Horse selling etiquette - thoughts?

[DancingArabian]

A buyer should not assume that because they're interested in an item that that automatically gives them dibs and pulls the item from the market until they inspect it. There is no lack of transparency here - an item was placed for sale on the open market. A buyer should realize that an item on the open market can be sold at any time - including when a potential buyer is driving up the driveway after another one.

[Halt Near X]

Maybe I missed it, but did OP say the other buyer called after her? (Not that it matters) Curious how the OP would know, since it doesn't seem she asked the first time she called if anyone else was looking at it?

I don't think the OP has said. Assumption on my part.

[RugBug]

Wow, I don't know how I'd feel about that as the buyer with an accepted offer. Seller still letting potential back-up buyers do a cross country school on the horse? I think I'd be staying away from that seller, too. I'd worry what was going on with the horse until I could take physical possession.

The seller in this scenario is stupid, plain and simple. As soon as the vetting is scheduled the horse is not tried...heck, some won't even ride them at all...and especially not jumped.

[PeteyPie]

If the seller wanted to have the horse gone so quickly, wouldn't they have offered the buyer an opportunity to see the horse during the first two days when the original buyer had gone to look at the horse, but was still 'making up their mind', and had not placed a deposit?

Would it not be more beneficial to the seller to allow others to view the horse, even say they are interested, then still honoour the appointment scheduled, and then if two parties are interested, it would go to the highest offer?

You say, "If the seller wanted to have the horse gone so quickly..." as if a seller would want something else? What other outcome would the seller possibly want? Of course they want to sell it to the first buyer who brings the money. The only possible reason not to sell to the first buyer would be in the case of a living creature, if the seller felt in some way uneasy about the buyer not taking good care of the horse or being a really bad fit.

I am mystified as to why this seems so difficult for you to understand. A person looked at a horse. (Maybe several people looked at that horse -- you don't know.) You called and made an appointment to look at the horse. One of the prospective buyers decided to buy the horse and did so before your appointment date. How would this be different than any other sales transaction?

A person looks at a used car. Or three different prospective buyers look at the car and test drive it. You, a complete stranger, call the seller and make an appointment to look at the car a week down the line, saying that you can't fit it in earlier. Then one of the three prospective buyers shows up with cash. Why, why, would you expect the seller to NOT SELL HIS CAR?

[HunterEqGirl]

When buyer spoke the seller initially this was 8 days before scheduled appointment. First two days would have worked to go see the horse, BUT the seller said someone was thinking about it and would get back to them. Then they would let buyer(B) know if buyer(A) was going to take the horse. No word from seller that buyer(A) had put down deposit. Two days go by, seller contacts buyer and says horse is still for sale, buyer(A) passed, you can come see it. By then coach is away and parties cannot be there until 6 days later, which seller says is fine and sets up the appointment. And it goes from there.

I actually know the person who put the deposit down on the horse (which I found out after). Let's call them buyer(C). Buyer C and I were talking and she mentioned the seller had told her she had shown the horse quite a few times in the days prior, and one buyer was considering putting a deposit down, so buyer(C) jumped at the opportunity (obv. can't blame her). Buyer(C) said seller had been very up front saying she had a lot of interest in the horse and had been doing a lot of showings. Good information to know, just not something I was aware of (horse had only been posted for a week...).

I know either way it is unlikely I would have put a deposit down on a horse I had not seen in person, this is a green horse with a 5 figure asking price that I would have wanted to ride before buying.

I know my views are very different from the majority here, but if I was selling my car and had someone scheduled to come see it five days later, and someone else phoned and wanted to see it tomorrow, I would still phone the person who I had spoken to initially to give them the opportunity to see the car if they really wanted it, if not, their loss.

[OverandOnward]

...
I know my views are very different from the majority here, but if I was selling my car and had someone scheduled to come see it five days later, and someone else phoned and wanted to see it tomorrow, I would still phone the person who I had spoken to initially to give them the opportunity to see the car if they really wanted it, if not, their loss.

Or your loss, which is far, far more likely.

The buyer you are being nice to says "thanks for the look-see, I've decided not to buy it" and the second buyer, who would have bought it had they seen it earlier when they wanted to see it, has already purchased something else. And there you are with a car still to sell and it could be weeks before another buyer is interested in looking but doesn't buy. (And pretend the car eats and has board bills and even a veterinary event.)

