FL and evaluated properties throughout the eastern US. Every person concerned about maintaining a *semblance* of the rural environment should get politically involved and do everything possible to erode the state level Dillon Rule provisions that currently prohibit the ability of local officials to adequately regulate development. We need to have a voice. The Dillon Rule provisions negate our voice. How many 'masterplan' conforming developments can we endure before our quality of life goes out the window? The proposed county-level traffic control changes to the Dillon Rule that Tim Kaine proposes is just the tip of the ice berg. VA, NO VA especially, needs to wake up to save what is left. If it's not already too late. Sorry to be the voice of doom, but what I see in VA is so disheartening. I *like* to be able to call this state 'home'. So far, I'm not willing. Good luck, Delaplane.

[JSwan]

Thanks for the input, Luie's Person. I've toyed with the idea of making bumper stickers that say - eliminate the Dillon Rule. Just makes me sick to my stomach....

I remember when the last dairy farm was sold in Fairfax County.

The last time I rode at Frying Pan - I almost crashed into someone's back yard after coming out of the water jump. Then I nearly collided with two morons with babies in strollers on the xc course. Then I almost broke my neck when my horse freaked at kids shooting off bottle rockets in the middle of the field. Uhhh - it's supposed to be a public equestrian facility....

That happened all in one schooling session. Haven't been back since.

I agree with sidesaddle - anyone who floats an idea like this on a public BB is ain't got the sense God gave a paper bag.

But for landowners in Fauquier, consider it another wake up call.

[carolprudm]

If you don't like riding at Frying Pan, come ride in Spotsy.
We have ONE public access trail, at Lake Anna State Park but there is an admission fee.
Riding is officially allowed but subtily discouraged on the battlefields.
No ring or practice jumps anywhere.

[SaddleFitterVA]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Just to add to the dissent: I cringe whenever people mention Frying Pan Park. Personally I think the place/the structures a travesty. And it's located in one of the country's most affluent counties. NOT a promo piece for "Virginia is for horses" or whatever the &*% slogan is. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I love, love, love Frying Pan Park and have to say that while the barns need some maintenance, they are much more realistic for rural buildings than the lovely barns at the VA Horse Center.

When I boarded next to it, at the little mud-pit yellow house, many, many years ago, it was much more open. Now, it is surrounded by subdivisions, but they managed to buy that land that the church was on! That facility is incredible. A facility I can haul into, plenty of gravel parking, no need to drive on the mud, I can pay $6 to ride in the indoor, or ride anywhere else for free.

Kids can go to the historic farm, you can go talk to the historians who work there, and if those buildings aren't "pretty" enough for you, then "oh darn".

One of the common, urban, misconceptions about farms and rural properties is that they all look like a Middleburg Estate...which is not the norm. Most real, working farms have older buildings, deferred maintenance, and muddy spots, old equipment "graveyards", etc.

I agree that the Dillon Rule is what is killing the localities that want to preserve a rural environment, but complaining about one of the coolest equestrian facilities I've ever hauled into, for free, is just annoying.

Yeah, we have lots of people who have private courses, but they are not as accessible. Don't host weekly pony club meetings, annual pony club camps, dog shows, horse shows, helping to keep horse shows affordable.

Mel

[Trixie]

I agree with Mel about FPP - there's nothing else like it. Even if you do have to occasionally deal with the baby carriages on course and children running around. You'll have to deal with half that stuff at the horse shows anyway, may as well get used to it.

No, it's not open countryside, but it's something, and reasonably well maintained and clean and FREE - giving me the opportunity to do stuff with my horses that I wouldn't otherwise be able to do, and very, very easily.


Why, exactly would is it a travesty? It's free and open to everyone, and it's never been exclusive, nor did they build manor homes and mini estates. It IS in Suburbia, yet it also tries to educate the public about farming and whatnot.