It is about being there with your sales item in that one, electric moment that someone says "I will buy this now". A day later the same person will not be ready to buy the same item. No idea if it is changing circumstances, biorhythms or the moon's gravitational fluctuation, but people don't stay in the same decision mode even if they sound completely convinced at the time.

The ABC of selling is Always Be Closing, which means NO waits. Sell it NOW. Because sales vanish if you don't. That's how people are.

Buyers are not your friends, they do what benefits them. Which is what you would have done had you seen the horse at the late date and not wanted to buy him. Buyer B would have moved on and probably bought something else ... Seller is out of luck, due to waiting on you.

You have a lot of experience in front of you before you understand selling. When you are the seller and get burned time after time, it may sink in ... or you may continue to complain that everyone else is just wrong.

Doubt anything that is said here will persuade you that the private world you live in is in disconnect from the real world. But that's ok, you have the right to stand by your own opinion and handle whatever you sell as you wish.

[Coanteen]

When buyer spoke the seller initially this was 8 days before scheduled appointment. First two days would have worked to go see the horse, BUT the seller said someone was thinking about it and would get back to them. Then they would let buyer(B) know if buyer(A) was going to take the horse. No word from seller that buyer(A) had put down deposit.

Well, no. Many people would consider it quite uncouth to say, "Potential buyer A, who put down 10% of the price as deposit, is still making up their mind." The financial details between seller and Buyer A are none of Buyer B's business.

In other words, you have no idea whether buyer A put down a deposit to hold the horse. Likely, they did.

[Equisis]

Agreed that the initial interested buyer may very well have put down a deposit; as a seller, I would not disclose financial dealings to any other interested buyer. I would simply say the horse was being held and I would notify them should the horse become available again.

On the subject of deposits, I will say this- the only scenario in which I would accept a deposit from a buyer would be if the buyer had decided to do a PPE. I ask buyers to make a deposit (generally 10%) when they schedule the PPE, which guarantees that I will not sell the horse prior to them making a decision based on PPE results. The deposit is refundable ONLY if something comes up in the PPE to make the buyer pass (not necessarily something major, but anything that could impact current or future soundness, suitability, etc); should the buyer pass for any other reason (cold feet, found something better, etc) the deposit is not refunded. This is the only way that the deposit offers protection to the seller, and I don't see the point in a deposit that is refunded if the buyer changes their mind on a whim.

Additionally, in the case that a buyer wants to set up a PPE but does not wish to leave a deposit (has happened to me only once) I make it clear that the horse will NOT be held, although I will let them know if there is serious interest in the horse out of courtesy for their time and their vet's time. I'm not going to sacrifice a potential sale by holding a horse for a buyer who refuses to commit, and if I am serious about vetting a horse for myself to purchase, I expect to make a deposit beforehand.

OP, in response to your initial query- I don't think the seller was out of line here. As a fairly experienced seller (as many posters on this thread are), I can tell you that at any given time, I have multiple appointments scheduled for people to see sales horses. Most of these people look at a lot of horses and, statistically speaking, I am not likely to sell a horse to the first buyer that sees it. If a potential buyer asks specifically, I am happy to let them know what sort of interest I've had in a horse, but few ask, and many feel pressured or turned off if this information is offered without request. If someone has come out to see the horse once or twice and has demonstrated a serious interest, I might be more inclined to let them know if I had pending appointments to show the horse, but even this is tricky because many people see this as a tactic to pressure buyers. Generally if a buyer is very serious, they will ask specifically about other appointments and make arrangements to get to the horse first if it is that important. This is their prerogative and I have no intention of calling around to everyone who has expressed interest, trying to keep a list of who called/emailed/visited first, etc. I would be a bit taken aback if a buyer expected me to do so.

With that said, I will say that if I have a long-distance buyer interested, I will let them know prior to their trip if I think a horse will no longer be available. If someone expresses interest in making a long trip (meaning an overnight trip, not a few hours) I will also set them up with other farms in the area that have suitable horses, if they like, since horses are horses and things happen- like pulled shoes, abcesses, and- yes- people making snap decisions on buying horses. I dislike having my time wasted and I do not wish to waste anyone else's time, but my horses are for sale until someone commits. Next time you are this interested in a horse, ask the seller to let you know if anyone is scheduled to see the horse, and arrange to make it there first if necessary. I hope you are successful in your horse search.

[Beam Me Up]

This is the other side of the same principle.

If the seller wants to sell to a particular buyer, and is willing to risk other potential buyers, that's their prerogative too. They can encourage the buyer as they see fit. (Hold without a deposit, offer a trial, lower the price . . . )

If the seller really wanted buyer A to end up with the horse (knew the trainer, liked her barn, thought they were an exceptional match, something like that) then maybe she was willing to wait for her answer, and wasn't willing to do that without a deposit for callers B/C.

[chancellor2]

I know my views are very different from the majority here, but if I was selling my car and had someone scheduled to come see it five days later, and someone else phoned and wanted to see it tomorrow, I would still phone the person who I had spoken to initially to give them the opportunity to see the car if they really wanted it, if not, their loss.

And if someone did that to me as the potential buyer, I would assume that this was a pushy sales tactic.
As a seller, I would NEVER do this at risk of seeming pushy.

[trubandloki]

For those who might be confused by the names in the quoting, it appears the OP changed her screen name from Rjanyk to HunterEQGirl.

[OveroHunter]

For those who might be confused by the names in the quoting, it appears the OP changed her screen name from Rjanyk to HunterEQGirl.

Thanks, I thought I was losing my mind...

OP, it all boils down to who was willing to put up the money first.

DH and I had an extremely nice WP horse for sale once (think Congress potential) with a trainer for around $20K. He didn't sell, but we really needed to get him sold quickly. We brought him home and put him up for sale for $10K on dreamhorse with a video not thinking anything would happen quickly. All of a sudden we had a bidding war on our hands with people trying to come see him, offering deposits, wanting to buy him sight unseen... It was completely nuts and difficult to manage. Finally someone called us and said they would wire the money that day and arrange pick up sight unseen off the videos. We went with that person and he was sold and gone within a week of coming home from the trainer.

Craziest sales experience of my life, but money talked.

ETA: I wanted to add of course that we didn't accept money from anyone except the person who bought him. All the offers came in same day and some were for nearly what our trainer had listed him for months earlier that no one bit on... I would never buy a horse sight unseen, but it really worked out for these folks. They love him and are doing really well with him at shows

[SnicklefritzG]

And if someone did that to me as the potential buyer, I would assume that this was a pushy sales tactic.
As a seller, I would NEVER do this at risk of seeming pushy.

and therein lies part of the problem with selling horses. Some people do that as a technique to push the potential buyer and others are doing it as a courtesy. It is difficult to win. You're @#$#-ed if you do and #$%$-ed if you don't.

[trubandloki]

and therein lies part of the problem with selling horses. Some people do that as a technique to push the potential buyer and others are doing it as a courtesy. It is difficult to win. You're @#$#-ed if you do and #$%$-ed if you don't.

I think the answer is pretty simple. If you are a buyer and you want to know if there is a huge amount of interest then ask.

[heronponie]

^ yup. The onus is on the buyer to ask, not on the seller to divulge.

[Linny]

Sorry, should have been more clear. We could have gone to see the horse in those first couple of days, and would have jumped at the opportunity.

But for whatever reason, you didn't jump on the opportunity. Sales are first come first served. Put the horse out of your mind. Your timing was off. When you do find a horse, there will probably be someone out there, as you are calling vets looking at that horse's pic online and debating making the call...

[Ambitious Kate]

I toccurred to me that the kind of information the OP wished she had gotten from the seller was information the end-result buyer got, having gotten herself to the farm, seen the horse, actively interacted with the seller to buy it.

The OP set up an appointment to show up more than a week later (8 days, she said) and that was it for the OP/seller relationship. If she wanted to be part of the process, she could have gotten herself out to the horse to establish a relationship with the seller, and put a deposit down.

If it was me, and my trainer couldn't get out to see the horse for a week, I would go see it myself right away, if I liked it put a deposit down, have it vetted and get my trainer out to see it, depending on how much I liked it. I couldn't wait for my trainer to be available like that.

If I wanted to look at horses with my trainer, I would ask her to be available for me. Frankly, looking at horses? A trainer who says, yeah, I have some spare time in a week or two, isn't really available to look at horses with me.

[Linny]

No matter what is being sold, it is not common practice to queue up buyers in the order that they call. If I call on Sunday but can't come look at the item (or horse) until Saturday, it is not correct to assume that the interested party who calls on Monday (but who can come look on Tue) get the spot in the queue behind me.
In the above scenario, it is not fair for me to impose a week's time, effort and expense upon a seller who could have sold the horse by Thursday.