[Hilldale]

I think the OP misrepresented the topic - it doesn't sound like he/she really intends to build a "VA Horse Center" more like a nice private facility. And if she deceides to hold events then - that throws her project into an entirely different arena - one that requires public hearings and infrastructure improvements. Her mistake was mentioning houses. Fauquier County is in a huge struggle right now - there are currently more "move-ins" than "old-timers" and the Board is about change because a few of the members will not re-up. When you get such a mix - then comes change - look aleady - Warrenton has a Borders, Petco, and we'll soon have 3 Starbucks. While the areas most people see (i.e the 29, 28 & 17 corridors) have much changed Fauquier's rural policies are much stricter than our surrounding counties - you cannot build a Beacon Hill in Delaplane because you cannot divide an entire farm zoned agricultural into 3 acre lots - there is only a small portion that can be developed. Developers are going into the rural areas for what lots they can get because there is a shortage of lots. Fauquier has put their head in the sand for years saying "it won't happen to us" instead of beefing up their ordinances so that it won't happen. Now it's here. But it could be worse.

[Trixie]

Indeed. And at some point the new faux country "estate" residents will decide that the country is "inconvienient" and that Warrenton or Route 50 is too far to drive to go to Walmart, Target, Starbucks, et al, and lobby for one to be built closer... and then it starts. And doesn't stop.


Which is it, DEC? Private subdivision "estates" or an equestrian center? Or are you just putting a facility in the middle of McMansions so you can give them a theme?

[talloaks]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I love, love, love Frying Pan Park and have to say that while the barns need some maintenance, they are much more realistic for rural buildings than the lovely barns at the VA Horse Center. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

SaddleFitterVA, do you know if Frying Pan Park is supported by county taxes?

[SaddleFitterVA]

As it is run by the Fairfax County Park Authority, it is definitely supported by county taxes. I'm not sure how much of the XC maintenance is donated by volunteers with the pony clubs, but the machinery and mowing are all done by county employees.

I stopped in and talked to one of the historians last year, asking about how it runs and they have great pride in their park, EverythingbutWings posted a couple of years ago about Fairfax County meetings that affected FPP, but I sadly, did not attend. At the time I still lived in WV, but I should have attended as a user of the park. I've found the people there to be nothing but helpful.

Mel

Mel

[JSwan]

Actually - there are few public places to ride in Fauquier. The big sports complex that is being built to satisfy the urban refugees and their soccer teams doesn't include an equestrian facility at all - not even a bridle path. And for one of the historically horsiest areas in the US - that was a big shock.

I wasn't complaining about Frying Pan ( I used to event and it's a great venue) - but about the tendency of "equestrian facilities" to become overrun and taken over by non-equestrians. Which is the problem I have with "equestrian communities". Eventually - they're not equestrian friendly. It's just a ploy.

Frying Pan is an oasis - that's for sure. What I want to avoid is a similar situation in Fauquier - an oasis that reminds us of the farms that used to be here.

My pharmacy on Main Street just got bought out by RiteAid. Big deal, right? Well - the pharmacy has been there since the early 1900's. It had a tin ceiling. People knew my name - we were friends.

We have a PetCo. The area has feed stores all over the darn place but for some reason we needed a store that sells party hats for doggie birthday parties.

For some reason we needed Home Depot even though there are several excellent building supply stores.

All the big chains are here - almost all within the last couple of years. I spend several hours a month picking trash out of my fields - all expensive boutique bags, fast food bags, starbucks cups - I can tell how much growth we're getting by what kind of trash I'm picking up.

And what I hear from the BOS is that there is nothing we can do about it. Dillon Rule. That's all I hear.

A developer is suing the county for 10million because they didn't get their rezoning. They'll probably get it. Dillon Rule again. Better pick up more trash bags.

So if I sound a little hysterical about my opposition to yet another developer's proposal and promise - please forgive me.

[Everythingbutwings]

IIRC, Frying Pan and South Run were tossed to us as a psuedo exchange for zoning changes that allowed ballooning development back in the seventies. Development around South Run grew so fast that it never did get to be the south county equestrian center, hopefully the Laurel Hill center on the old Lorton prison grounds will take up for that.

There is a horse trail around Burke Lake Park with no way to get to it without crossing a multilane road.

The equestrian trail that Gunston horse owners fought for years ago and had put in the master plan had 2-3 homeowners object more recently to the idea of horses crossing their property (on what would be the side of Gunston Road) along with a few newer resident bike riders who managed to get the horse trail axed - without realizing that horses are allowed on the multi-use trail as well as the actual road itself.


Those of us who still live in NoVa that are fortunate enough to own trailers can still access the Bull Run-Occoquan trail and are now (finally) allowed back on the Meadowwood property. We can trailer to Manassas Battlefield or Frying Pan.

People who live in more rural areas, BEWARE! What you are promised now in exchange for development will likely not be what you get in the long run.

As others have said, those who can afford to live in the "upscale" communities are not likely to want horses next door, much less walking down their roads. Trixie, Houndsie and I can tell you of the numerous fallen down fences and barns in disrepair or converted to storage sheds in the "equestrian" communities in Clifton and Fairfax Station.

Horses SMELL you know!

JSwan! <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">All the big chains are here - almost all within the last couple of years </div></BLOCKQUOTE> That's because all the newly relocated homeowners don't know how to shop anywhere but a big box store and they don't have enough time between their commute to and from work to make dinner for their families so eat fast food on the way to soccer practice, piano, the round of shopping at the BIG BOX store, etc.

[SaddleFitterVA]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> I wasn't complaining about Frying Pan ( I used to event and it's a great venue) - but about the tendency of "equestrian facilities" to become overrun and taken over by non-equestrians. Which is the problem I have with "equestrian communities". Eventually - they're not equestrian friendly. It's just a ploy.

Frying Pan is an oasis - that's for sure. What I want to avoid is a similar situation in Fauquier - an oasis that reminds us of the farms that used to be here.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

See, this is where I seem to be in the minority as a horse owner.

I don't find it a problem to share facilities. And, I don't find FPP overrun, yes, there are families out there with kids in strollers and people who might want to pet my horses, and do stupid things that I need to watch out for, but I don't want horses to only be something that rich, snobs can do, and that public facilities can ONLY be for those horse people, because it IS resource intensive to have a horse facility. Dog parks can be small, an acre or two even, horse parks, require 100+ acres to include XC or trails. It is hard to justify that for a TEENY minority of people.

So, I don't complain about the non-horse people at FPP, I try to be a good ambassador for our passion and sport.

I do try to work with people in other industries, but there are times when I come on here and read statements like "I'd NEVER want horse trails next to my pastures" in an equestrian community thread, written by a horseperson, and I just want to scream. Because if we are all "it's all about ME ME ME" inside the industry/equine community, how on earth can we expect to work with other industries and capitalize on shared interests?

Mel

[vahunter]

Another example a failed 'faux' horse community around a equestrian complex was "Derby Meadows".....which was sold and later called "Lin-Ann"...which was sold and later called "Compass Rose" in Haymarket. Originally, they had the EXACT same concept as this DEC. They couldn't sell the lots for the upscale price they needed to pay for the upscale equestrian complex they planned. Ended up being a private farm surrounded by houses. I haven't been there in ages so I don't even know what's happened to Compass Rose.

[Trixie]

The Laurel Hill development scares me. Those houses are no more then 10 feet apart from each other! It looks like a sea of vinyl siding.

I don't know if it's nicer then a prison. Or, if we want to be really philosophical, one could call it a different kind of prison. I do like the idea of an art complex. But those houses make me gag. This is Laurel Hill, from above. No, many of those are not townhouses.



It seems where we ride everyone has been very friendly. Hopefully this will continue.

[SaddleFitterVA]

vahunter,

jgrass posts here sometimes and is the owner of Compass Rose Farm. It was a life long dream for her to have her own farm and she seems to love running her boarding farm.

They run dressage schooling shows in the summer and used to (may still) run schooling hunter shows.

Mel

[Hilldale]

J Swan - that developer did not sue because he didn't get rezoned - he sued because they denied his rezoning then in effect downzoned his property by taking his property out of the comprehnsive plan at the same meeting without due process. They've since settled out of court by the County re-instating his property within the service district. that was an abuse of power by our BOS which was rectified. If they'e going to do something like that they need to go about it the right way. Loudoun County is going through that now.